Modern Comics

[Zombipanda]

So, I was reading this article on TVTropes about the "Modern Age of Comics". It actually struck me as a pretty solid primer for the state of the contemporary superhero book. They make a glib metaphor of the modern period as the college ages in the maturity cycle of comic book narrative that actually stands up to scrutiny. There's also a romanticized summary of the recent few generations of Marvel crossovers that halfway convinces me that in theory, they presented a strong evolution of deconstruction that's different enough from the sort explored in the eighties to be worth examining. Granted, I don't feel like they followed through on the lofty ideals, but in theory, the succession of events was something that could have provided a solid defining spine for modern comics narrative. I think Morrison's late 90's Justice League was similarly important but not as seismic as these could have been. I think there's potential in meditated, line-wide tonal shifts that explore a sort of evolving universe. It's just about reaching a comfort level where editors can find a way to implement it that doesn't tread on the autonomy of creative teams with franchises, and finding a creative team that can really step up to bat and tell a story of this type that lives up to its potential.

I just kind of find myself wondering where the medium is going (and that extends beyond superheroes, but that's the mode I'm on right now, after reading the article). What is the sum total of the last decade or fifteen years of comics publishing, and what is it building to.

Thoughts?

 

[Gothamite]

What is the sum total of the last decade or fifteen years of comics publishing, and what is it building to.

 

[DIrishB]

Thoughts?

You're overthinking it. Get a girlfriend.

 

[Bass]

I like the idea that this is the Aluminum age in that a lot is recycled. That sounds cynical, but Aluminum is also very useful, pretty, and efficient. And there's some nice stuff. Although I think, definitely in mainstream superhero comics, the idea that it's "college level maturity" is somewhat appropriate in that all the big event crossovers feel like terrible, drunken frat parties that you hope people will grow out of.

As for where it will go... I think the superhero movie franchises are potentially good in that hopefully it will make the comic book industry appear very lucrative and draw big time book publishers into the world of the graphic novel and we'll see real competition for Marvel and DC which is good for the industry. On the other hand, superhero movies could flop and drive everyone away and it'll be like the big crash all over again. But then, there's online publishing and that's doing well.

We'll see.

 

[Zombipanda]

You're overthinking it. Get a girlfriend.

Says the guy who created this.



Are you saying you want to be my girlfriend, DiB?

I like the idea that this is the Aluminum age in that a lot is recycled. That sounds cynical, but Aluminum is also very useful, pretty, and efficient. And there's some nice stuff. Although I think, definitely in mainstream superhero comics, the idea that it's "college level maturity" is somewhat appropriate in that all the big event crossovers feel like terrible, drunken frat parties that you hope people will grow out of.

So, do you think crossovers will ever evolve into wine and cheese dinner parties? I think I'm a little more generous than you towards the concept of the company event, but I'll openly admit they haven't done much to prove that the event comic has much in the way of artistic value. Is that surmountable, or is it always just going to be a garish, vapid marketing ploy?

As far as the silver age leanings of a lot of recent comics, I'm not sure that's going to be the defining trend when it's all said and done. I'd say it's more likely that will be indicative of stylistic transition, creators who aren't quite sure what the next big literary explosion is going to be, who are digging into their childhoods to find a new style. But I could certainly be wrong.

As for where it will go... I think the superhero movie franchises are potentially good in that hopefully it will make the comic book industry appear very lucrative and draw big time book publishers into the world of the graphic novel and we'll see real competition for Marvel and DC which is good for the industry. On the other hand, superhero movies could flop and drive everyone away and it'll be like the big crash all over again. But then, there's online publishing and that's doing well.

I think we already have a contender for that position. Image Comics has been poised as a healthy alternative to DC and Marvel for a long time. I'm not convinced that comic book movies draw credibility or fan base to the medium. I think if comics are going to become more popular and well regarded, it's something the companies are going to have to do for themselves, and books like Chew and Godland are the best option for that kind of growth.

Really, I think any boom, creative or financial, is going to owe more to the rise of the digital comic. We're a hair's breadth away from having a digital model where artists and writers can bring their product directly to the customer, where prices can reach something more tenable for the elusive "new reader", and where these new readers have a convenient means to try comics without venturing into the sub-culture caves of comic shops. There's a lot of tortured talk about the dying comic shop and while I love my LCS, I think any chance at breaking the DC/Marvel Diamond monopoly is going to have to come from circumventing the direct market.

 

[Bass]

Says the guy who created this.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

So, do you think crossovers will ever evolve into wine and cheese dinner parties? I think I'm a little more generous than you towards the concept of the company event, but I'll openly admit they haven't done much to prove that the event comic has much in the way of artistic value. Is that surmountable, or is it always just going to be a garish, vapid marketing ploy?

I think company events can be fantastic fun. Alan Moore's never-made TWILIGHT OF THE SUPERHEROES could've been great, and THE AGE OF APOCALYPSE was well-done. But really, the best crossover company events; KINGDOM COME, EARTH X, and so on, are all set in parallel worlds and futures in order to allow them to actually be substantive on the level that they desire. That said, there are fine in-continuity crossovers as well such as TERRA OBSCURA and THE ULTIMATES. But in both cases, the characters in those crossovers had no other titles and thus had no status quo to keep. But as for an in-coninuity crossover that works? I can't really think of any. The best are simply inoffensive with no changes. The other's pretend like they've changed the world when they haven't (CIVIL WAR, FINAL CRISIS) or they change the world in a fashion unbecoming to the world they inhabit, such as Wildstorm's recent post-apocalyptic event which makes no sense when one of their major titles, GEN 13, is all about teenagers skateboarding in La Jolla.

The best in-continuity crossover I can think of is TWILIGHT OF THE SUPERHEROES because Alan Moore understood this problem of changing-without-changing, self-contained-yet-epic-in-scale and combined a possible future as a dire warning for the present, involving everyone in the DCU.

It's really hard to do right, and it's one of the reasons I'm so wound up by them because they're very, very hard to do well, and if you can do them well, one every five years is plenty. Instead of quality, we're getting quantity and it's just the complete inverse of what these things are about.

I think we already have a contender for that position. Image Comics has been poised as a healthy alternative to DC and Marvel for a long time. I'm not convinced that comic book movies draw credibility or fan base to the medium. I think if comics are going to become more popular and well regarded, it's something the companies are going to have to do for themselves, and books like Chew and Godland are the best option for that kind of growth.

You convinced me a while back that it isn't up to Marvel or DC to diversify what's on offer in the comics world, and I still agree. Image wants to kinda be DC and Marvel, as does Dark Horse. I would suggest that Oni-Press is a much better idea as a contender because not only do they produce completely different material in terms of content, but their business model - only pocket-sized black and white 200-page graphic novels - is completely different.

Really, I think any boom, creative or financial, is going to owe more to the rise of the digital comic. We're a hair's breadth away from having a digital model where artists and writers can bring their product directly to the customer, where prices can reach something more tenable for the elusive "new reader", and where these new readers have a convenient means to try comics without venturing into the sub-culture caves of comic shops. There's a lot of tortured talk about the dying comic shop and while I love my LCS, I think any chance at breaking the DC/Marvel Diamond monopoly is going to have to come from circumventing the direct market.

Unfortunately, people have been talking about this revolution for over 10 years, and I think the dying LCS has more to do with a lack of ability to gain new readers than it is to do with the idea that comics are a super-popular medium elsewhere.