Ice
Teh Sexy Monkey Queen
Just wait until it's announced that Jeph Loeb is not only writing, producing, directing...but also playing Dick Grayson himself.
This time they've gone too far. Planet-Man, get your gun.
Zombipanda
My Boom-Boom's mostly gay
As well as Ace the Bat-Hound and NightwingMite. He's hoping to ride the popularity (Hah! Yeah right!) of Frank Caliendo.
Gothamite
Well-Known Member
No, but take it from someone who knows, he loves saying "If [insert annoying thing] happens, I swear I'm gonna' shoot somebody!". He said that on average, twice a day, when we were traveling together during the Summer.
That would be funny if every TV show Loeb has been involved with (as far as I know) hadn't been awesome. Even Smallville was great when Loeb was involved with it. Credit where credit's due.
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You're next...
Random
Didn't **** any of those *****es
Because the ones who have powers over creating these shows should not throw some of our favorite characters away into such obvious crap.
See this, this piece of news in the first post, this will contribute greatly to the downfall of western civilization.
Dr.Strangefate
He Sees You When You're Sleeping. He Knows When Yo
Dick Grayson will probably end up being played by someone trying to be 18 years old (I doubt they'd do what they should do and cast a 10-12 yr old, and focus on the parents), meaning that if the show lasted for more than two seasons, we're supposed to believe that Bruce Wayne would adopt a 20-something yr old kid... Even though the kid has the legal right to be out there on his own.
Dick Grayson barely has his own enemies, so they will be giving him Batman's, clearly. And pitting them against young Dick while they're "on their way to Gotham" or some stupid thing.
If Warner Brothers wanted to get around the fact that Nolan doesn't want Robin in his series of films, they should have set this in the undetermined future of that very series. That way it would be Robin, AS Robin, in Gotham City, but keeping Bruce in the background have him rarely (if ever) show up. Alfred would be around, and the traditional Bat-Villains would make sense. Plus they could build up Barbara Gordon's character and then, maybe even, if the show was any good, several years down the road, have him get fired, and put Jason Todd in the spotlight, allowing Dick to become Nightwing. But the series should be assumed to be connected to the movies, taking the lead on their interpretations of the villains as they've appeared so far, and using the series to cover the more rediculous elements that simply wouldn't work in the Nolanverse on the big screen.
Dick Grayson barely has his own enemies, so they will be giving him Batman's, clearly. And pitting them against young Dick while they're "on their way to Gotham" or some stupid thing.
If Warner Brothers wanted to get around the fact that Nolan doesn't want Robin in his series of films, they should have set this in the undetermined future of that very series. That way it would be Robin, AS Robin, in Gotham City, but keeping Bruce in the background have him rarely (if ever) show up. Alfred would be around, and the traditional Bat-Villains would make sense. Plus they could build up Barbara Gordon's character and then, maybe even, if the show was any good, several years down the road, have him get fired, and put Jason Todd in the spotlight, allowing Dick to become Nightwing. But the series should be assumed to be connected to the movies, taking the lead on their interpretations of the villains as they've appeared so far, and using the series to cover the more rediculous elements that simply wouldn't work in the Nolanverse on the big screen.
This sounds dumb. If they wanted to do another show like smallville why not do a spin-off with the flash from Smallville or How about the long rumoured "Metropolis" with some of the Smallville cast and Tom in the suit
Yeah, but we might get some good "Dick" jokes though.
Ice
Teh Sexy Monkey Queen
Smallville has always been crap from the start.
Zombipanda
My Boom-Boom's mostly gay
Truth
Random
Didn't **** any of those *****es
When It started it at least shown potential to be great. This, none at all.
Though let me say, if they want to do a grayson show, separate almost all ties from Batman. Don't make it a "oh day he will.. blah blah blah" crap. Make it about a kid whose pulled into fighting crime, starting as a sort of neighborhood defender and later becoming even more.
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Ninja4peace
Well-Known Member
This is a great thread - I love that if we carry on like this a few more pages we'll have a complete script for an alternative pilot.
The pilot will be alright but prob not good enough to get a series. Same as Aquaman, I'm surprised that's not been mentioned already. I'd like for them to keep doing this tho, if in a few years time we just had a dozen pilot episodes each showing a smallville equivalent of the justice leaguers. I dunno it'd be a nice collection i guess.
I'd sure like to see what Hal Jordan was like as a teenager...or the Question or some lesser known characters (but then I suppose that defeats the point of a smallville like show - the public has to know who this person will be when they grow up, I don't know if Flash, GL or WW are recognisable enough)
The pilot will be alright but prob not good enough to get a series. Same as Aquaman, I'm surprised that's not been mentioned already. I'd like for them to keep doing this tho, if in a few years time we just had a dozen pilot episodes each showing a smallville equivalent of the justice leaguers. I dunno it'd be a nice collection i guess.
I'd sure like to see what Hal Jordan was like as a teenager...or the Question or some lesser known characters (but then I suppose that defeats the point of a smallville like show - the public has to know who this person will be when they grow up, I don't know if Flash, GL or WW are recognisable enough)
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Iceshadow
Well-Known Member
Isn't that the plot to Kick-***?
Zombipanda
My Boom-Boom's mostly gay
I can see how this could work. It won't work. But it could.
Ultimate Houde
UC's Resident Genetic Recombinator
I can't wait for the shwo Bucky to premier on Fox. It's about a kid who, in ten years, will idolize an American Super Soldier.
Zombipanda
My Boom-Boom's mostly gay
So, I definitely think the idea is salvageable. It's about finding what makes Dick Grayson unique, stripped away from the Batman mythology. Don't worry about who he's going to become. And I can only come back to two things. The first is the identity of Robin as being derived from Robin Hood. Dick chooses a persona that's a vibrant and colorful counterpoint to Batman. The second is the idea of Dick Grayson being the first of the second generation heroes, the first teenaged sidekick, the vanguard of the superhero generation. I like the idea throughout the DC Universe of Batman and Superman ushering in this new era of rapid societal change. So, while Dick Grayson's kicking it at the traveling circus, rumors have just started about some sort of monster stalking the criminal element of Gotham, and a red and blue angel streaking through Metropolis, helping those in need. He grew up in Gotham but, at a young age, his family settled into a nomadic lifestyle for reasons he doesn't entirely understand. And this type of lifestyle means that, instead of relying on second-hand Batman villains to tell your stories (although there'd certainly be a few of those), you can use the genesis of the modern DC(TV) Universe as your principal conceit. He encounters various criminal and heroic elements familiar to the comic fans while they're still in the stages of their infancy. So the circus brings him to Keystone City, where a group of blue collar career criminals using home-made, stolen, or otherwise acquired technology have unionized. The circus is forced to hunker down outside Hub City, a burnt-out husk of a town that's suffered through a deadly earthquake and collapsed into corruption and rioting, after their funds go dry. And Dick comes under the wing of Vic Sage, a vigilante reporter trying to stymie the implosion of the city. The circus visits Star City where irresponsible young playboy Ollie Queen plays mayor by day and hero by night. Early on he tussles with Killer Croc, a malformed ex-con who works in the circus' freak show. And later, we introduce Harleen Quinzel, the unbalanced grad student of Dr. Leslie Tompkins. Rather than making her a Joker lackey, we introduce her as the foil to Grayson, independent of the Joker/Batman rivalry. Ozzie Cobblepot is a rich, young eccentric who thought he'd buy himself the spot as Prince of Gotham's underworld. The ruling Mafia families rode him out on a rail, and now he perches in Bludhaven as a shady nightclub owner. He sees the actions of this "Batman" completely overturning the mafia rules, and he's just waiting to swoop in as a new breed of mobster, to fill in the vacuum that the Batman's war on crime is creating. Cheshire might make a good villain too. And the thread arching through the series as a whole is the rise of Intergang, a corporate-modeled criminal empire ruthlessly pursuing franchises in the world's major cities, each one catering to the particular "flavor" of the city. They frequently use an organization called the League of Assassins (led by Lady Shiva) as their muscle. Ulysses Armstrong (The General) becomes another recurring villain, a smooth southern boy who was raised by a war veteran father obsessed with Civil War reenactment. He's a savante with military theory, and Intergang is using him to train and organize the various thugs and criminal elements in the cities that they're seizing.
But at the heart of it, naturally, is the maturation of Dick Grayson. At the start of it, he's an irascible, adventurous kid, sick of the nomadic lifestyle, living on the fringes of the real world. The rumors of "heroes" are something he latches onto, and what sends him diving into adventures. He's an acrobat who's been learning to use the bow and arrow from Mia Dearden, the daughter of the circus' resident sharpshooter. And early on, he saves a girl at the circus from an assault. That would be the introduction of Leslie Thompkins and Stephanie Brown Thompkins. Leslie is a social psychologist who's tagging along with the circus for research into a book. Stephanie's her daughter, who Dick saves. Harleen gets introduced as her grad student further down the line. Dick loves the thrill and he decides to don a Robin Hood inspired costumed identity. It basically amounts to a slick red hood and an archery bow. His "Merry Men" are just his group of friends, all the similarly aged kids living in the traveling circus. Stephanie and Mia form a love triangle with Dick. Mia (Spoiler) is the daughter of Roy Harper. A Gulf War veteran sharpshooter, Roy suffers from post-traumatic stress disorder, which was only compounded by the death of Mia's mother (who's maiden name she took to honor her). His dependency on prescribed drugs has developed into a crippling heroin addiction, and now the two of them live hand-to-mouth with the circus. Mia fills in for him at the show more often than not. Danny Brickwell (Brick) is the son of the circus' resident strong man, Dick's Friar Tuck. And Jason Todd is the dangerous, street-savvy drifter-turned-gear-monkey who mostly hangs out with them out of interest in Mia. The story isn't about "how he'll become the kid that will become Robin once Batman teaches him how to be Robin". The story would be building towards the inevitable tragedy of his parents and his meeting with Batman, but by the time he gets there, he's already a Robin (Red Robin is the name I'd choose, although it might be more alluded to rather than tagged out right) by the time Batman meets him, either at the end of the series, or at a major season transition, after which the series might change direction to become a Gotham-based, Bat-verse centered series. The transition of him meeting Batman isn't about him "becoming Robin". It's about him closing the story of the wandering youth. What the death of his parents and the epic meeting signals is the end of roving adolescence. Rather than being a care-free youth caught up in the thrill of crime fighting, he finally finds himself a home in Gotham and a mission grounded in responsibility, rather than youthful thrill-seeking. As the series builds, the circus slowly progresses to Gotham, and the pieces come together of the dark mystery that's kept the Graysons on the move all this time, and the inevitable tragedy of the parents' death. Grayson's father was the Crimson Avenger in the 70's, the vigilante who inspired Batman, and who tangled with a sadistic cult leader known as the Mad Monk. Grayson built a family, and when the Monk returned, he fled with his new family. Now the Monk is out for his blood, and tied into the hierarchy of Intergang. The finale being built to is the final reckoning of the senior Grayson, and Dick's reclamation of his legacy. The story's about Dick Grayson's growing up, and so the meeting with Batman is decidedly different. Dick grows up in the shadow of these great heroes, but he's only behind them by a couple of steps, just a few years younger than Batman. And by the time of their meeting, he's already developed into a daredevil in his own right. The meeting and the tutelage changes him, but it doesn't take Batman to bring about the origin of Robin. He grows up on his own. Batman's just the end cap to his journey. He doesn't become a "sidekick". He becomes a protege.
Dick's value in the DC Universe is being a sort of lynch-pin, the guy who's met everybody, who's been around and has connections throughout the community. His value as Robin is as a generally upbeat yet street level counterpoint to the brooding machismo of Batman. So what you need to do is strip the excess Bat-elements of his past and just pursue these two beats at full force. Focus on "Robin" rather than "Batman & Robin".
It could work. Just don't call him "DJ". That's retarded.
But at the heart of it, naturally, is the maturation of Dick Grayson. At the start of it, he's an irascible, adventurous kid, sick of the nomadic lifestyle, living on the fringes of the real world. The rumors of "heroes" are something he latches onto, and what sends him diving into adventures. He's an acrobat who's been learning to use the bow and arrow from Mia Dearden, the daughter of the circus' resident sharpshooter. And early on, he saves a girl at the circus from an assault. That would be the introduction of Leslie Thompkins and Stephanie Brown Thompkins. Leslie is a social psychologist who's tagging along with the circus for research into a book. Stephanie's her daughter, who Dick saves. Harleen gets introduced as her grad student further down the line. Dick loves the thrill and he decides to don a Robin Hood inspired costumed identity. It basically amounts to a slick red hood and an archery bow. His "Merry Men" are just his group of friends, all the similarly aged kids living in the traveling circus. Stephanie and Mia form a love triangle with Dick. Mia (Spoiler) is the daughter of Roy Harper. A Gulf War veteran sharpshooter, Roy suffers from post-traumatic stress disorder, which was only compounded by the death of Mia's mother (who's maiden name she took to honor her). His dependency on prescribed drugs has developed into a crippling heroin addiction, and now the two of them live hand-to-mouth with the circus. Mia fills in for him at the show more often than not. Danny Brickwell (Brick) is the son of the circus' resident strong man, Dick's Friar Tuck. And Jason Todd is the dangerous, street-savvy drifter-turned-gear-monkey who mostly hangs out with them out of interest in Mia. The story isn't about "how he'll become the kid that will become Robin once Batman teaches him how to be Robin". The story would be building towards the inevitable tragedy of his parents and his meeting with Batman, but by the time he gets there, he's already a Robin (Red Robin is the name I'd choose, although it might be more alluded to rather than tagged out right) by the time Batman meets him, either at the end of the series, or at a major season transition, after which the series might change direction to become a Gotham-based, Bat-verse centered series. The transition of him meeting Batman isn't about him "becoming Robin". It's about him closing the story of the wandering youth. What the death of his parents and the epic meeting signals is the end of roving adolescence. Rather than being a care-free youth caught up in the thrill of crime fighting, he finally finds himself a home in Gotham and a mission grounded in responsibility, rather than youthful thrill-seeking. As the series builds, the circus slowly progresses to Gotham, and the pieces come together of the dark mystery that's kept the Graysons on the move all this time, and the inevitable tragedy of the parents' death. Grayson's father was the Crimson Avenger in the 70's, the vigilante who inspired Batman, and who tangled with a sadistic cult leader known as the Mad Monk. Grayson built a family, and when the Monk returned, he fled with his new family. Now the Monk is out for his blood, and tied into the hierarchy of Intergang. The finale being built to is the final reckoning of the senior Grayson, and Dick's reclamation of his legacy. The story's about Dick Grayson's growing up, and so the meeting with Batman is decidedly different. Dick grows up in the shadow of these great heroes, but he's only behind them by a couple of steps, just a few years younger than Batman. And by the time of their meeting, he's already developed into a daredevil in his own right. The meeting and the tutelage changes him, but it doesn't take Batman to bring about the origin of Robin. He grows up on his own. Batman's just the end cap to his journey. He doesn't become a "sidekick". He becomes a protege.
Dick's value in the DC Universe is being a sort of lynch-pin, the guy who's met everybody, who's been around and has connections throughout the community. His value as Robin is as a generally upbeat yet street level counterpoint to the brooding machismo of Batman. So what you need to do is strip the excess Bat-elements of his past and just pursue these two beats at full force. Focus on "Robin" rather than "Batman & Robin".
It could work. Just don't call him "DJ". That's retarded.
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Gemini
Well-Known Member
I think it would have been alot more interesting to have Dick Grayson after Batman
yes I'm thinking a Nightwing T.V. show
The problem with Smallvillizing Robin, is that before Batman, he was absolutley nothing special
Okay, I don't know much about Robin you could probably guess that, but still.
yes I'm thinking a Nightwing T.V. show
The problem with Smallvillizing Robin, is that before Batman, he was absolutley nothing special
Okay, I don't know much about Robin you could probably guess that, but still.
