Marvel Cinematic Universe - Timeline (continued)

Rman

Well-Known Member
This whole thread started on speculation and clues hidden within films. But it's purpose is to lock things down so that when someone else comes here they can see how it all fits together and if they have questions they can post and ask. Like I said before you champion for 2025 on these projects but your reasons are almost always 'the D+ timeline says' or '2024 is overcrowded' both of which are your opinion and they aren't shared by everyone here. I base my timeline on what is present in the films and shows, not whatever whim I'm feeling about the crowdedness of a year or something that has been proven wrong over and over again on here.

This thread used to use what was in the films and shows to present arguments to lock in dates. If we are just going to go with D+, which for the umpteenth time is wrong, then I don't need to be coming here anymore as Marvel is doing the work for us. There's no reason to continue this thread. I have given reasons why both projects are 2024 and not 2025 WITHOUT resorting to the incorrect timeline or feeling like there's too much going on in 2024.

Now before you feel like I'm attacking you simply because, I do agree with everyone here, that She-Hulk and Ms Marvel are 2025, there is evidence in both supporting those placements. And for the record, if say the Christmas Special places Thor after Ms Marvel, then so be it. I'll gladly change my tune. Keep in mind it wasn't until Civil War, EIGHT YEARS AFTER THE FACT that Iron Man got its 2008 placement cemented. So things can change.

But the purpose of this thread is to keep it accurate as much as possible using the final products they give us. That is where ALL evidence should start before we start going off into Gunn's comments (who didn't work on MK or Thor), or the Russo's (who don't direct for Marvel right now), or some random YTer (which the evidence he used from a forum comment is not priority evidence but the original post should be looked at before him), etc. The D+ timeline is STILL wrong and contradicts things calling other parts of the MCU canonicity into question.

The goal is not to make it fit your opinion or mine, it is to present the evidence and get these things locked into their correct timeline slots for anyone to view and see.
I get everything you’re saying. I agree 100% that the final product should be the main source used. I just personally don’t see anything in either Moon Knight or Love & Thunder that place them to a specific year. Which is why there’s been so much debate on their placements in the first place. BEJT from the wiki timeline has evidence for Moon Knight in 2025 as well and I feel like the consensus there is leaning more towards 2025. When I created my personal timeline, my goal was to keep it as accurate as possible, which is why I’m taking all the available information and determining what comes off more accurate to me. If no one else on here comes to the same conclusion, I completely understand. Like I’ve said hopefully in the future there is less vagueness and it’s much easier for everyone to come up with the same consensus.
 

Starvel

Well-Known Member
Okay I know I'm late but c'mon we don't need a poll on here to tell us that we don't like the Disney+ timeline. If people want to use it and bend the details as they want to fit it there then fucking go for it, there are places where I disagree with the timeline as it stands here but I don't bring those up because the placements here are the placements that everyone largely agrees with. It's time to just accept that Disney+ is going to be left out as a source on here period.
 

Rman

Well-Known Member
I think it should only be looked at only if there's literally absolutely nothing to indicate any specific timeline placement at all. It's the last thing someone should look for when deciding placements as far as I'm concerned.
Agreed. She-Hulk is a good example of this. Although, I feel like we’re starting to get evidence within the show that confirms Disney +’s Summer 2025 placement (Jen’s to do list has items related to Summer and the 3rd Qtr).
 

jhed13

Well-Known Member
Okay I know I'm late but c'mon we don't need a poll on here to tell us that we don't like the Disney+ timeline. If people want to use it and bend the details as they want to fit it there then fucking go for it, there are places where I disagree with the timeline as it stands here but I don't bring those up because the placements here are the placements that everyone largely agrees with. It's time to just accept that Disney+ is going to be left out as a source on here period.
Not so much a poll for Disney timeline. I'm talking a poll for moon knight/Thor placement.
Placing moon knight on June 7th - June 16th 2024. This placement has been the most argued about aspect since it came out and I think we need to put it to rest with a majority vote.
@Lebnyx can you please call an official vote?
 

RocketRacoon

Well-Known Member
Not so much a poll for Disney timeline. I'm talking a poll for moon knight/Thor placement.
Placing moon knight on June 7th - June 16th 2024. This placement has been the most argued about aspect since it came out and I think we need to put it to rest with a majority vote.
@Lebnyx can you please call an official vote?
I’m voting for Moon Knight being in 2025 still.
 

Pro Bot

Well-Known Member
Why do we want to move Moon Knight to 2024 again? It fits with both 2024 and 2025. We choose to place it in 2025 because the Disney+ timeline places it after Hawkeye.

It's not like we're saying that the Disney+ timeline is accurate by placing it in 2025. We're saying that, until further evidence comes out, we don't have anything else to go by. It's basically the lowest tier semi-official source.

Thor: Love and Thunder is a little more leaning into 2024, so we can ignore the crappy timeline.
 

Rman

Well-Known Member
Why do we want to move Moon Knight to 2024 again? It fits with both 2024 and 2025. We choose to place it in 2025 because the Disney+ timeline places it after Hawkeye.

It's not like we're saying that the Disney+ timeline is accurate by placing it in 2025. We're saying that, until further evidence comes out, we don't have anything else to go by. It's basically the lowest tier semi-official source.

Thor: Love and Thunder is a little more leaning into 2024, so we can ignore the crappy timeline.
There’s the thing about them supposedly using moon phases that line up with June 2024. Given that there’s plenty of examples of moon phases not matching our world, I don’t see why it should be used as evidence with Moon Knight, even given the nature of the show and if it may have been the original intent. Jeremy Slater even mentioned in a quote that the show’s timeline was left intentionally vague. I feel like this quote from BEJT at the wiki timeline explains a 2025 placement best.
So, the quote which Geekritique references in the video is slightly out of context. Diab very specifically said that they had a year in mind and then abandoned that idea, and we don't know when in the development process that happened (it could have been long before filming began). It's why I'm hesitant to use the moon and rely on what they used to want. However, I see that most people are in agreement with June 2024, so we'll go with that unless people are changing their mind after knowing the context.

Yeah, if the idea of the Mohamed Diab quote is to imply that they thought about matching the moon to the date perfectly... I doubt it, to be honest. The idea is just that the show begins with a new moon and progresses to a full moon through the show. And the show happens to start on a Thursday, then get to a Monday, etc.. They had a sense of the timeline sure, but I doubt they had exact very very specific dates laid out so much as just "Spring 2024" or "Spring 2025" to be honest. I don't see much reason to believe otherwise.

To me, the exhibit dates (and potentially the banners line in relation to it), the Disney+ timeline, and the moon's phases are the key points. And maybe that quote about the Blip, it's a factor at least. And the Cairo sunset implies a certain time of year, and since the question here is April 2025 vs. June 2024, that indirectly is a factor towards the year, since the times of year differ depending on the year choice.

If you're really putting emphasis on the moon's phases being perfect, you go with 2024. This also aligns better with that Blip quote, though it definitely does not seem particularly considered. But I think the emphasis on the points for 2024 regarding the moons has got carried away with assumptions. There's one piece there: the moons and the days of the week align very nicely with June 2024.

But the moon's phases are only 2 days off with April 2025, and then you have the banners line fitting extremely nicely, the spring appearance, the fact it's much closer to fitting it being dark at 6 o'clock in Cairo, and you fit the Disney+ timeline. And I think after Multiverse of Madness, the Marvel promotion and articles, etc. as mentioned, it's getting more important to align with the Disney+ timeline where possible (while still shunning it when not, of course). The Disney+ timeline has also never had anything more than one or two slots off from where it should be, and this would be three, a record for how wrong it could be. Actually, not even - it would be four, it's just that No Way Home isn't on Disney+ anywhere, but it's obvious it goes between Far from Home and Multiverse of Madness, it's just essentially "invisible". We're treating the Disney+ timeline here as "If it aligns, great, if it doesn't, don't care"... like it or not, it's a big piece of evidence. It's just with other incorrect Phase Four placements, it's got weight 5 and a total of weight 100 puts the projects elsewhere, so they win out. Here, it's got weight 5 and the other evidence is of similar magnitude, it just feels a lot more powerful because it's all we have. But it means the Disney+ timeline does have more relative sway with this show, given the lack of evidence.

With only slightly more evidence outside of the Disney+ timeline for 2024 than the evidence also there for 2025, and then you throw the Disney+ timeline into the mix which is important if far from infallible (plus some smaller bonuses: the fact that the Blip is not at all referenced in the slightest - this is more in keeping with the 2025 projects we've seen than the 2024 projects, it's not treated as recent; the fact that the MCU has been generally progressing its timeline broadly speaking since November 2021 and this would be an uncharacteristic big step back in the timeline if 2024)... I feel that while it would be nice to have the moon fit really comfortably and use 2024, it's just not quite realistic to go with that and puts too much faith in assumption that this was artist intention, when the signal from Marvel is it's Spring 2025, and evidence does support this, and the moon is only very slightly off.

I think June 2024 is a nice and interesting and somewhat tempting proposition, but mostly based on wanting something to fit the real world perfectly in a way Marvel have not shown care to make fit before. There have been times we've ignored the moon, e.g. Iron Man, because "It doesn't fit, whatever" - it's a secondary source that if there were more evidence for the show's placement, would be disregarded pretty quickly, and is more meant to be deferred to after we have the time frame, when there's nothing else for a specific date and it might as well match up (e.g. Endgame, No Way Home), so I struggle with it coming first and placing the whole show year-wise based basically only on this very-likely-coincidental alignment of one moon matching one day (well, one two-day set of the moon), which is ultimately all this is (I'm not so sure about all the discussion around it being relevant). As mentioned, it feels the weight that gets is because of the lack of information generally. Taking the evidence the show and Marvel has actually given us otherwise... I still vote April-May 2025. That's what feels right to me, with the most total evidence.
 

jhed13

Well-Known Member
There’s the thing about them supposedly using moon phases that line up with June 2024. Given that there’s plenty of examples of moon phases not matching our world, I don’t see why it should be used as evidence with Moon Knight, even given the nature of the show and if it may have been the original intent. Jeremy Slater even mentioned in a quote that the show’s timeline was left intentionally vague. I feel like this quote from BEJT at the wiki timeline explains a 2025 placement best
He's basically just saying the back and forth arguments that we have here. And basically from my understanding, the argument feels like "ignore the evidence because things changed and that evidence is probably inaccurate now, and let's go with the Disney timeline since there's 0 evidence now that I've deemed the evidence obsolete".
He basically still said that yes, there IS more evidence for 2024 but 2025 is where Disney wants it.
The banner works fine with a June placement. And I understand that we've never used the moon phases for anything else, but this is a show that is moon centric and has specific moon phases in the credits AND in show that progress with every episode Perfectly with the passage of time. There's no way that's a coincidence. I feel like if you did some of the research on just how perfectly it lines up with the passage of time, you'd feel differently. But you keep brushing it off as a silly way to find evidence because it's never been done before without actually looking at the evidence shown.
I do hope you understand where we're coming from. I definitely don't want to discredit you or make you feel attacked or anything like that. I just want you to understand where we're coming from. The 6 people that voted for the moon knight placement to be changed and it's because we didn't brush off evidence that we didn't deem as unworthy.
I also don't want this to be a sore spot in this group because there is some division. I've been following this timeline for 9 years. And participating in it for 7. It's very important to me and I know it's important to all of you too. That's why we're all so passionate about debating our points of view. And I hope there's no hard feelings about the vote. I've been working alongside you people, overanalizing every single detail of everything that Marvel puts out for my entire adult life. Along with all of you.
I might be getting too in my own head about this that this'll cause a disrupt in our little group, but I just want to make sure that everyone here feels respected and threat that the work we all do in this timeline matters.
 

Rman

Well-Known Member
He's basically just saying the back and forth arguments that we have here. And basically from my understanding, the argument feels like "ignore the evidence because things changed and that evidence is probably inaccurate now, and let's go with the Disney timeline since there's 0 evidence now that I've deemed the evidence obsolete".
He basically still said that yes, there IS more evidence for 2024 but 2025 is where Disney wants it.
The banner works fine with a June placement. And I understand that we've never used the moon phases for anything else, but this is a show that is moon centric and has specific moon phases in the credits AND in show that progress with every episode Perfectly with the passage of time. There's no way that's a coincidence. I feel like if you did some of the research on just how perfectly it lines up with the passage of time, you'd feel differently. But you keep brushing it off as a silly way to find evidence because it's never been done before without actually looking at the evidence shown.
I do hope you understand where we're coming from. I definitely don't want to discredit you or make you feel attacked or anything like that. I just want you to understand where we're coming from. The 6 people that voted for the moon knight placement to be changed and it's because we didn't brush off evidence that we didn't deem as unworthy.
I also don't want this to be a sore spot in this group because there is some division. I've been following this timeline for 9 years. And participating in it for 7. It's very important to me and I know it's important to all of you too. That's why we're all so passionate about debating our points of view. And I hope there's no hard feelings about the vote. I've been working alongside you people, overanalizing every single detail of everything that Marvel puts out for my entire adult life. Along with all of you.
I might be getting too in my own head about this that this'll cause a disrupt in our little group, but I just want to make sure that everyone here feels respected and threat that the work we all do in this timeline matters.
I don't feel attacked. Everyone's entitled to their own opinion on the subject and if more feel like the phases should be taken into account. So, be it. I've looked at the evidence and even videos laying it out and for me, it's not enough to place the show specifically in 2024. Especially when it's been mentioned the show's timeline was left intentionally vague and that while they had a placement in mind, it could change. I still personally lean more towards where the wiki has settled with Late April-Early May 2025. That doesn't mean I think anyone else is wrong and I'm fine with the site going with 2024 if that's what the majority wants. As I've mentioned before hopefully future projects aren't as vague on their placements and it's much easier for everyone to come to an agreement.
 

jhed13

Well-Known Member
The night that Steven is chased in the museum is June 10th and the night of the final fight is the full moon, June 16th. I know there's a couple of days before the night at the museum so the timeline will start before June 10th.
 

Rman

Well-Known Member
Currently watching Ant-Man & The Wasp as part of my rewatch of everything before Wakanda Forever and it has me thinking that if we get a reference to Cassie's age in Quantumania it would narrow down the movie's placement. Ant-Man shows her birthday as September 25th and Ant-Man & The Wasp confirms that in April 2018, she's 10. Meaning she was born on September 25th, 2007 (assuming her party was the same day as her actual birthday). I'm thinking there's a chance we're told she's 18 (I could see part of the movie dealing with Scott still struggling to accept just how much she's grown up), which would hypothetically place the movie between September 2025 and September 2026.
 

fuzzyfoot

Well-Known Member
The banner works fine with a June placement. And I understand that we've never used the moon phases for anything else, but this is a show that is moon centric and has specific moon phases in the credits AND in show that progress with every episode Perfectly with the passage of time. There's no way that's a coincidence.
I've also stated on here in the past that the moon is a VFX shot in the show. Meaning they actually did put thought into it when they made it both for the episode itself and the credits matching it. Granted, I know after they removed all the references they probably looked at the moon thing and said no one will care or notice and left it alone, but the point is at one point it did matter to them. If it didn't they would have just put a full moon or whatever every single time without care.
 

Maviarab

New Member
but the point is at one point it did matter to them. If it didn't they would have just put a full moon or whatever every single time without care.

So how does that work with deleted scenes? General concencus of this forum is that they are ignored, even though, in YOUR own words, at one point they did matter, until the powers at be decided they didn't matter? So why are people clinging to the damn moon phases, regardless of what the original intent is, Marvel no longer place the same importance on them (for Covid, for they don't care, or any other reason). Surely what Marvel thinks takes precedence over anyone here's self important and proclaimed 'authority' on the subject hmmm? So you need to decide what your own consistency is...

My first post here, been reading this forum for a very long time and never felt the need to comment before (I have my own timeline) but honestly guys, all of you, this last few weeks has been bloody painful to read with all the whining. Everyone has valid points, even those who are not self professed bastions of rightousness here (you guys know who you are). End of the day, unless it's 100% irrefutable, none of you are right. As for Disney +, sure there are some major issues with it but whether you like it or not, it 'is' the official source so really, can't be ignored can it? (and yes, I think the timeline here is better than theirs for the record).
 

jhed13

Well-Known Member
So how does that work with deleted scenes? General concencus of this forum is that they are ignored, even though, in YOUR own words, at one point they did matter, until the powers at be decided they didn't matter? So why are people clinging to the damn moon phases, regardless of what the original intent is, Marvel no longer place the same importance on them (for Covid, for they don't care, or any other reason). Surely what Marvel thinks takes precedence over anyone here's self important and proclaimed 'authority' on the subject hmmm? So you need to decide what your own consistency is...

My first post here, been reading this forum for a very long time and never felt the need to comment before (I have my own timeline) but honestly guys, all of you, this last few weeks has been bloody painful to read with all the whining. Everyone has valid points, even those who are not self professed bastions of rightousness here (you guys know who you are). End of the day, unless it's 100% irrefutable, none of you are right. As for Disney +, sure there are some major issues with it but whether you like it or not, it 'is' the official source so really, can't be ignored can it? (and yes, I think the timeline here is better than theirs for the record).
This isn't the profound, passionate speech you think it is. And honestly pretty uncalled for.
Where have you been? Where are your contributions to this timeline? Here you are insulting everyone who does the actual work while reaping the benefits. @fuzzyfoot has done more for this timeline than you could ever hope to, and talking to him this way is completely uncalled for. And even @Rman who has been arguing his point for a while on this matter, is always respectful and informative in his rebuttal. And has done his share of research for this timeline as well.
How do you know what Marvel thinks? What kind of authority do you have on the matter? The difference being that deleted scenes aren't in the final product. The carefully placed, vfx moon is in the final product. And who knows if Marvel still thinks they're important or not. But the argument against it is "they don't matter anymore" so he worded his argument to appease to that crowd.
Obviously it's not 100% irrefutable which is why we took a vote. None of us are claiming to be right, we're claiming that the evidence leans one way more than the other way.

This isn't a great first impression in this forum to come on here and insult everyone who's put in accumulatively 1000s of hours of work.
Obviously, we love having more contributors, but if this is the attitude you're going to have, then we're better off without you.
 
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Pro Bot

Well-Known Member
So how does that work with deleted scenes? General concencus of this forum is that they are ignored, even though, in YOUR own words, at one point they did matter, until the powers at be decided they didn't matter? So why are people clinging to the damn moon phases, regardless of what the original intent is, Marvel no longer place the same importance on them (for Covid, for they don't care, or any other reason). Surely what Marvel thinks takes precedence over anyone here's self important and proclaimed 'authority' on the subject hmmm? So you need to decide what your own consistency is...

My first post here, been reading this forum for a very long time and never felt the need to comment before (I have my own timeline) but honestly guys, all of you, this last few weeks has been bloody painful to read with all the whining. Everyone has valid points, even those who are not self professed bastions of rightousness here (you guys know who you are). End of the day, unless it's 100% irrefutable, none of you are right. As for Disney +, sure there are some major issues with it but whether you like it or not, it 'is' the official source so really, can't be ignored can it? (and yes, I think the timeline here is better than theirs for the record).
To be frank, I think you're the only one whining here. It's a discussion forum. It's called discussing. There's no need to insult anyone.
 

Starvel

Well-Known Member
The difference being that deleted scenes aren't in the final product. The carefully placed, vfx moon is in the final product.
I think this is something that's often forgotten, the moon wasn't some accident in the background of filming that they had no control over. It was specifically added into the series as part of the plot, it's consistent throught the entire series and lines up too perfectly with an accurate placement for the series. Now this absolutely 100% could be retconned in future projects but as of right now today there isn't anything that actually contradicts the placement besides Disney+ which we've largely agreed isn't a great source
 

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