DreamMovie #17- I am the Vengeance, I am the Knight...


Well-Known Member
Aug 3, 2005
1. The winner of this round becomes the moderator of the next round and gets to choose the subject for the next round. Winner may also declare whether it is animated or a live-action.

2. You may use actors who have played a role before, but only if it's a sequel/prequel/requel, though you'll have to describe your new plot.

3. After the declared time period, the round will be declared closed and people may vote via PM to the moderator, who will declare a winner. Like the Ultimatization Game, you CANNOT vote for yourself.

4. This is open for two weeks, but I may extend for another week if people need more time.

So for your eyes only, you must continue on in the shoes of Christopher Nolan and bring his masterpiece to a close. You must complete...

BATMAN: The Final Installment​

Or installments if you will. You have two weeks, this better be good.

Round Special Rules--

1. You must continue on in the stand of the original two films in Christopher Nolan's series.
2. You cannot recast any of the main characters with the exception of the Joker, if you choose to use him.
3. You must provide a theme for this film, as Begins had the theme of fear and the Dark Knight had the theme of escalation.
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Man, I've already got most of mine typed out. I just need to sprinkle up the plot a little bit.
I have bits of a cast but not a plot. I don't know how to follow on from The Dark Knight so I'll probably just do little ideas.

Guy Pearce as The Riddler. Rosario Dawson as Catwoman. Phillip Seymour Hoffman as Oswald Cobblepot. Kevin Durand as Bane.
The Dark Detective

At it's heart, the film would be a noir story. The Batman is on the run from the (still corrupt on many levels) Gotham Police. He's being tracked by a scrappy PI and being played by a femme fatale love interest with questionable allegiances, all in the shadow of a vast criminal conspiracy. At the heart of the story is the identity of Bruce Wayne. The detective is seeking the man behind the bat mask, while the looming criminal threat is looking to house themselves in the skeleton of Wayne Enterprises. The young Bruce Wayne grew up to be Batman, and "Bruce Wayne" became a shell that housed him. This movie is about how he reclaims the identity of Bruce, reforms the tarnished philanthropic reputation of his family, and uses his considerable wealth and mind to strike at the heart of crime in the city: poverty and the gross social disparity between the classes. The film would take a critical eye to Bruce Wayne, who epitomizes the real evil of Gotham, the social elite who squander and fritter away their wealth and influence on foppishness while the masses go hungry. One of the things I really liked about the Dark Knight was how it maintained the tone of Batman Begins while being an entirely different kind of film. It avoided the comic movie pitfall of falling into a formula, and TDK felt, in large part, like a crime thriller in the mode of Heat or Ronin. The sequel would similarly carve out a niche of its own, by blending together the themes of urban depression and disparity that resonate at the heart of film noir.

Adewale Akinnuoye-Agbaje is Bane, the de facto dictator of a former Spanish prison colony called Santa Prisca. The descendant of a slave, raised under a brutally oppressive, cartel-controlled regime, he spent the better part of his life in jail. He wore the skull mask to cover his identity as a mugger and thief on the streets before working his way up the ladder of the illegal drug barons, who made a killing on the drug trade and treated the citizens essentially as slaves, and served as the puppeteers of the government's military. Bane took them down one by one, then stepped in as dictator and gave the land back to the people, but maintained steady production of drugs (mostly farmed coca turned into cocaine and chemically produced steroids) for import into the United States, primarily Gotham City. He's a foil to Bruce Wayne, as a man who made it his mission to wipe out organized crime in his homeland, but when the threat was extinguished, he stepped into dictatorship, a personification of the ideal of the Roman consul (which was actually referenced to in TDK). The drug trade seems of actual benefit to his people, feeding them on the misfortune and addiction of Gotham City. There's the ethical questions of import/export and treaty management if you wanted to pursue that, but even more importantly, there's the ideological comparison to Bruce Wayne and Bane. One devotes his vast inherited fortune into a military campaign on the streets of the city, squandering the positive opportunities for philanthropic and social interest that a more prominent Bruce Wayne could inject into the city, while the other fosters the health and wealth of his people through a black market economy. Agbaje is perfect for the role. His most positive quality is the intensity of all his roles (and he's a method actor in much the same way Ledger was), which is essential for a character that serves as the foil to Bruce Wayne - driven, uncompromising, and physically terrifying. He's a juicer.


The Joker's legacy is the revolt of the younger working class, sons of factory men and mill workers and dock workers, youth who see nothing but a dead end life and zero opportunities for their future. If you want a blueprint, all you need to do is look at the Boston hardcore scene and magnify it by about ten. They're disillusioned youth cynical to all governments, pissed off at the wide margin of wealth maintained by the city's upper crust, and they just say **** this. **** the world. They put on their war paint and they loot and they murder and they destroy the false icons of the city. Rich socialite Bruce Wayne is the epitome of the lifestyle they loathe. And the Joker is their Che Guevara, merely a presence in this movie, a ghost locked securely away, but his spirit ripples through the city, an icon for them to superimpose their anarchist ideals over. Harley Quinn is the de facto ringleader of the chaotically nebulous movement. A formerly brilliant psychology grad student with a questionably dark history and now a total obsession with the Joker. She is both manipulator and manipulated, using her brilliant experience with gang youth and cult mentality to twist her acolytes however she needs, while being at the mercy of her own personal insecurities and obsession. She'd be played by Naomi Watts, who's a simply brilliant actress and absolutely has the range to portray the subtle insecurities of the character while also coming across as terrifyingly lucid.


Christina Ricci is Selina Kyle, thief and corporate saboteur, who's only identified offhand as a "Catwoman" not because of any weird fetish, but because she happens to wear a cat suit for her breaking and entering. She's coerced (perhaps blackmailed) by Cobblepot into stealing Wayne company secrets, hoping to exploit the company's secrets and then pick through Wayne's bones. Her cover is as a rich dilettante, a romantic interest for Bruce Wayne allowing her to work recon for the sabotage. As she digs into Wayne files, the secret of Batman reveals itself to her. In the long game, she plays Wayne and her employers (and eventually Nash), making off with a considerable sum of dirty money and holding the Batman's secret as insurance. Christina Ricci is hauntingly beautiful, somewhat serpentine, and capable of portraying immense cunning beneath a demeanor of catlike languidness.


Ben Kingsley as Oswald Cobblepot, a cultured and old school British arms dealer known as the Penguin due to his birdlike silhouette and his affinity for formal wear. Cobblepot is looking to retire in Gotham, setting up the Iceberg Lounge and a comfortable retirement racket of negotiating illegal smuggling into the city. He's an associate of the new threat to Gotham, and together with Bane, controls guns and drugs coming into the city. He is also a counterpoint to Bruce Wayne, a self-made tycoon who's spent the better part of his life making sales in the most brutal of war-torn regions. He funded Bane's overthrow of the Santa Prisca government, seeing the opportunities the situation presented. His experience hocking in the front lines has provided him with a genius tactical sense of modern combat. Kingsley's the pimp. He's got the profile, the chops, and the background for a role like this.


Uma Thurman as Talia Al-Ghul. The girl's already proven she can kick ***. Kill Bill allowed her to let loose and be incredibly vicious physically. This would allow her to just be an absolutely ruthless ***** politically. She's the daughter of Ra's al Ghul but she brings her own bonuses to the table. She has a brilliant business mind. She recognizes that, despite the boozey squandering of the Wayne identity, the company is the heart of Gotham City. A sizable majority of commerce in the city is directed by Wayne interests. Her organization is colloquially quipped "Intergang", a corporate criminal organization seeking to fill the void left behind by the Joker's rampage on the big organized crime families. Using the company Kane Enterprises (referencing the Biblical Cain and serving as a symbolic "brother" to Wayne Enterprises), Intergang begins ruthlessly seizing Wayne investments. What Intergang offers to the blue collar is a consolidated criminal organization which is relatively benevolent to the employees on all rungs of the organization while offering a commendably stable chain of command. They run crime like a business, like a criminal union, and offer tantalizing opportunities to many in the lower class as blue collar job ops take a nose dive. There's a dynamic of revenge involved. Batman killed Talia's father in the same way that Chill killed Wayne's parents. She's fulfilling her father's legacy just as Wayne needs to step up and redeem his family's legacy. The fact that Batman allowed her father to die, while saving the life of the Joker (who has now spawned chaotic social dissidence) would be key. Besides, who wouldn't want to see a wicked martial arts throwdown between Uma and Christian?


Michael Emerson makes a brief appearance as Hugo Strange, a psychologist who was convicted to Arkham Asylum after he was found conducting experiments into the effects of high-strain steroids on inmates of the asylum, creating broken-minded fiendish "monster men". He claims (erroneously) to having served as a therapist for Batman's alter ego. He serves as a Hannibal Lecter (or Calendar Man) to Eddie Nashton. He refuses to reveal the identity of the Batman (since he's hoaxing, and doesn't actually know who Batman is) but surmises some critical revelations into the Batman's psyche. If you want to expand his role, you could tie him into Talia's organization by making him a lead researcher into the production of new strains of steroids, using inmates as guinea pigs.


Sam Rockwell is private dick Eddie Nashton, scruffy and antiheroic, a former quiz show whiz kid who turned his inquisitive mind to detective work. Growing sick of videotaping cheating housewives, Nashton's big break came when the police department contracts him to uncover the identity of the Batman. Through the course of the film he plays a game of cat and mouse with the dark detective, communicated through an exchange of riddles and puzzles between the two. He's a large part Philip Marlowe and smaller part Michael Westin (Burn Notice). A large part of Nashton's investigative work involves playing the detective game like a long con, in the same way that Westin treats his intelligence investigations. Sam Rockwell would be perfect - slickly cunning but resonating with a suave sort of sliminess. Incidentally, I think Robert Downey Jr. would also be great for this role.


We start with Gotham City in the throes of a violent class war. Batman has been revealed as a cop killer, and the GCPD is chomping at the bit to take him down. Commissioner Gordon's hands are tied and Batman's only eye into the police force is Anna Ramirez, who suspects the truth given her role in TDK. We open on news footage of the city streets, aflame, steeped in violent looting, curfew in effect, riot police storming the blocks. The dissidents roam the streets in full clown war paint, railing on the decadence and the irresponsibility of the rich. Batman is in the midst of it, as a gang of clowns overwhelms a cargo truck and, through sheer numbers and ferocity, beat the **** out of the heavily armed men onboard. Batman dispatches both parties and uncovers a massive stash of heavy arms loaded in the back of the truck, but before he has time to investigate, the police arrive, and he has to flee. But he's worried. The attack suggests a method behind the seemingly anarchic looting of the clown plague, and the threat of these young lunatics armed to the teeth is simply terrifying. Further, with organized crime in shambles, there's a question of who the men driving the guns were working for. Meanwhile, the GCPD has their hands full trying to contain the threat of these "Clown Disciples", and the city is bordering on martial law. Luckily, Kane Enterprises, a shipping company that's just relocated their headquarters to Gotham City, is taking a proactive hand in civic order. They've hired down-on-his-luck private dick Eddie Nashton to investigate the Batman. He makes the big break when he sifts through the background on the accountant who was looking to break open the Batman story (who's name I don't remember), pulling background on the guy to narrow down the possibilities of who the Batman could be, and after stumbling on design specs for the tumbler, it all clicks in place, and he realizes that whoever is the Batman must be associated in some way with Wayne Corp. Speaking of Wayne Corp, Lucius Fox is in a board meeting with Kathy Kane (cover for Talia Al-Ghul, played by Uma). She's the head of Kane Enterprises, a monolithic international company that specializes in import-export and has cornered shipping in and out of Gotham. She's negotiating a partnership where Kane handles all of the shipping for Wayne goods, and Kane gets stock interest in the company. Fox is reticent, but other investors seem eager. At the end of the meeting, Kane offers her disappointment that Bruce Wayne couldn't make it, although she understands how a meeting like this would be boring for someone like him, and suggests a better place to become acquainted with his future partner may be the opening party of the new Iceberg Lounge. Wayne's dogged, the state of emergency putting its toll on him, and almost all of his time is spent in the cowl. Wayne Manor's been rebuilt, with the cave expanded, outfitted with a massive mainframe, which he's using to investigate entrepreneur and new Gotham resident, Oswald Cobblepot. Alfred's worried about Bruce, gently suggesting that the Wayne personality needs some exercise. He suggests Wayne show up at Cobblepot's Iceberg Lounge - Bruce agrees entirely. We meet Selina Kyle, elegant, rich, mysterious, seen chatting with Kathy Kane. She wears dark, heavy shades, which protect her in moderate to bright light. She suffers from achromatism. She's entirely color-blind, and needs to filter her sight in light to prevent it from all fading to white. But in the dark, she can see with perfect acuity, albeit black and white. She's coaxed to go meet Bruce Wayne, who's certainly charmed. He meets Kathy Kane, as well as Bane (who I'm sure has a real name in the movie. I'm just not sure what it is). He also manages to plant a listening device in Cobblepot's office. Things hit off well with Selina, and after some teasing him in the right direction, he suggests she visit Lucius for a tour of the company. Back at Wayne Manor, he monitors the bug, which clearly reveals the deal between Cobblepot and Bane. Cobblepot is serving as the arbiter between Bane and the mysterious third party, in an open exchange of guns and drugs from the island. Cobblepot's using the Lounge to launder the money and make everything look legit. Bane is heading home overnight: he rarely leaves Santa Prisca, being intensely paranoid and over-prudent, and admits the only reason he agreed to actually come to Gotham was due to his fascination with the city's Bat. Wayne decides that night that he's leaving for Santa Prisca to neutralize Bane. Alfred, incredulous, asks how he's going to wage war on an entire island. Wayne's unsatisfying answer is that he'll simply make it unprofitable for Santa Prisca to continue doing business with Gotham. Batman emerges from the bay into Santa Priscan port. Here, he rigs a number of ships (marked Kane Enterprises, he notes) loaded with coke. He then heads for the President's mansion, a massive fortress on a cliff overlooking the coast. It's been retrofitted from the penitentiary that locked away so much of Bane's life, as a shining emblem of redemption. He works his way through the heavily guarded stronghold until he comes upon Bane's private quarters. Batman shows Bane the detonator in his hand. They talk, about the nature of their missions, about who's right, who's wrong. Batman shows what he's willing to do, detonating the cargo ships out in the port. Bane comes at him, and he monopolizes the fight. He cracks Batman's back over his knee and flings him out of the window. Batman spins to the sea below, his cape unfurling behind him, in a fluttering spiral like an injured sparrow, and he plunges into the water.

Act two again opens with a television broadcast, an execution tape from the clown. It's shot in the university auditorium at night, the whole theater overflowing with weirdos in clown masks and paint - bats and chains, like something out of the Warriors. We meet Harley Quinn in heavy grease paint and a DYI harlequin costume. She was a social psychologist working in the inner city who went native and founded herself a personality cult. She's not enamored with the Joker like the comic book version, but instead recognizes him as a symbol she can use to galvanize a revolution. They make their demands - a list of socialites who must submit to the guillotine, with Bruce Wayne topping the list - and punctuate the demands by executing their trust fund hostage. It makes a counterpoint to the Wayne murders. The Waynes, who were murdered by Ra's for being too responsible; and as an antecedent to that, the rest of the Gotham upper crust who are being targeted for exhibiting zero responsibility. Selina Kyle is taking the tour of Wayne Industries. We see her pull some cool tricks to monitor the place using sleight of hand, selective questioning, and a few interesting gadgets, including one utilizing the sonar technology from Batman's toy in TDK. Fox repeatedly demures the questions of where Bruce is. As she steps out, we her end of a phone conversation, calling her employer Ozzie on the phone and revealing her as a saboteur. Bruce Wayne has been recovered by a poor family of coca farmers, who nurse him back to health. Pastoral, like the Godfather II, in subtitled Spanish. Here he finds a humble man making a living off one of the few crops that can bring in the money to sustain his family. Bruce recovers over a few days to a week, finally gets to a point where he can be moved to a town. Wayne and Alfred arrive on the company roof in a chopper, greeted by Fox and Kyle, who fawns over him. He needs to lean heavy on a cane to walk (I wouldn't have his back actually be broken. I don't want to go the "replacement Batman" route). They explain the injury as the result of a mountain climbing accident. Bruce Wayne finds Eddie Nashton waiting for him in his office, to discuss his investigation into the Batman. I keep picturing that really kick-*** scene in American Psycho where Willem Dafoe is speaking with/interrogating Christian Bale. The two jockey in the office as Nashton tries to feel out whether Wayne could be the Batman. We get another peek into Nashton's interest in puzzles, we establish his interest in detective work stemming not out of a need to help people, but out of an interest in the roundabout, conspiracy-laden mysteries of film noir. Wayne forwards Nashton to Lucius Fox, swearing to give him access to whatever he needs. Wayne, later, in the manor's basement. The clown disciples are getting out of control, and he can see Kane Enterprises maneuvering, looking to slowly lay pressure on Wayne Corp and swallow it whole. He's frustrated that he can't operate as the Batman the way he would like to, muses that he'll have to approach things differently. And the police and news seem worried that, with as October is wrapping up, a **** storm may be coming. Alfred, noting the poverty at the heart of the city's rioting, gently suggests that maybe the city needs Bruce Wayne more than it needs Batman. Oh, and Selina Kyle is upstairs. She is ever-present, insinuating herself into Wayne's life, doting over him. They have a rapport, and he can't turn her away. He's lonely, hunted, but her presence makes it much harder for him to work as Batman. He works from afar as his back heals. A package shows up at Nashton's door, paperwork implicating Kane Enterprises with the drug and gun trade into Gotham City - vouchers that show a connection between Santa Prisca and the shipping company, paper trails of smartly laundered money, and the last page, blank but for a sentence hand-written, circled, red-inked: "Can you afford to be associated with these people?". Nashton meets with Kathy Kane at the Iceberg Lounge. He insinuates that she's getting him involved in a private duel between her people and Wayne Enterprises. It gets heated. "Maybe it is time for a class war", he says. Kane tells him to cool his heels, gives him an invitation to her upcoming Halloween masquerade. She retreats to the VIP lounge, which he's been watching. Snaps pictures of Ozzie, Bane, Kane, all retreating into the private lounge. It's Halloween, and the clown disciples arm themselves for an assault as Kane's costume party is getting started. Kyle wears a Julie Newmar style Catwoman costume. Early in the party, we see her slickly pocket Bruce's fingerprints and an ID card. Selina's there to poach what she needs from Wayne. Wayne's there to investigate Kane. Nashton's there to scope for the Batman, who he's convinced is associated with Wayne Enterprises and has a vendetta against Kane. Harley Quinn and her Joker Disciples storm Kane Manor, using their numbers and ferocity to take out the armed guard surrounding the city. A couple of richies get sliced up. She closes in on Bruce. Selina kills the electricity with an EMP triggered in her cell. The lights go out, her shades drop, and in the pitch black, she is a wrecking ball. The spotlights come up, the thugs are found mostly incapacitated, and backup pours in. Wayne is unable to stand against the wall. Kyle is lost in the mess, but so are many others, left unaccounted for by the fleeing, bustling crowd. Quinn's found bound and left for police out on the lawn. Everyone's convinced the Batman saved them, and Nashton is decently convinced that Wayne's not his guy.

Act three opens with news footage, just like the first two acts. A camera crew is filming the immediate aftermath of the attack on Kane Manor. The grateful rich think the Batman is their hero. The clowns being cuffed and loaded into cop cars think the same thing. The Batman is just another crooked cop protecting the rich at the expense of the poor. "What has the Batman ever done for us except break our bones and throw us in cells?" Wayne is trying to sneak away from the police all over Kane Manor as he's pieced together Kyle's story. He gets away with Alfred's help, entering Wayne Towers after hours. Here, he tangles with Selina Kyle, in catsuit and filtered goggles, who's raiding the building of any information on tap. Heavily injured, he doesn't stand a chance, and with her straddling over him, she lifts the mask, and coos in amusement. "Bruce...?" He tears off her goggles and tugs the pin off of a flashbang. In the chaos, he manages to pin her down. He can pay better, he says. The following day, Nashton is at a loss. He believes that the Batman is a weapon being funded by Wayne Enterprises and that a conflict with Kane is at the heart of it, but with Bruce out of the picture, he can't piece together an identity. That is, until he starts looking into the history of Bruce Wayne's butler, a man with decades of experience fighting guerilla battles in various international theaters. He decides to pay Mr. Pennysworth a visit, and Alfred gets the chance to be a pimp. "It's clear," he hypothesizes, with a wink and a nod, "That you're dealing with an organization, and not a man. If there is a Batman, and only one Batman, then he's more likely than not something not entirely remarkable, a cog in a war machine that's veiled by layers upon layers of corporate subterfuge. The riddle isn't 'Who is the Batman?'. It's 'Why is the Batman?'". Nashton walks away frustrated. Just... not for long... Ozzie and his men are waiting at Eddie's apartment. Kane's uses for the PI have run out, and in their last meeting he slipped up by revealing the one clue she needed, the connection to Wayne Corp. Eddie's brutalized, dragged to the basement of the Iceberg Lounge for interrogation. Bruce follows, knowing he needs evidence to pin on Cobblepot. He drops an anonymous bat-sighting on 911: Someone saw the Batman snooping around the Lounge... and when he breaks into the club, he makes his presence loudly known to the people gambling and socializing on the club's floor. As Ozzie's men try to covertly sneak out the back, Batman has their escape route covered, and the police come bursting in through the front, leaving the tied-up Nashton with little recourse but to spill to them the whole sordid story of Kane's connection to the Gotham underworld. Batman leads the GCPD on a wild goose chase, and as the icing on the cake, finds a way to secure a private conversation with Gordon in the midst of the whole mess. There's the talk about whether Batman's presence is really needed, whether what he's doing is right. Batman finally shows his face to Gordon, asks, "Should I turn myself in?" Gordon says, "Maybe I'd like to arrest the Batman, but that would mean arresting Bruce Wayne..." Meanwhile, amidst the chaos, Selina and Kane are in the VIP lounge. Selina's spilling the dirt on the information she gathered from Wayne Corp. "They know everything," she says. There's a whole network of evidence closed tightly around Kane Enterprises, enough to sink the company in criminal court, despite the corruption of City Hall. Wayne's ploy is to disseminate the information to Kathy Kane, knowing he can't fight an open war against her company, and he'll force her to retreat rather than see her empire crumble around her. Talia's not playing that game. She pulls a gun on Selina, and pulling off her glasses, plunging her into white-blindness, she leads her out. An exhausted, aching Batman is heading home. He parks the tumbler in the cave, changes back into Bruce. But the place is desolate. Alfred isn't anywhere. The entrance to the cave is open, and in the Manor he finds Kathy Kane, along with captive Selina and Alfred. There's the exchange you know has to happen. Talia reveals herself. There's the argument about the similarity between their upbringings, about justice, about what's right. There's swordplay. Talia is dead, Bruce Wayne is triumphant, Selina and Alfred are okay. Alfred must deal with the body of Talia al-Ghul while Bruce Wayne is left to come to grips with the fact that he's a murderer.

Coda: Bruce Wayne, press conference. It's hard to admit you're wrong, especially when the people who prove it to you are psychopathic murderers. But something needs to be done about the class discrepancies in the city. The Wayne Legacy, no legacy should be about the amassing of wealth. The legacy of the Waynes should be the legacy of Gotham City, and Wayne pledges to die a poor man, to spend every cent of his fortune, over the course of his lifetime, towards the advancement and well-being of the citizens of Gotham. Maybe one of his partners in this endeavor is a cameo from Leslie Thompkins, who is helping reform the Clown Disciples locked away into proactive revolutionaries, in the fashion of the Guardian Angels or the early inner city "gangs" before they got swept up in Reagan's cocaine flood. Wayne will, of course, invest the money smartly to insure the dividends increase, to be fed into social and civic rehabilitation programs in the most fiscally responsible fashion. As the evidence of Kane's dealings go public, it becomes accepted that she's fled the country to avoid prosecution, and as the stocks plummet in the aftermath, Wayne Enterprises sharkishly gobbles them up. He slyly tells the company's former partner, Bane of Santa Prisca, that Kane money will, of course, be used to help reform the economy of Santa Prisca before the US sets their eyes on the island nation and decides a US-backed regime change is in order. And Nashton, bruised and beaten, sits in his cramped apartment, covered in codices and esoteric clues, financial reports and police reports, trying to piece together the structure of the organization that funds the Batman.
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Woah. I love Bane, Harley Quinn and The Riddler. That is epic. Good job, sir.
Zombipanda, I like your ideas for Bane and Penguin. Uma Thurman was already in Batman and Robin, as Poison Ivy....
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Zombipanda, I like your ideas for Bane and Penguin. Uma Thurman was already in Batman and Robin, as Poison Ivy....

She works for this role also. Besides I said you couldn't cast anyone from the Nolan films. Burton and Schumaker actors are fair game.
She works for this role also. Besides I said you couldn't cast anyone from the Nolan films. Burton and Schumaker actors are fair game.

I know, I'm just saying - Christian Bale originally tried out for the role of Robin in the Schumacher movies. How would you feel if they went through with that, and then cast him again as Batman for the Nolan films?
I know, I'm just saying - Christian Bale originally tried out for the role of Robin in the Schumacher movies. How would you feel if they went through with that, and then cast him again as Batman for the Nolan films?

Don't know, guess we'll never know.

My idea will be entitled Knight Fall and loosely base the comic of the same name. There's turmoil in Gotham City, some citizens can't believe Batman to be a killer as Batman and Gordon must communicate in secret. Harvey Bullock and Renee Montoya have been assigned as head of the Anti-Vigilante unit. With this Batman's list of allies grows very thin, he no longer has the resources or the cooperation from the police, as well as no one in the DA's office.

Wayne Manor and the Batcave have been rebuilt as well as a new version of the tumbler. A new string of high profiled crimes are being committed by a small group, with a mysterious leader who leaves a riddle after every crime and called himself the Riddler. Each clues he leaves points to the Dent conspiracy which has both Gordon and Batman worried.

Also a female cat burglar has been pulling off high priced heist. The press dubs her Catwoman who constantly and playfully evades Batman. Meanwhile Bruce Wayne has been very reclusive since Rachel's death, Alfred tries to get him to go out more and continue his role as play boy. Reluctantly Bruce does so by having parties and attempts to pick up a new arm candy by the name of Selina Kyle. But he unexpectedly finds a kindred spirit in her. Though they both keep secrets, which incidentally both tears them apart and bring them together.

Meanwhile the mob is desperate after the Joker dwindling their numbers, the DA's office joint conspiracy case, and Two-Face's killing of Maroni. They buy large amount of guns hoping to over power Batman. Batman's first mission is to take out large shipment of guns being sold by an arms dealer who goes by the alias The Penguin. The Penguin loves to mingle in high society knowing his identity is secret. But during a deal a young girl who was at one of the parties, witness he face and can place him with the guns. During desperate attempt to silence her he kills her father as she flees into Gotham alone.

Meanwhile a young man (20's) name Dick Grayson, a former acrobat who is trained in kick boxing, reluctantly found himself helping the young girl run from the attackers. He has a run in with Batman in his fights against the penguin. Batman is impressived with a citizen going so far to protect the witness, and with his list of resources thins Batamn decides to use Grayson as an ally of sort, being more of a street informant rather than a side kick. Think of the role Gordon has with the police.

A south American Crime Lord name Bane comes to town. He wears a wrestling mask and uses steroids to keep his body in peek fitness. Bane already is strategically brilliant and owns several cities throughout South and Central Americas and has no need for more power (think the Batman of crime). But what he does wish for is a challenge, one that he wishes to find in Batman.

The Riddler turns out to be Mike Engel who left clues to the Dent conspiracy as well as hints to his knowledge of Batman's identity. (I choose Engel instead of Reese because I want to hear Anthony Michael Hall say "Riddle me this Batman" much more than the other guy) To show the city that Batman is a hero. Engel who was very Anti-Batman had his mind changed after being saved in TDK. He sees the huge holes in the Dent conspiracies and creates a persona to help Batman get back on top. Bane figures out his clues right away and uses it to enact a plan to publicly beat Batman.

First Bane tracks down and kidnaps the Riddler, forcing him to reveal Batman's identity. Using it, he invades Wayne Manor, wrecking only one room and placing a fake clue in the center of the room. Batman follows the clue to an abandon warehouse; the room is dark with one light shining on the Riddler in a chair his back facing towards Batman. When he spins around the chair he sees Engel tied up who says "I'm sorry" as the light go on. Batman is in an arena with criminals lining the top as spectators as Bane walks out.

Batman discovers Catwoman's identity and is at a loss of what to do. He tries to capture her one last time but she escapes the police car. She calls Bruce saying she's leaving; not wanting to put him threw it all.
There's a spectacular fight but eventually Banes wins. With a broken arm and battered body Batman must retreat, being saved by Dick, who discovered the event and finds a way to get Batman out. There's a video on youtube of Batman's defeat, which leads criminals to go wild. And with Batman defeated Bane starts to take over the all the mob organizations, He doesn't reveal Batman's identity, letting him heal for chance of a rematch.

Eventually Batman creates a plan and is able to defeat Bane with the world watching to regain his reputation. At the end Batman decides to train Dick Grayson. He finds that there may come a time when He'll fail and will need a successor, or mayb'e just some back up once in a while (not meaning sidekick). He gets sends a message to dick to meet in an empty building and offers to train him, telling him what Ducard told him "You can fight of six men, I can teach you have to fend off 600. You can disappear; I can teach how to become truly invisible. I can turn you into something more than just a man." "What's that?" "A legend, are you ready to begin?" The key thing here is that Batman never reveals his identity, he and Grayson meet at secret locations to train.

The theme is a trial of Body, Bruce must overcome a physical threat was well as questions into the possiblity of having a personal life. Now let me just explain why I want to do it like this, first off I wanted to continue the trend of throwing as many villains as you can so you only get the best parts of the and create a much richer story. And with Grayson I see that Batman needs more allies after the TDK. Plus it creates a great circle with the three movies. Batman went through the three basic trials of humanity. First he finds the means to save Gotham and out maneuvers his intellectual equal. Second his morality is tested and is pushed to the limit in a battle for Gotham's soul. And last he fights a threat greater than him in physical terms. Mind, Soul, and Body. After these three adventures Batman has become whole and found his role and what he must do in this world. And as the Student became a hero, the Hero then becomes the Teacher. Which brings everything into a complete circle.


Bullock – James Gandolfini
I think I sorta stole this casting choice when I first read the "further entries" dreamcast (which I avoided to keep this from happening) but I can't picture a better actor for this role. As the straight cop, extremely loyal to Gordon but hate Batman would be perfect for him. I picture in this version Bullock is against Batman mainly because he thinks Bats was the one holding Gordon's family hostage.


Montoya - Rosario Dawson
I don't have much to contribute here; I don't see her playing a big role.


Selina – Eva Green
I choose Eva largely due to her role in Casino Royale. Where she plays Bond's intellectual equal. Likewise Bruce finds a kindred spirit in her. But she can't help but flirt with Batman as he tries to catch her. In the end Selina leaves Gotham and Bruce, not wanting to put him through the possibility of her getting caught by Batman.


Penguin –Terence Stamp
Terence isn't my real choice; I want do something different than a short cubby guy with an umbrella, someone who is a bit younger and more in shape, and feels a bit like the character from Lord of War but with much more love of shooting guns. My Penguin is an Arms Dealer who loves to mingle with high society. The Name Penguin is an alias he uses in his deals to keep authorities off his tail but becomes a problem when a young girl sees his face during a deal. I think Stamp would do a pretty decent job as this, I can at least picturing him calming walking towards Batman firing an automatic with a cigarette in his mouth.


Dick Grayson - Josh Duhamel
Josh is a bit a older than I would have liked, but with make up he can look like he's in his early 20's. Now before anyone goes "Robin, Booo!" I don't expect him to ever put on a costume or be tagging a long. His story is pretty simple, same childhood just that after his parent's death he hasn't had the guidance of Wayne. Now he's working as a Bartender, he start keeps his acrobatic skills up as well as learning kickboxing as a hobby. He enters the story by saving the Penguin's eye witness and helping her evade the hit out on her. This is how he first meets Batman.


Bane – Antonio Banderas
Bane is a calm, cool character who takes steroids to keep his body in peak shape, nothing outlandish but still really strong. I see him as the Batman of crime, Just as Ras was the extreme version of Batman, and the Joker his polar opposite, Bane is his equal but on the other side of the line. This was by far the hardest role to cast, I've heard a few great suggestions in other threads but I really didn't want to steal them. So I had a tough time finding someone who can play a South American and look the part, but I threw out that idea since we probably won't see Bane's face I should look for the voice. I choose Banderas only for his voice. I see Bane as speaking very suave and smooth. Keeping a constant calm composer at all times.
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Don't know, guess we'll never know.

Oh, you'll know....


Get ready for teh Revolution.

Hmm....Random, I like your Catwoman. I never thought of that before. Bullock and Montoya are good. I'm thinking about doing Robin as well for my cast.
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Oh, you'll know....


Get ready for teh Revolution.

Hmm....Random, I like your Catwoman. I never thought of that before. Bullock and Montoya are good. I'm thinking about doing Robin as well for my cast.

You're going to give up entirely and slide into alcoholism after you see my plot.
You're going to give up entirely and slide into alcoholism after you see my plot.

Most likely.

EDIT: Actually dude, your ideas for the characters pretty much have sold me on your movie. Oh well, I'll try to get some ideas going.
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Most likely.

EDIT: Actually dude, your ideas for the characters pretty much have sold me on your movie.

Hah. Thanks. I'm looking forward to lots of really killer premises to get thrown around in this thread. Everyone loves Batman, and the end of the Dark Knight was so open ended that it could spin out in countless directions.

There's going to be a kick-*** set piece where Batman goes to Santa Prisca to assault the island's seat of power: the old prison which has now been turned into the Presidential state house.
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I've got the first third of what I want to do finished. Still need to work out the rest of it. Either this weekend or earlier next week.
I better get crackin'...in the morning. I do have to say that I am a little disappointed we aren't getting that adult themed Barbie adaptation.
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Finished my a few days ago and been waiting to post it. here it is :

The Dynamic Duo (working title)​


This film opens up with Bruce Wayne talking to Alfred. Alfred after much debate convinces Bruce to attend more "Bruce" publicity events and not to loose himself too much in his Batman character. Bruce reluctantly agrees to go to "xtreme Gotham".

"Xtreme Gotham" is an event featuring skate boarding , Motorbikes , Monster Trucks , Sunt display teams and more. The event this year was honoured to have "The Flying Graysons" a stunt display team featuring a family on motorbikes doing jumps and more. Their outfits are red and green leather. Their motorbikes are painted the same colour but with birds on them each one having a different bird.

When Bruce Wayne shows up he is greeted by a protester named Pamela Isley. She is concerned over plans Wayne Enterprises has to cut down a huge area of forest on the out skirts of town to create a new Observatory (Actually a cover so Bruce can build an emergency Batcave under it for repairs and for a second Bat mobile to be stored in an emergency)

Bruce tries to listen but unfortunately the protester is pushed out the way by a sea of girls swooning over the billionaire. An unfortunate event but Bruce makes his way to the V.I.P box overlooking the event.

The event goes down with out a problem. Bruce seems to be enjoying it. The camera cuts to Dick Grayson. He is alone near the main manager's booth having a cigarette trying to get relaxed while his family do their act. He accidentally overhears a mobster named "Tony Zucco" threatening the event manager for money.

"I paid you everything I owe" – Manager
"Well Mr Cobblepot sees you can afford to pay more with this turn out" – Tony Zucco
"You think I'm intimidated by the penguin? I'll pay you nothing." – Manger
"You know he hates that name. Well if you won't pay him I guess I'll have to end your little show."

That is the kind of convocation Dick over hears. Before he can act Tony Zucco walks out the tent and shoots The Flying Graysons while they are riding. Before walking away. Dick runs over to his parents. The scene reminds Bruce Wayne of his parents death.

Important note : As dick looks at his shot parents the scene would flash back to the scene in Batman begins when bruce saw his parents shot. The two scenes over-lap and as Dick stands up with an angry and empty look on his face it cuts to begins with Bruce looking angry and empty when he was older in begins before his training.

Dick grabs the near-by helmet of his father that fell off as he hit the floor and runs off. Bruce knows all too well what the young man wants. He wants revenge not justice but revenge. Bruce leaves the V.I,P box straight away.

The scene then shows Dick chasing after a car on motorbike he steals. Bruce gets in his car and chases after them. He gets the Batman costume on him as the car drives after Dick.

The chase comes to an end with Dick getting off his bike and approaching the man who gets out. It's Tony Zucco. Tony reaches for his gun but Robin punches him before he can pull the trigger. The gun falls out his hands as he hits the floor. The fight continues until Tony is on the floor and Dick has the gun.

"Don't do it." – Batman

"Why not?" – Dick

"If you kill a man like this you become a man like this." – Batman

"And who are you to give me advice?" – Dick

Dick turns around to see Batman standing behind him.

"I'm you if you focus your anger in the right way." – Batman

Tony Zucco goes to stand up but Batman kicks him back down. Dick points the gun at Tony and the screen goes black. Only a gun shot can be heard. The scene then cuts to Tony tied up for the police to find and a bullet hole in the ground implying Dick couldn't do it.

Next we see Pamela Isley crying in an apartment room. She is throwing papers on the floor and looks at what looks like a chemistry set. She gives a speech about how she has tried doing it peacefully but all men like Bruce Wayne listen too is bimbos like the ones that pushed her over.

She takes a pair of scissors and starts to cut her bush, untidy hair. As she looks down at the chemistry set. In the chemistry set is a Lotus flower (like the one in begins) and the camera cuts away. This scene is to show her having a complete breakdown and showing she is becoming Poison Ivy.

The next scene is a training montage that is very much like Bruce training with Ra's Al Ghul. But it's Bruce as the teacher training Dick. They will even be scenes where Bruce tells Dick things like "mind your surroundings." This very important to the movie and what it is going for. This shows that Bruce sees himself in Dick and also shows That evil as Ra's Al Ghul was he is still a heavy part of who Bruce has become.

As this training is going on it will be interrupted scene wise by Oswald Cobblepot learning batman stopped Tony Zucco. Oswald Cobblepot decides to speed up his takeover of Gothams underground. So as the training continues it shows moss bosses been killed one by one and Oswald Cobblepot's gang getting bigger and bigger via overlapping montages.

At the end of the scene we see Dick modifying a set of Batman armour. Spraying it too look like his red and green leather. The mask he takes an un assembled batman mask (so no ears) and cutting it out to leave just the eye area wrap around.

He also takes time to customise the Batpod to be his own person vehicle. This means there was a hidden reason behind the batpod in the Dark Knight. It was there ready for Robin in the next film to have a vehicle with out drawing too much focus on him getting it as it would be too Robin then.

We then see Bruce in restaurant similar to the hotel one he was in , in begins. In the door walks the newly made over Pamela Isley or poison ivy as she will now be called. Every guy in the room looks at her as she wearing a low cut green dress (basically dressed like she is in Gotham girls but with no gloves and no boots)

She walks straight over to Bruce and flirts with him to get him alone. Once she has him alone she pulls out a small bottle like perfume and sprays Bruce. The perfume is actually a gas she made with the Lotus flower that acts like scarecrows gas. The only difference is instead of scaring it makes them fall in love with her.

She gives Bruce an order. Destroy Wayne Enterprises. Ironic that Bruce sets out to destroy what his parents helped to build. Little does she know you send Bruce to destroy something your really sending Batman. So now there is a brain washed batman on the loose.

The call comes in from Batman telling Alfred he can't fight it. There is one choice left. Dick or Robin as he now calls himself, must stop his own master. Can Robin really stop Batman? He knows his moves from training so it's possible but the dark knight has more experience.

Robin leaves the batcave on his new motorbike (customised BatPod.) He manages to catch up to Batman before batman gets there and gets him to pull over. Now an unlikely fight is about to emerge. It's Batman vs Robin!

This is the distraction Oswald Cobblepot was looking for. He marches a huge gang of thugs to kill Batman. During his fight with Robin. Batman comes to his senses seeing the threat and now Batman and Robin must stop what looks like an army of mobsters.

The fight would be cut in a way that slows down but would be as realistic as Bruce vs the prisoners but now with two vs more. Oswald Cobblepot watches on as the Dynamic Duo make their way towards him.

Meanwhile Poison Ivy is approached by a woman. She introduces herself as Talia al Ghul. She says she is there to help her destroy . She gives Ivy a weapon that is a modified version of microwave-emitter from begins. The difference this microwave-emitter manipulates plant dna to make plants act crazy.

She sets off with her weapon to destroy Wayne Enterprises. The fight with the criminals leaves Batman and Robin to Oswald Cobblepot. This scene is them cornering him and intimidating him. But before they can defeat him the ground begins to shake.

Tree vines spring up out of the ground in a wild and uncontrolled way. It causes the roads to split and knocks Batman and Robin off their feet. Oswald Cobblepot escapes as they are distracted to go into hiding. This is to allow him to return if they want down the line.

Batman looks on in horror as Wayne Enterprises comes crashing down to the ground. He sees at the foot of the Wayne Enterprises Poison Ivy. He recognises her as the girl at the restaurant who messed with his head. He runs over to approach her. As he gets closer he recognises her as the protester who was pushed aside. This will show him that even the choices he makes as Bruce will effect the city.

Poison Ivy starts to freak out seeing that her attack has destroyed all near by plants. She breaks down crying as Batman approaches.

The movie ends in complete chaos. After everything that happened Batman ends his partnership with Robin deciding that he'll end up like Batman if he continues. Robin is too stubborn to quit and says he'll fight crime on his own then. This is to set up Nightwing the movie

Later Bruce is seen looking at Poison Ivy in arkham asylum. She's talking to a small plant outside the window asking for forgiveness after mental breakdown. This so if she returns they can have her talking to plants and It'll make sense since it's explained. If not it shows what's happened to her and show that Bruce blames himself for her state.


End of credits a small scene is shown with Talia al Ghul saying "It worked. I did what you wanted …. Father." and then Ra's Al Ghul stepping out of the shadows showing he survived and saying "Good, Gotham will be cleansed."

Notes :

This film while a been a great movie as is also sets up 2 movies. First been Nightwing and second been the sequel to this movie. Wayne Enterprises was destroyed because it effects Bruce personally but is also very important to Gotham, Like a symbol. So it would logically make Gotham depressing and in chaos for the return of Ra's Al Ghul.

Batman's Batmobile will be shown in this as been like a black version of the "Sports Coupe" figure that was released for the dark knight as his Batmobile needs to be slick and fast like a sports car but I thought the more bat shaped one wouldn't work in this universe.

Also with all the gang involvement in this one the people of Gotham will realise they need batman again as will the police after how the dark knight ended.

Cast :

Dick Grayson aka Robin – Vincent Kartheiser – This choice is based on who and what robin is in this film. He is used as a mirror of who Batman was in Begins when he started out. He needs to be like Bale but different enough to be is own. He will be the main theme in the movie but not in a way that makes this "robin begins" this is a way that shows Bruce hates who he's become but it's too late for him so he tries to save this younger him.

Vincent Kartheiser looks wise looks kind of like a Young bale but he acts similar to him as well in the dark brooding way. This is a very important mix to get right as after this movie he'll have his own movie to do so he needs to be right. This is not the boy robin this is an older more realistic robin.

Tony Zucco – Al Pacino – This choice was based purely on who Al Pacino is. Let's face it you have Al Pacino as mobster working for someone who is meant to be a bigger more dangerous mobster it helps rise the status of the boss before we even see him. Plus putting the Al Pacino charm behind the character makes him more memorable.

Oswald Cobblepot aka The Penguin – James Gandolfini – James Gandolfini is great in the gangsta role. Let's face it you add that to the previous status Al Pacino helped to bring and Oswald Cobblepot is a serious threat to batman and is also very believable as a character. I also liked the idea on the IGN list and added that to my movie of Oswald Cobblepot hating the name Penguin so that it's a nickname that he hates and is used only behind his back and by batman.

Pamela Isley aka Poison Ivy – Scarlett Johansson – I needed a really good actresses for this as I wanted this character to be a very emotionally controlled during her breakdowns. She also needed to look great for it to work. I had considered a few actresses e.g Julia Roberts but in the case of Julia Roberts she was too Julia Roberts if that makes sense.

Scarlett Johansson has in my opinion pale skin that I think adds to the look of Ivy. She would also work as the untidy mess that I see Pamela Isley been when she's protesting but it'll add something to her transformation of sorts when she becomes Poison Ivy. The red hair can easily be done with dye.

Talia al Ghul – Ziyi Zhang – I like Ziyi Zhang and think she would add that element that Ken Watanabe added to Ra's Al Ghul (well his double) that made the league of shadows work. While her father story wise would be Liam Neeson, considering where he lived is it too hard to believe he got an Asian woman pregnant?

Ziyi Zhang works and the fact she can do martial arts and has been seen in movies like House of flying daggers makes her just click in to this world as a threat and in the sequel to this movie she would have a bigger role as her father's right hand woman.

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