Marvel Cinematic Universe - Timeline (Part 3)

Pro Bot said:

Okay, so now I can rub it in anyone's face that I'm right and I always have been and you have to accept that if you're a non-canoner it's a head-canon? lol, Marvel are doing the same thing here.

I mean, I've already retired from canon arguments now because it's gotten to the point where it is literally absurd to think otherwise. This teaser is pretty inarguable. They want us to know it's the same versions. Deal with it.
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I mean it's ridiculous to act like it was never at the very least questionable. I just don't understand the hostility from either side when it comes to the debate. As if the answer has always been 100% concrete and both sides didn't have legit arguments. I've personally gone back and forth on whether I believed Marvel Studios would carry everything Netflix did with these characters over and I would never say anybody that disagreed with me was wrong on the subject or rub things in their face.

Even in his interview Winderbaum says they've been cagey over the Sacred Timeline and now that time has passed and after seeing how well-integrated the stories are, he is confident in saying they're part of the Sacred Timeline. This to me shows it still wasn't as connected or integral to Marvel Studios from the beginning as some may want to believe. Anyway, I accept the shows are canon now and am ready to move on.

I do wish that if Marvel Studios feels these shows are part of their Sacred Timeline they integrated that better. The way they're separated on Disney + is like they want to have their cake and eat it too. They'll say they consider it canon, but at the same time, they want their productions to remain separate from them on the service.
 
I've been part of a community that literally documented every single instance that Marvel have made comments regarding canon, from references that go Marvel Studios to Marvel TV/Marvel TV to Marvel Studios/Marvel TV to Marvel TV, to quotes from crew members from every side, including MANY Kevin Feige quotes.

I can tell you that most people when they say they don't believe these shows are canon comes from complete speculation or distorted interpretations of quotes.

It has been very consistent that all these shows have been canon, and any degree of separation has always been to do with separate studios rather than continuity.

The idea that the shows are non-canon has been a myth since the early days of Marvel Television, never a fact. It doesn't matter if Marvel Studios didn't want a show to exist at one point, they've gone out of their way to explicitly not contradict it in the past. They literally changed a character's name in Black Panther in order to avoid contradicting Luke Cage.

This is not a new thing, and in the actual interview with Brad, he was talking about how they could never get the opportunity to connect it in the past due to schedules and different studios. Remember that the Russos wanted Netflix characters in Infinity War?

In the opinion of the head of Marvel Streaming, Animation and Television at Marvel Studios, who has been at Marvel Studios since the beginning, who is part of the Marvel Studios parliament, who was Marvel's first continuity manager, who is an executive producer for many Marvel Studios productions, the Marvel Television shows are canon.

The reason that it's separate on Disney+ is because it's quite literally not their content. The MCU is the name of both the universe and the Marvel Studios brand of content. The Defenders Saga is a separate "sub-franchise". It is not a continuity thing and it never has been.
 
I've been pretty cynical about this for awhile, so even after the Winderbaum interview I didn't think it was going to change anything. I'm still doubtful whether they'll completely drop the nonsense in dividing the ABC/Freeform/Netflix/Hulu era shows from the Disney+ era content. But this trailer is the best hope I've had since Matt and Kingpin returned a couple years ago. They used a LOT of footage from Netflix Daredevil to set up Kingpin's arc here, and it makes it clear that speculation around the hammer being different is pretty much irrelrelevant. It transitioned so well into the Hawkeye and Echo stuff too. You'd be hard pressed to watch that and NOT assume that it's the same world, and that you should go watch Daredevil because it's going to be relevent.

It's a step in the right direction. I'm not going to get my hopes up, because we still have to see how Echo and Born Again treat the Netflix shows. And if Echo itself will be treated as a relevant part of the MCU. (The fact that they're releasing all the episodes on the same day doesn't fill me with confidence; I also absolutely believe the rumors that they would have dropped the show as a tax write-off if the Batgirl backlash hadn't convinced them otherwise.) But it's a step in the right direction.
 
TalonCard said:
I've been pretty cynical about this for awhile, so even after the Winderbaum interview I didn't think it was going to change anything. I'm still doubtful whether they'll completely drop the nonsense in dividing the ABC/Freeform/Netflix/Hulu era shows from the Disney+ era content. But this trailer is the best hope I've had since Matt and Kingpin returned a couple years ago. They used a LOT of footage from Netflix Daredevil to set up Kingpin's arc here, and it makes it clear that speculation around the hammer being different is pretty much irrelrelevant. It transitioned so well into the Hawkeye and Echo stuff too. You'd be hard pressed to watch that and NOT assume that it's the same world, and that you should go watch Daredevil because it's going to be relevent.

It's a step in the right direction. I'm not going to get my hopes up, because we still have to see how Echo and Born Again treat the Netflix shows. And if Echo itself will be treated as a relevant part of the MCU. (The fact that they're releasing all the episodes on the same day doesn't fill me with confidence; I also absolutely believe the rumors that they would have dropped the show as a tax write-off if the Batgirl backlash hadn't convinced them otherwise.) But it's a step in the right direction.
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I also like to be on the side of caution. Makes disappointment easier lol. But like you said that trailer is pretty clear. I am also curious about how Echo will and Born Again will treat the Netflix stuff tho, But definitely a step in the right direction. I just do hope its going to keep up and it's not just for marketing purposes and actually means something to the series going forward
 
In timeline related news I apologize for not updating. We have absolutely no wifi and work and we can't fucking find out why so shits hectic. And if course it happens when everything is catching up from the holiday. Typical. But for the placements of E06&7 I think everyone has agreed late 1490s and between 965 and 1015 are the best placements. I'm thinking of going with the middle ground of the presented dates commented here: 1491 and 990 respectively if everyone is good with those
 
Pro Bot said:
I've been part of a community that literally documented every single instance that Marvel have made comments regarding canon, from references that go Marvel Studios to Marvel TV/Marvel TV to Marvel Studios/Marvel TV to Marvel TV, to quotes from crew members from every side, including MANY Kevin Feige quotes.

I can tell you that most people when they say they don't believe these shows are canon comes from complete speculation or distorted interpretations of quotes.

It has been very consistent that all these shows have been canon, and any degree of separation has always been to do with separate studios rather than continuity.

The idea that the shows are non-canon has been a myth since the early days of Marvel Television, never a fact. It doesn't matter if Marvel Studios didn't want a show to exist at one point, they've gone out of their way to explicitly not contradict it in the past. They literally changed a character's name in Black Panther in order to avoid contradicting Luke Cage.

This is not a new thing, and in the actual interview with Brad, he was talking about how they could never get the opportunity to connect it in the past due to schedules and different studios. Remember that the Russos wanted Netflix characters in Infinity War?

In the opinion of the head of Marvel Streaming, Animation and Television at Marvel Studios, who has been at Marvel Studios since the beginning, who is part of the Marvel Studios parliament, who was Marvel's first continuity manager, who is an executive producer for many Marvel Studios productions, the Marvel Television shows are canon.

The reason that it's separate on Disney+ is because it's quite literally not their content. The MCU is the name of both the universe and the Marvel Studios brand of content. The Defenders Saga is a separate "sub-franchise". It is not a continuity thing and it never has been.
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I just don't see the need to rub it in people's faces simply because they didn't believe it was as concrete as you did. Winderbaum even said they've been cagey and that caginess has a lot to do with why people questioned it.
 
Pro Bot said:

Okay, so now I can rub it in anyone's face that I'm right and I always have been and you have to accept that if you're a non-canoner it's a head-canon? lol, Marvel are doing the same thing here.

I mean, I've already retired from canon arguments now because it's gotten to the point where it is literally absurd to think otherwise. This teaser is pretty inarguable. They want us to know it's the same versions. Deal with it.
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Oh hell yes!
fantastic-ninth-doctor.gif
This and Winderbaum's comment should hopefully finally shut all those naysayers who say the pre-Disney+ shows are non-canon.
 
Gotta be honest, I'm not the most loyal fan of the Netflix shows. I've watched the entirety of Daredevil but as for the other shows I've practically just watched the first seasons, and that happened some years ago around the times when The Multiverse Saga was just starting.

Before that, while I was aware of the great love they received in their early years (one that only DD knew how to keep until it's last season) but also aware that it wasn't a fact that only because the shows are good they were canon. After completing Daredevil, I understood that it was such a great story with such great characters to just leave it behind. The MCU will never stop growing, and at some point they would have to get to plots related to their characters (Kingpin being also an Spider-Man villain being the main one of them) and they had to at least acknowledge their status in canon at some point.

And I was always open to both options, whether it was canon or not, whether the other fans believed it or not, I just enjoyed the show even if it was or wasn't a part of the Marvel Cinematic Universe, and nothing happened if you hadn't watched them, but I see no point in arguing, the actors were beggining to return to their roles, and the only ones who could reveal their status were Kevin Feige and the films/shows themselves. Now, finally this argument can end, since The Defenders Saga's shows have been proven to be canon since their releases, and the only thing we can do now is wait to see how they use these characters for this new storyline they seem to be building. If someone else still wants to believe that they are not canon I don't care, I just care that I know and accept that they will have repercusion in the universe, and I will be watching the new shows hoping they are as good as the old ones.

(And added to that, I left Reddit lmao).
 
Pro Bot said:
Canoner: "The shows are canon as they were always inteneed to be."
Non-canoner: "The shows are not canon and never have been."

It is proven that they are canon

Canoner: "I was right, I told you it was canon."
Non-canoner: "N... No! They changed their minds."

Can't win.
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Was that later convo via Reddit?
 
A bit off-topic, but actually, once I replied to a Star Wars meme stating that the sequels are canon and got MASSIVELY downvoted on Reddit, don't think about ever going back, I prefer to live my life than theirs, can't they just accept they were wrong?
 
So totally forgot about this until now but where we feeling we should put the Sanctum Infinitum and the earth Captain Carter and Kahhori first meet in the timeline? There's really no information besides after the events of S01E04 and post-WWII for them. I'm going to place the Sanctum Infinitum after the events of the Strange Supreme S01 episode and the Red Skull world as 1945 for now that way it's in the timeline. If anyone has a better idea comment it and I'll copy and paste it there
 
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Starvel said:
So totally forgot about this until now but where we feeling we should put the Sanctum Infinitum and the earth Captain Carter and Kahhori first meet in the timeline? There's really no information besides post-WWII for it. I'm going to place the Sanctum Infinitum after the events of the Strange Supreme S01 episode and the Red Skull world as 1945 for now that way it's in the timeline. If anyone has a better idea comment it and I'll copy and paste it there
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That Sanctum Infinitum location feels like it was in the void that was formally his universe so it's fairly much the present; within the 2023-2024 period What If takes place.

As for Hydra World, undetermined point in the 1940s.
 
selfishmisery said:
That Sanctum Infinitum location feels like it was in the void that was formally his universe so it's fairly much the present; within the 2023-2024 period What If takes place.

As for Hydra World, undetermined point in the 1940s.
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my head canon is while the watcher was repairing the nexus realm from infinity ultron's attack and continuing on with Peggy's story, Strange was building another sanctum while he was guarding infinity Ultron and killmonger in his bubble universe and eventually started collecting multiverse variants to resurrect his universe.
 
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