The Iceman thread.

E

Moderator
Excelsior Club
I know. But it makes sense for him to being able to freeze moisture in the air of human bodies. But the writers have never defined his powers consistently and that power chart is all sorts of ridiculous.


I don't even like Iceman and I'm defending him.

That's what I mean though; it makes sense on the surface but if you think about it, giving him the ability to do that makes him impossibly powerful. That's what I meant when I made up the Magneto thing...wouldn't you agree that in the same context it would make sense for Magneto to control a HUGE collection of iron under Hawaii? And it doesn't require physical strength for him to lift Hawaii, so why can't he?

I guess more simply put - what is it about Iceman that lets him concentrate and focus his power to be able to separate individual molecules in a human body and freeze them? Because it's not like humans have a bunch of water puddles in their bodies; it's part of each individual cell and in blood and whatnot.
 

thee great one

Master of TOG-fu.
That's what I mean though; it makes sense on the surface but if you think about it, giving him the ability to do that makes him impossibly powerful. That's what I meant when I made up the Magneto thing...wouldn't you agree that in the same context it would make sense for Magneto to control a HUGE collection of iron under Hawaii? And it doesn't require physical strength for him to lift Hawaii, so why can't he?

I guess more simply put - what is it about Iceman that lets him concentrate and focus his power to be able to separate individual molecules in a human body and freeze them? Because it's not like humans have a bunch of water puddles in their bodies; it's part of each individual cell and in blood and whatnot.

Yeah I see what your going for.



But the Hawaii thing is extreme. Why doesn't he just crush the entire city of New York at once.

Because he's not THAT powerful.
 
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E

Moderator
Excelsior Club
But the Hawaii thing is extreme. Why doesn't he just crush the entire city of New York at once.

Because he's not THAT powerful.

EXACTLY.

The Hawaii thing IS extreme - but so is the Iceman thing. Both are ridiculous scenarios.
 

Planet-man

Well-Known Member
Finally a thread dedicated to the greatest rap star of the greatest decade.

vanilla_ice.jpg
 
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Joe Kalicki

Well-Known Member
Finally a thread dedicated to the greatest rap star of the greatest decade.

vanilla_ice.jpg

He and Iceman even have the same first name.

Also, Vanilla Ice can lift Hawaii without even trying, in between lighting up the stage and waxing a chump like a candle.
 
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Ice

Teh Sexy Monkey Queen
E, when I have time later, I will explain everything. But Tog is right. You really don't know much about the character and because you don't actually read this, you wouldn't know as much as someone who does.

I'm honest-to-God baffled that you actually think all he can do is freeze water, when that's not even the primary thing his powers are. :roll:

I can accept the freezing the moisture in the air, but I don't like him reforming from a single drop of water or whatever. That's about as stupid as Wolverine healing himself from a drop of blood.
Ugh. Wolverine only healed himself from a drop of blood because of a MAGIC CRYSTAL, not his healing power.

Finally a thread dedicated to the greatest rap star of the greatest decade.

vanilla_ice.jpg
I don't know whether to infract you or ban you.
 

E

Moderator
Excelsior Club
You don't read X-men so you don't know.

E, when I have time later, I will explain everything. But Tog is right. You really don't know much about the character and because you don't actually read this, you wouldn't know as much as someone who does.

I think the fact that it is so convoluted (like most X-Men plots, characters, and story lines) that I would have to be a lifelong reader of, apparently, several books just to understand his powers says it all.
 

Ice

Teh Sexy Monkey Queen
I think the fact that it is so convoluted (like most X-Men plots, characters, and story lines) that I would have to be a lifelong reader of, apparently, several books just to understand his powers says it all.
Actually, that's not true. When I started reading comics back in 2002, it didn't take me long to understand what I know about Iceman. The X-Men's convoluted history has nothing to do with his powers. They're quite easy to understand. You don't have to have been a long time reader to get his powers because they've ever barely been touched upon as I have said many times before.

I mean, there's a difference between knowing the X-Men's history and knowing about one mutants' power. It's also different if you wanted to read WHERE he has used his powers if you were curious about an aspect of it. There's no convuleted anything about his powers.

Iceman has the ability to freeze things and create things from freezing them. By freezing moisture, he can create almost anything he wants out of ice. That's the basic, layman term way of explaning it of how he can use his powers. There are a couple more things, but as I've said, nothing much has really been done with his powers that would confuse anyone. It seems like, and I'm not trying to offend you, that all your thoughts just seem biased because of your dislike of this part of Marvel.
 

E

Moderator
Excelsior Club
Actually, that's not true. When I started reading comics back in 2002, it didn't take me long to understand what I know about Iceman. The X-Men's convoluted history has nothing to do with his powers. They're quite easy to understand. You don't have to have been a long time reader to get his powers because they've ever barely been touched upon as I have said many times before.

I mean, there's a difference between knowing the X-Men's history and knowing about one mutants' power. It's also different if you wanted to read WHERE he has used his powers if you were curious about an aspect of it. There's no convuleted anything about his powers.

Iceman has the ability to freeze things and create things from freezing them. By freezing moisture, he can create almost anything he wants out of ice. That's the basic, layman term way of explaning it of how he can use his powers. There are a couple more things, but as I've said, nothing much has really been done with his powers that would confuse anyone. It seems like, and I'm not trying to offend you, that all your thoughts just seem biased because of your dislike of this part of Marvel.

I'm not offended at all. And at the same time, I think you're more apt to accept something good someone says about a character you like even though it sounds...let's say "not right". I mean no offense by that, really.

As far as his power as you explained it:

Iceman has the ability to freeze things and create things from freezing them. By freezing moisture, he can create almost anything he wants out of ice.

That's fine - but explain to me why he is more intelligent than the average Joe X-Man because of it, or why that gives him better fighting abilities. I understand that he can create things out of ice, but that's just it - it's just ice in the shape of an object (it's also ridiculous that he could "shape" something with any amount of detail, but whatever). What is special about that? How on earth does that make him an omega level mutant - on par with Phoenix or Charles Xavier?

Freezing water and controlling water are two very, very different things.
 

Ultimate Houde

UC's Resident Genetic Recombinator
Also, how does this attribute to the fact he can teleport across bodies of water?
 
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Ice

Teh Sexy Monkey Queen
I'm not offended at all. And at the same time, I think you're more apt to accept something good someone says about a character you like even though it sounds...let's say "not right". I mean no offense by that, really.
Hey, I think everyone is more apt to accept good comments. :p

That's fine - but explain to me why he is more intelligent than the average Joe X-Man because of it, or why that gives him better fighting abilities.
Hey, I don't know myself. I was actually surprised by it. But being smarter doesn't make him a better fighter or give him better abilities to fight. No one said that.

As I've tried to explain as my best guest, it would be like Stuart has explained the power grid before. He may be smarter now, and for whatever reason they have put him in the gifted area (I think really he should be in the LEARNED category, a 3) but it doesn't mean he's as smart as an actual gifted person.

I understand that he can create things out of ice, but that's just it - it's just ice in the shape of an object (it's also ridiculous that he could "shape" something with any amount of detail, but whatever).
When he does things, they may be "just ice in the shape of an object" but ice can be very hard and hurt. Especially when it's very thick. As for the detail, eh. Nothing to really go on about.

What is special about that? How on earth does that make him an omega level mutant - on par with Phoenix or Charles Xavier?
If all he could do was just create things out of ice, he wouldn't be an omega level mutant. He is one because Iceman (like Storm) can also start a snow storm that could turn into a raveging blizzard. He has enough power and "material" to work with that he could bring upon the next ice age. Phoenix isn't a mutant. Unless you're referring to Jean Grey. He can be on par because he can be a very dangerous mutant.


Freezing water and controlling water are two very, very different things.
Who says he can control water? I mean, not in the sense as he could make it rise up with a thought or anything.

Also, how does this attribute to the fact he can teleport across bodies of water?
He doesn't (and can't) teleport across bodies of water. He can travel very, very fast in them, but not telteport. I don't really remember much, but I do remember it was shown in Uncanny X-Men #...315 or so. When Emma Frost was trapped in his mind, she somehow was able to tap into his power and do what Bobby thinks he lacks at.
 
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Fuzzy Birds

Well-Known Member
E, I think the best way to get across just how powerful Iceman is/could be, is to break it down to the fundamentals. He essentially has control over ambient energy. So he can 'create' ice, but what does that mean? That means that in a fraction of a second, he can absorb enough ambient heat from an area to make the molecules themselves freeze. I don't think even Bishop can do anything that quick, and his sole mutant power is energy absorption.

This is a much more apt way of putting it:

Wiki said:
According to the laws of thermodynamics, cold is defined as the absence of heat. Therefore, Iceman does not actually emanate cold, but rather absorbs and dispels heat. Since heat is a form of energy, Iceman's power can be defined as a psionic ability to manipulate thermal energy.

On top of that, when in ice form he's pretty much invulnerable in the same way Wolverine is, as he can regenerate any part of his body. He's essentially a shape shifter in this form as well.

But the most important point is that he still isn't YET one of the most powerful mutants. A recurring theme with Bobby is his insecurity, holding him back from reaching his potential.
 
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E

Moderator
Excelsior Club
Who says he can control water?

Well, you kind of did. He can start a snow storm but that doesn't mean he has any control over it, like where it moves to or anything.

As far as creating the next ice age, that's kind of silly. I mean there are a lot of characters that can do things on a large scale if they don't face any opposition. Wolverine is the best at what he does - killing. He could theoretically kill everyone on the planet. See where I'm going with this?
 

Ice

Teh Sexy Monkey Queen
Well, you kind of did. He can start a snow storm but that doesn't mean he has any control over it, like where it moves to or anything.
Yes, I said he could start one, I never said he could control it.

As far as creating the next ice age, that's kind of silly. I mean there are a lot of characters that can do things on a large scale if they don't face any opposition. Wolverine is the best at what he does - killing. He could theoretically kill everyone on the planet. See where I'm going with this?
Actually, no. I don't see the what's the same. I mean, it's possible for him to actually do it. Not right now though, in his current state of power, but it is a possibilty.
 

Ice

Teh Sexy Monkey Queen
So...he can't actually do it...:?
He can't create one now, no. But it's been stated that he can do it in the future when he has more power. If I didn't say that before, sorry, that's what I meant. He could start a snow storm, but not an ice age in this point and time.
 

Hibiki

Really is pretentious, no matter what she says. Do
Wolverine killing the planet would be awesome. And the last two people on earth are him and Punisher. Punisher FTW
 

Ice

Teh Sexy Monkey Queen
Here is why Iceman is stronger:

In normal human form, he has the strength, agility, and durability of a typical athletic male of his size. In his ice-form, his strength and durability were enhanced. When Frost gave up her mind control, Iceman was not able to duplicate what she had done with his own powers, although he now realized that he could push his powers to even greater ends.
 
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ourchair

Well-Known Member
So...he can't actually do it...:?
Actually he can, but only under certain conditions as outlined by the Marvel Super-Heroes Advanced RPG Judge's Manual. See, while every superpower has limitations bound by the ruleset, every character --- player-controlled or otherwise --- can theoretically extend their powers according to the Power Stunt system. By accumulating Karma from performing superheroic deeds, (i.e. saving lives, acting in character) the player can expend those to create new skills that somehow derive themselves from the base ideas laid down by the superpower in question. For example, Reed Richards expanded the limits of his powers from mere stretching to Shape-Shifting. Or when Henry Pym used his powers to perform cunnilingus on his wife. Another good example is when Spider-Man accumulates enough skill so as to be able to use his web-shooters to create simple objects. One can assume that if he spends enough karma he could create an Ultimate Nullifier out of webbing.

So one could hypothetically assume that if Iceman accumulates enough karma to spend on power stunts he could become Bergelmir the Frost Giant.
 
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