Man of Steel Discussion (Spoilers)

What would you rate Man of Steel?

  • *****

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • ****

    Votes: 4 40.0%
  • ***

    Votes: 3 30.0%
  • **

    Votes: 2 20.0%
  • *

    Votes: 1 10.0%

  • Total voters
    10

TheManWithoutFear

#1 reason not to join UC
Let me start off by the reaction of other people asking me how this movie was when I met them afterward.

"You don't seem very excited about it."

This movie was by no means bad, mediocre, nor did it live up to expectation.

I saw an advanced screening tonight. Enjoyed it immensely but still felt it fell short. I thought Henry Cavill was pretty weak. And before I continue, I'd like to say that the clear cut reason is that nothing will live up to the Christopher Reeves original. However, it was an epic movie. The fight scenes were top-notch. I really mean amazing and incredibly well done and there are enough of them. E, you and anyone who gives a **** about the Superman mythology will and should be disappointed in Johnathan Kent. Not saying Kevin Costner was bad but his character was stupid and completely ruined the the entire point of Pa Kent. Russel Crowe, excellent but... too much presence I felt. Lois Lane, like Rachel Dawes was completely unneeded and seemed to find herself in every scene/situation. The relationship felt forced and when that kiss came I kind of felt like "where is this coming from exactly?".

Michael Shannon, awesome, awesome, awesome.

I'm no good with reviews. Sorry if it seems overly negative but it was worth seeing. Waiting on the rest of you.

Lexcorp and Wayne enterprise references but nothing fanboys should get excited about.
 

E

Moderator
Excelsior Club
E, you and anyone who gives a **** about the Superman mythology will and should be disappointed in Johnathan Kent. Not saying Kevin Costner was bad but his character was stupid and completely ruined the the entire point of Pa Kent.

Ugh. Pa Kent is too important to the character of Superman/Clark to get it this wrong.

I'm having second thoughts about seeing it this weekend.

As for fight scenes and whatnot (the review Mike linked to emphasized Superman punching things) - I don't care about that. Superman is intelligent - he's a scientist in All-Star Superman and he solves problems with compassion and intelligence. Punching things is one of the least important things about him. I don't care about that.

My biggest complaint with the character of Superman is that no one seems to get him right. All-Star did it best and it's really the only thing I've ever read that seemed to get it right. It sounds like Man of Steel fails at this as well. Too bad.
 

Captain Canuck

The poster formerly known as captaincanuck65
My biggest complaint with the character of Superman is that no one seems to get him right. All-Star did it best and it's really the only thing I've ever read that seemed to get it right. It sounds like Man of Steel fails at this as well. Too bad.

Not to be a jerk, but how is it possible that only one 12 issue miniseries has ever portrayed Superman correctly? You're saying that 99.9% of the Superman comics ever written have missed the heart of the character?
 

DARKKNIGHT

Well-Known Member
From what I read it seems like they might have overcompensated for Superman Returns by having too much action, at the detriment of the characters. Reviews seem really mixed, but a lot of the "nerdier" sites seem to be giving it positive reviews. Interested to see what I think. I just hope it does well, so that maybe they'll get a shot to do the character justice in a sequel.
 

E

Moderator
Excelsior Club
Not to be a jerk, but how is it possible that only one 12 issue miniseries has ever portrayed Superman correctly? You're saying that 99.9% of the Superman comics ever written have missed the heart of the character?

No, I'm saying that every other Superman story *I've read* missed the heart of the character. I also admitted that I haven't read very many.
 

Captain Canuck

The poster formerly known as captaincanuck65
No, I'm saying that every other Superman story *I've read* missed the heart of the character. I also admitted that I haven't read very many.

Okay. So, then on what are you basing your understanding of what the heart of the character is?

Is it based on the Christopher Reeve movies? Or the Bruce Timm cartoons? Or do you just mean that All Star is the best take on Superman that you've seen and every incarnation should reflect that?

I'm not being snarky, I'm just clarifying.
 
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E

Moderator
Excelsior Club
Or do you just mean that All Star is the best take on Superman that you've seen and every incarnation should reflect that?

This. Reflect, not copy. I'm not saying everything needs to be All-Star. I'm saying that if they take that approach they will have nailed what Superman is (or what I think he should be).

I've never watched any of the Bruce Timm cartoons and I didn't care for the Christopher Reeve movies. I'm basing my opinions purely on comics that I've read.
 

Captain Canuck

The poster formerly known as captaincanuck65
This. Reflect, not copy. I'm not saying everything needs to be All-Star. I'm saying that if they take that approach they will have nailed what Superman is (or what I think he should be).

I've never watched any of the Bruce Timm cartoons and I didn't care for the Christopher Reeve movies. I'm basing my opinions purely on comics that I've read.

Okay. That's helpful in understanding your point of view.

So I'm not a huge Superman fan. The only incarnation of him that I've really really enjoyed is Waid's "Birthright" origin story, which Man of Steel is partially based on, so I have high-ish hopes. I'm going to go see it on Friday with some friends and I'm excited. I'm just hoping for something better than Iron man 3...
 

E

Moderator
Excelsior Club
So I'm not a huge Superman fan.

I'm not either. But I think part of that is because, again, I don't feel like anyone (besides Grant Morrison) has given me the kind of Superman story I want to read. I've mentioned before that I was really into the Death and Return of Superman when it came out, but that was a Superman story that was barely about Superman. That's the only Superman story I feel like I really enjoyed before All-Star.

I think I started Birthright and never finished it. I should pick it back up because I really like Mark Waid for the most part. But Superman is too perfect of a character - it probably isn't easy to write him.

I don't think I'll be seeing this in the theatre. I'm not totally into it, my wife isn't really too excited about it, and I don't like what I've seen and heard about it. If I thought it could wash away the bad feeling I had after Iron Man 3 I might go for it, but all indications are that it won't.
 

DARKKNIGHT

Well-Known Member
I was planning on waiting and seeing this over the weekend, but I might have to go check it out tomorrow. For what it's worth, I was looking on Facebook and everyone who went to the midnight showing seemed to have loved it. And for the most part done of them are fanboys.
 

ProjectX2

Don't expect me to take you with me when I go to s
So... this movie is being destroyed by everyone on Twitter right now. This is what happens when you get excited for a Zack Snyder movie.

Why is it so hard to make a great Superman movie?
 

TheManWithoutFear

#1 reason not to join UC
Woke up this morning and all the reviews from people I know that went to the midnight showing are negative. Like real negative. I didn't think it was great but it wasn't THAT bad.
 

Ice

Teh Sexy Monkey Queen
I enjoyed it for what it was and it definitely had its faults.

The big thing was, and something my friends agree with me, is that the movie felt all "third act".

And the whole Jenny/Jimmy gender switch was pointless. They only ever call her Jenny, which is just a few times towards the end of the movie, and she doesn't even have a camera. She was just another Daily Planet worker. Pointless.
 
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DARKKNIGHT

Well-Known Member
And the whole Jenny/Jimmy gender switch was pointless. They only ever call her Jenny, which is just a few times towards the end of the movie, and she doesn't even have a camera. She was just another Daily Planet worker. Pointless.

I was under the impression she's his sister, and that they may try to introduce him in a sequel. I'm not positive though.
 

DIrishB

The Timeline Guy
I posted this in the other Man of Steel thread:
So just got back from seeing this. It was good. Not great, but certainly good. First, I need to address the complaint by some critics that Lois didn't get enough screen time. Seriously, what the hell were they thinking? Lois is in the film quite a bit, and her character was explored competently and as much as was necessary for the film. She plays a much larger role than most critics have made out, so I'm wondering what film they actually saw. As for the length (the other most criticized issue), I had no problem with it. The pacing works well, and the overall kinetic and dynamic action countered by the slower, more character focused scenes worked well overall. My gripes have to do with the flashback aspect of the film. Much of the film uses Lost style flashback scenes to Clark's childhood to explain his character and give a greater emotional resonance for the modern day events. While this worked, it didn't work as well as it could or probably should have, sometimes coming off a bit flat. The film also comes off as far more sci-fi than superhero in terms of genre/feel. With the heavy focus on Krypton and Zod's invasion of Earth, there was an almost Independence Day feel to it, though I kind of liked that (its certainly a very different film to ID4). The characterization overall was great. Henry Cavill is Superman. I dare say even a better Superman than Christopher Reeve. He fits the role perfectly, managing to combine humbleness, conflicted emotions about who he is, and an all around perfect fit for the role while somehow bringing something new to it. I found him far more relatable and even more like able than the Reeve version. Russell Crowe as Jor-El was decent, and Kevin Costner as Pa Kent was great. Some might still have issues with the whole "maybe" scene, but the film certainly puts it into a better context. Amy Adams as Lois was great, and as said she gets plenty of screen time. And Michael Shannon's Zod was enjoyable, and I'd even argue more memorable than Terrence Stamp's version, though he doesn't really get any great lines as good as the "Kneel before Zod" one, admittedly. There were a few small issues I had, one being Clark finding the suit in the ship that's been there for 18,000+ years, then fully accepting and taking on the role too quickly. There was all this angst and conflict of emotions before as he's wandering the world doing odd jobs and saving people, then suddenly he's got it all figured out after speaking with Jor-El's hologram. I also think they spent a bit too much time on Krypton at the beginning. I understand they did it to help the audience connect with Jor-El and Lara and understand their sacrifice better, but don't think it worked as well as intended. Also the Superman and Lois relationship thing could've been better handled. There's an obvious attraction, but no real understanding of why on either's part (he's an alien after all). That said, I did get the tingling sense of awe during the oil rig scene when Clark saves the workers, and from then on I knew it'd be an enjoyable film. The action is certainly very well done. It gives a very visceral and realistic approach to what it'd probably be like for Kryptonians to duke it out on our planet, ie, massive destruction. Seriously, Metropolis and Smallville got ****ed up! There are some small little Easter eggs to the bigger universe, we see a couple of Lexcorp trucks and the WayneTech satellite, and I'd read there was supposed to be a Booster Gold reference but I didn't notice it. Also got some cool little references to Smallville era characters like Lana Lang and others. The ending was probably the best part. We don't see the glasses wearing Clark Kent until the last scene of the movie, when he first begins his job at the Daily Planet, and it was handled fantastically. Loved that Lois actually knows who he is and she has a valid motivation for helping to keep his secret at that point. It worked very well. Don't bother staying after the credits, there's no post credits scene. While I respect that decision so as not to rip off Marvel Studios approach, I also couldn't help but feel a bit disappointed, would've loved to see an allusion to this bigger DC Universe they're trying to build beyond just the WayneTech satellite and the Lexcorp trucks. Overall I'd give it a 4/5. It wasn't as good as the trailers made it out to be, nor as emotionally weighted, but still a thoroughly enjoyable summer popcorn flick with some extremely memorable and fun surprises. Once again, Henry Cavill is a fantastic Superman, and it's worth seeing just for his performance.

MWoF, I'm of a different opinion in some regards. I though Cavill was awesome as Superman. Also thought Costner and Amy Adams both did a good job in their roles. I wouldn't compare Adams to Rachel Dawes as I felt her role was much better suited to the story. Her investigating leads about Clark leading to their meeting seemed a very organic part of the story to me. That said the kiss didn't work at all, agree there.

Also, this movie is far better than Superman Returns, so any fanboy comparison between the two is just that, and completely off the mark.

Also, when you see it (for those who haven't), do yourself a favor and don't go in with preconceived notions and your mind essentially already made up (as so often happens with comic fans watching movies about characters they read about in comics, the Iron Man 3 Mandarin fiasco case in point).

This was an enjoyable summer popcorn movie, and in my opinion it did a good job of portraying both the action aspects of Superman with the emotional and character elements.
 

DIrishB

The Timeline Guy
And the whole Jenny/Jimmy gender switch was pointless. They only ever call her Jenny, which is just a few times towards the end of the movie, and she doesn't even have a camera. She was just another Daily Planet worker. Pointless.


I was under the impression she's his sister, and that they may try to introduce him in a sequel. I'm not positive though.

I'm pretty sure that's not supposed to be a gender switched Jimmy Olsen. According to this article that character's name is Jenny Jurwich, right down to her ID badge in the movie itself. Jimmy will likely show up in the sequel, since Clark only started at the Daily Planet in the last minute of the movie.
 

the watcher

Well-Known Member
I might see this Monday.




Woke up this morning and all the reviews from people I know that went to the midnight showing are negative. Like real negative. I didn't think it was great but it wasn't THAT bad.

Wow a rear moment in the UC/CB history. MWoF almost defends something instead of bashing in up and down and all around... Could he be losing his edge and softening up??
 
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DIrishB

The Timeline Guy
Also, if anyone's interested, this is the Man of Steel - Prequel comic that takes place about 18,000 years before the movie and shows how the Kryptonian ship ended up under the ice, starring Kara (aka Supergirl).

Man of Steel - Prequel Comic
 

Ice

Teh Sexy Monkey Queen
I'm pretty sure that's not supposed to be a gender switched Jimmy Olsen. According to this article that character's name is Jenny Jurwich, right down to her ID badge in the movie itself. Jimmy will likely show up in the sequel, since Clark only started at the Daily Planet in the last minute of the movie.
That's good then. I just remember people saying it was a switch.
 

DIrishB

The Timeline Guy
That's good then. I just remember people saying it was a switch.

Yeah, people are dumb. Some fanboy makes an assumption and suddenly it's declared an actuality. I thought so too until I'd read that article awhile back (or a similar one on another site). Just annoys me because it misleads fans. This stuff happens all the time, with unverified and ridiculous rumors posted on supposed news sites as fact. It's just irresponsible and moronic. I don't blame fans for believing it, but I certainly blame these so called "news sites" for running with rumors just to increase web traffic.
 

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