Millar's Arcs Too Short?

E.Vi.L.

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Lynx said:
Guys, seriously, there's two more issues left to explain! That's what a cliffhanger is for, to keep you comming back for answers!

Well, if you are a fan of Namor and you are seeing the last page, maybe you are thinking : "Aw right! This gonna rock." Maybe. Who knows.

But if you've barely heard his name before and this is your first exposure to him, as is the case for me, you are going to think more along the line of : "Huh? Who is this clown!? I see a ruined city 12,000 feet underwater that looks egyptian-ish and what comes out? Legolas on steroid dressed like Tarzan and ready to throw down like Flipper. WTF?"

First impression matters, you know. A little preparation would have been nice.
 
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Lynx

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E.Vi.L. said:
Well, if you are a fan of Namor and you are seeing the last page, maybe you are thinking : "Aw right! This gonna rock." Maybe. Who knows.

But if you've barely heard his name before and this is your first exposure to him, as is the case for me, you are going to think more along the line of : "Huh? Who is this clown!? I see a ruined city 12,000 feet underwater that looks egyptian-ish and what comes out? Legolas on steroid dressed like Tarzan and ready to throw down like Flipper. WTF?"

First impression matters, you know. A little preparation would have been nice.

You could say that about any of the villians, or hell, CHARACTERS that appear in the Ultimate Universe. What might you have said when they showed Apocalypse at the end of Tempest? We still haven't gotten an explanation on him. I'm still not sure what you want out of the first issue of an arc. . .
 

E.Vi.L.

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Well, as a matter of fact, I wasn't around when Apocalypse first appeared or you'd have heard about it. Not the high point of BKV's run.

"Oh no, mommy, a sad blue clown is coming to get me!" :eek:

What's up with that guy?

None of the USM villains were introduced that way that I recall. None looked that goofy (which is impressive considering the art's I've seen of their 616 counterpart). Well, that is arguable. But none were introduced abruptly out of a useful context like that. Even Apocalypse had some context. So he likes to wear make up, but at least I know he demands sacrifice of innocent mutants. That's something. But Angry surfer boy with pointy ear... He's really out of the blue as far as I'm concerned.
 
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E.Vi.L.

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As far as I know, Apocalypse can well be a product of the deranged mind of Sinister.

I really know squat about the guy. Except that BKV hasn't followed up on him and I don't think Kirkman will touch him so...

Often I see so many people carrying speculation about 616 to Ultimate. Which makes sense since so much has carried. But me, for one, I only read Ultimate have only the most basics of knowledge of 616. Didn't even know Namor until, well, now. Usually, UU is very good at making reader with little to no knowledge of 616 right at home. This time, for the last page, mission failed. That is a page that brings nothing but a big "huh?" to me and probably to every other 616 virgin who only collect UU.
 
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Lynx

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E.Vi.L. said:
Well, as a matter of fact, I wasn't around when Apocalypse first appeared or you'd have heard about it. Not the high point of BKV's run.

"Oh no, mommy, a sad blue clown is coming to get me!" :eek:

What's up with that guy?

None of the USM villains were introduced that way that I recall. None looked that goofy (which is impressive considering the art's I've seen of their 616 counterpart). Well, that is arguable. But none were introduced abruptly out of a useful context like that. Even Apocalypse had some context. So he likes to wear make up, but at least I know he demands sacrifice of innocent mutants. That's something. But Angry surfer boy with pointy ear... He's really out of the blue as far as I'm concerned.

Then I think I understand where you're comming from. You don't like suprises or speculation. You prefer everything to be laid out first, than for the threat to show up.

Personally, I think that takes all the fun out of it. Namor's a mystery. Him showing up like that is supposed to generate speculation.

But, since you want to know Namor, let me explain. Now, this is the 616 version and I guarantee there will be differences.

Namor
The Prince of Atlantis. He was the son of a Human man and an Atlantean Princess. He was a hero of WWII, fighting alongside Captain America and the original Human Torch. After the war, he vanished. He was discovered by Johnny Storm of the Fantastic Four living like a bum on the street. He fell in love with Sue, but Sue had already fallen for Reed. namor also discovered Atlantis had been destroyed. Namor swore vengance, assuming humans had done this, and attacked New York. Since then, he's shown up as both a hero (On the Defenders) and a villian (Teaming up with Doc Doom several times). The theory is that he is insane due to being a half human/half Atlantean and not spending an equal amount of time above and below water.

I'm pretty sure in Ultimate he is just Atlantean, and he is very old, unlike in 616 (He was born around the turn of the 20th centruy). I also don't think he has any connection to Cap or WWII.
 
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E.Vi.L.

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Lynx said:
Then I think I understand where you're comming from. You don't like suprises or speculation. You prefer everything to be laid out first, than for the threat to show up.

That's quite a bit condescending.

On the contrary, I like to speculate as many can attest from other thread. But to speculate you need substance. A good author don't just spring a surprise out of the blue, he lay the groundwork so that when you finnally get the reveal, it makes sense.

In this issue, I see the cover. Okay. I hear of Ancient Atlantis that was more advanced that we are now. Check. I see a ruined city that looks definitely like something the Ancient Pharaohs would have built. Deal.

And then I see... An angry barechested elf straight out of D&D! WTF? Nothing I saw in the issue supported that last page. It's a total let down.

EDIT : Well thanks for telling me about 616 Namor. Though seriously, I don't like reading 616 characters bio. I tried to educate myself on the subject, started by reading about 616 Green Goblin, and well, that took car of that idea! I was insisting on the fact I knew squat about these characters to get across the point that this introduction of Namor is very disapointing to someone who didn't know of the 616 version. If we were to make a poll, I'm sure we'd observe a strong correllation between familiarity with the old Namor and satisfaction with the introduction of the new one.
 
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Lynx

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E.Vi.L. said:
And then I see... An angry barechested elf straight out of D&D! WTF? Nothing I saw in the issue supported that last page. It's a total let down.

I honestly didn't mean to be rude, but that was the only way I could describe how I percieved your complaints to be. There was substance to that appearance.

There was a whole three pages of Sue, Ben and Reed discovering a King's Tomb with the name "Namor" inscribed on it. They open it, Sue screams, and we see Namor shooting up to attack the boat.

It's obivous that Namor came from that tomb. He's obviously an important Atlantean. He's obviously not in a good mood. Yes, it's vague, but it's still substance. It'll be expanded on in the next two issues.

And yes, Ultimate Namor promises to be a much more intresting character than 616 Namor. Just by his looks.
 
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E.Vi.L.

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I know they see a tomb with the name Namor.

But why doesn't he look the least bit like an ancient Egyptian? Was that cover and these pretty drawings of the city just for show?

Why is he some kind of super amphibian swimmer? If the Atlantean were like that, one would think that sinking underwater wouldn't slow them much...

How come he looks so technologically retarded? Didn't they make a point of saying the Atlantean were incredibly advanced?

If they had found that guy in an ancient ruined Jungle city that was home to powerful sorcerer kings, I'd say : "Yeah, okay, that dude is one of them".

But right now, what this guy seems to be has nothing to do with what he's supposed to be based on what has been shown and said in the issue just before he shows up. Millar got a awful lot of explaining to do ahead of him.
 
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TheManWithoutFear

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E.Vi.L. said:
I know they see a tomb with the name Namor.

But why doesn't he look the least bit like an ancient Egyptian? Was that cover and these pretty drawings of the city just for show?

Why is he some kind of super amphibian swimmer? If the Atlantean were like that, one would think that sinking underwater wouldn't slow them much...

How come he looks so technologically retarded? Didn't they make a point of saying the Atlantean were incredibly advanced?

If they had found that guy in an ancient ruined Jungle city that was home to powerful sorcerer kings, I'd say : "Yeah, okay, that dude is one of them".

But right now, what this guy seems to be has nothing to do with what he's supposed to be based on what has been shown and said in the issue just before he shows up. Millar got a awful lot of explaining to do ahead of him.
You're questions are totally premature as of this point. I don't blame you for having them but we just have to wait and see what gets explained and what doesn't.
 

Lynx

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TheManWithoutFear said:
You're questions are totally premature as of this point. I don't blame you for having them but we just have to wait and see what gets explained and what doesn't.

Exactly. If at the end of the arc, things get left unanswered (Which is possible with the Ultimate Invasion mini comming out next year), then vent your frustrations.
 

Pandrio

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Lynx said:
Exactly. If at the end of the arc, things get left unanswered (Which is possible with the Ultimate Invasion mini comming out next year), then vent your frustrations.
So, you can't "vent your frustrations" on things until the end of the arc. I'll have to remember to tell all the UIM haters, me included, or is that over yet?
 

jtg3885

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TheManWithoutFear said:
Ban you. You're out of line for attempting to tell EViL that he can't be unhappy with how the arc has played out so far. I agree with every one of his points, and they're all quite valid. Not all of us are comic nerds to the insane degree that some of you are; some of us are actually products of the market that the Ultimate Universe was targeted to. We shouldn't have to know about 616 or have a bio provided for us to understand what's going on in an Ultimate Universe comic book. The issue is badly plotted, badly written, and the art wasn't particularly well conceived either.

*Comic Book Guy voice* Worse issue ever.
 
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TheManWithoutFear

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jtg3885 said:
Ban you. You're out of line for attempting to tell EViL that he can't be unhappy with how the arc has played out so far. I agree with every one of his points, and they're all quite valid. Not all of us are comic nerds to the insane degree that some of you are; some of us are actually products of the market that the Ultimate Universe was targeted to. We shouldn't have to know about 616 or have a bio provided for us to understand what's going on in an Ultimate Universe comic book. The issue is badly plotted, badly written, and the art wasn't particularly well conceived either.

*Comic Book Guy voice* Worse issue ever.

Good sense of humor you have there J. And look you even solicitized your fanfic again :twisted: How clever.
 

jtg3885

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TheManWithoutFear said:
Good sense of humor you have there J. And look you even solicitized your fanfic again :twisted: How clever.
Uh... you been hitting the bottle again man? Cuz there isn't anything there other than a whack at your attempt to incite the banning of someone for disagreeing with you.
 

TheManWithoutFear

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jtg3885 said:
Uh... you been hitting the bottle again man? Cuz there isn't anything there other than a whack at your attempt to incite the banning of someone for disagreeing with you.
My bad I thought your Sig was part of the post. Other than that the post was lame. And I wasn't serious about banning him but you already knew that. And I wasn't odering E.Vi.L. not too have an opinion. I merely suggested he waited. His post did seem somewhat anxious.
 

Lynx

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Pandrio said:
So, you can't "vent your frustrations" on things until the end of the arc. I'll have to remember to tell all the UIM haters, me included, or is that over yet?

I don't complain about UIM because of they didn't fully explain the arc. I complain about UIM because the plot is DUMB. They explained the brain body, they explained the healing factor and it's STILL dumb. People are complaining about this issue of UFF because God forbid they didn't explain everything in one issue. There's a big difference between CLIFFHANGERS YET TO BE EXPLAINED and CONTRIVED PLOT DEVICES! You all are missing the damn point that you DON'T need to be comic book 'nerds' to understand this BECAUSE IT HASN'T BEEN EXPLAINED YET! They found Atlantis and discovered a particularly angry inhabitant of it. THAT'S ALL YOUR SUPPOSED TO KNOW!

You all want to get offensive, fine. Then I'll get offensive. Your complaints are all perfect examples of the problem with American youth: You don't undetstand the word 'patience'. Incedentally, this is why most youth these days are diagnosed with Attention Defecit Disorder. It's not a disorder, it's because kids nowadays want everything now, not later.

Damnit, I really didn't want to get into this crap.
 

jtg3885

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TheManWithoutBeer said:
My bad I thought your Sig was part of the post. Other than that the post was lame. And I wasn't serious about banning him but you already knew that. And I wasn't odering E.Vi.L. not too have an opinion. I merely suggested he waited. His post did seem somewhat anxious.
No, that's from the old version of my story, and was revamped to become a sig so I could needle Roguefan about his loss of the discussion over off-site linking. In Ultimate Arachnia, Emma's a bit older and will definitely have a different look. Hey, look! There's a story whoring for you. :)

Lynx said:
I don't complain about UIM because of they didn't fully explain the arc. I complain about UIM because the plot is DUMB. They explained the brain body, they explained the healing factor and it's STILL dumb. People are complaining about this issue of UFF because God forbid they didn't explain everything in one issue. There's a big difference between CLIFFHANGERS YET TO BE EXPLAINED and CONTRIVED PLOT DEVICES! You all are missing the damn point that you DON'T need to be comic book 'nerds' to understand this BECAUSE IT HASN'T BEEN EXPLAINED YET! They found Atlantis and discovered a particularly angry inhabitant of it. THAT'S ALL YOUR SUPPOSED TO KNOW!

You all want to get offensive, fine. Then I'll get offensive. Your complaints are all perfect examples of the problem with American youth: You don't undetstand the word 'patience'. Incedentally, this is why most youth these days are diagnosed with Attention Defecit Disorder. It's not a disorder, it's because kids nowadays want everything now, not later.

Damnit, I really didn't want to get into this crap.
So us point out Mark Millar's mistakes in plotting and writing the issue, and weaknesses in how they chose to draw both Atlantis and Namor, make us impatient ADD sufferers? What the hell kind of insane troll logic is that? Also, as a mentally disabled American, I highly object to your attempts to claim that simple lack of patience and a complicated neurochemical imbalance are at all similar, and think it makes you look highly ignorant.
 
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TheManWithoutFear

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Jtg said:
No, that's from the old version of my story, and was revamped to become a sig so I could needle Roguefan about his loss of the discussion over off-site linking. In Ultimate Arachnia, Emma's a bit older and will definitely have a different look. Hey, look! There's a story whoring for you.
I knew you wouldn't let me down.

Lynx said:
I don't complain about UIM because of they didn't fully explain the arc. I complain about UIM because the plot is DUMB. They explained the brain body, they explained the healing factor and it's STILL dumb. People are complaining about this issue of UFF because God forbid they didn't explain everything in one issue. There's a big difference between CLIFFHANGERS YET TO BE EXPLAINED and CONTRIVED PLOT DEVICES! You all are missing the damn point that you DON'T need to be comic book 'nerds' to understand this BECAUSE IT HASN'T BEEN EXPLAINED YET! They found Atlantis and discovered a particularly angry inhabitant of it. THAT'S ALL YOUR SUPPOSED TO KNOW!

You all want to get offensive, fine. Then I'll get offensive. Your complaints are all perfect examples of the problem with American youth: You don't undetstand the word 'patience'. Incedentally, this is why most youth these days are diagnosed with Attention Defecit Disorder. It's not a disorder, it's because kids nowadays want everything now, not later.

Damnit, I really didn't want to get into this crap.
I agree... up too American youth.

Wow... I'm sorry I started this. I was waiting for some UIM hater to get on and be like " :lol: " that at my comment and then Loki aka Jtg had to go and twist UC reality around. You're lucky you were already in the fanfic buddy.
 

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