Marvel announces "Ultimate Hulk vs. Wolverine"; "Ultimate Invasion" minis

[moonmaster]

Oh yeah, that'll make a great story!

Than we'll have people complainin' on how such a cop out that is, and how bad the story is. :roll:

I wasn't saying that they should do that story, I just think it a little annoying the way that works. I've started to realize that the 616 FF are way too powerful. If they can travel through time and hop through different dimensions and alternate universes, why can't Reed solve world hunger? Its like the problem with Wolverine: He's so unbelievably unstoppable that there's no point of even putting him into any kind of mortal danger because for him there is no such thing as mortal danger. He's practically invincable. Characters should not be allowed to just do whatever they want or be totally invincable. It diminishes the basic things that make a story and its characters interesting.






Stupid Marvel.

 

[Ice]

I wasn't saying that they should do that story, I just think it a little annoying the way that works. I've started to realize that the 616 FF are way too powerful. If they can travel through time and hop through different dimensions and alternate universes, why can't Reed solve world hunger? Its like the problem with Wolverine: He's so unbelievably unstoppable that there's no point of even putting him into any kind of mortal danger because for him there is no such thing as mortal danger. He's practically invincable. Characters should not be allowed to just do whatever they want or be totally invincable. It diminishes the basic things that make a story and its characters interesting.

It doesnt diminish anything. There's a reason why it's done the way it's done. Because doing that is just taking the easy way out.


"I know! Why drag Wolverine around for so many damn decades wondering about who he is, when we can just have him go back in time, and POOF! There he finds out, even though HE DOESNT KNOW WHERE TO EVEN BEGIN!

And while we're at it, let's make everything too easy in ALL the stories, so there's really no challenge in coming up with ideas to make one situation better the next time is used!"

 

[moonmaster]

It doesnt diminish anything. There's a reason why it's done the way it's done. Because doing that is just taking the easy way out.


"I know! Why drag Wolverine around for so many damn decades wondering about who he is, when we can just have him go back in time, and POOF! There he finds out, even though HE DOESNT KNOW WHERE TO EVEN BEGIN!

And while we're at it, let's make everything too easy in ALL the stories, so there's really no challenge in coming up with ideas to make one situation better the next time is used!"

Like I said before, I'm not saying they should do anything like that, I'm just saying that Marvel's done some dumb things in terms of making characters too powerful/smart. It sets up stuff like the Wolverine FF thing. If you wanna give somebody a valid problem that can be a big part of the character's story, then don't make it so that the problem could be done away with a day. It makes everything feel a lot less realistic.

 

[Ultimate Houde]

He's getting mad

Soon, he'll start deleting posts.

 

[Ice]

Like I said before, I'm not saying they should do anything like that, I'm just saying that Marvel's done some dumb things in terms of making characters too powerful/smart. It sets up stuff like the Wolverine FF thing. If you wanna give somebody a valid problem that can be a big part of the character's story, then don't make it so that the problem could be done away with a day. It makes everything feel a lot less realistic.

And Im not saying thats what you're saying, but showing what is implied by what you're saying, or rather, what sounds from what you're saying. Just because a problem can be "done away in a day" doesnt mean from what you say. Because than you can say that for EVERYTHING, ANYWHERE and EVERYWHERE.

So you say that Wolverine is just about immortal. True, but also not true at the same time. Wolverine CAN be killed, it's the fact that Marvel DOESNT want to kill him because fans love him too much and all that. So what are youy gonna do? Make sure that the REAL MOST popular characters dont die. DUH!



I know I ain't the only like this. Who else can explain?

 

[moonmaster]

So you say that Wolverine is just about immortal. True, but also not true at the same time. Wolverine CAN be killed, it's the fact that Marvel DOESNT want to kill him because fans love him too much and all that. So what are youy gonna do? Make sure that the REAL MOST popular characters dont die. DUH!

I know they'll never kill him off, but to me it seems that when he was first introduced he could be put in mortal danger. Now it seems like the possibility of him ever dieing is just dismissed altogether. People act like they're is no way anyone could ever stop him. What makes a lot of stories interesting is the fact that the main character could die. Wolverine will never really be killed off, but you still need to maintain the illusion that he could be killed. It kind of stupid to make a character practically invincible just for the sake of being cool.

 

[Ice]

But that doesn't mean that they can't or won't put Wolverine in that. What we really need is a writer to put him in that situation. Like Morrison in New X-Men. We need more like that with Wolvie. And I think it would kick *** if they put Wolverine in danger like that (not THAT EXACTLY, but at that "high level") with the Hulk in the mini. Where Hulk beats the living daylights out of him, giving him a beatdown that no memory tampering can undo or anything! But of course, Wolverine'd fight back, too.

 

[Ultimate Houde]

I told you he'll start deleting posts!

Anyways, I agree with Moony there has never been a point where I felt Wolvie was in mortal danger.

Never.

Not even when he got fireballed in Days of Future Past. I figured he was going ot regenerate from that. But Wolvie is no more than a brick wall that gets thrown at people constantly. Seriously, when the Xmen want someone to take care of, they throw Wolvie at them.

But, as I said earlier, this whole story, I feel, doesn't need to be told, but I betcha I can sum ir up

Issue 1: Wolvie goes after Hulk, Insert a random bad guy's plan
Issue 2: Banner finds out about evil plan, goes to take guy out, Wolvie finds him first
Issue 3: They fight. Bad guy goes to activate aforementioned plan
Issue 4: Wolvie finds out Banner ain't lying, they both take out bad guy. End of issue Wolvie tells Fury he can't track down Banner for some odd reason, they share a stare.

There's the story, in a nutshell folks

Maybe I should write for Marvel.

 

[Ice]

Anyways, I agree with Moony there has never been a point where I felt Wolvie was in mortal danger.

It ain't Ultimate, but Morrison did put him in that kind of danger. Wolverine was sent into the SUN! That was going to kill him off ONCE AND FOR ALL, and at the last minute, he stabbed Jean to release the Phoenix, which saved his life. But he WAS about to die!

 

[Bass]

REED: "Gah! I hate those goddam muties so much! With their 'hip hop' and their 'fried chicken'! If only I could use my astounding intelligence to rid to the world of mutant scum instead of 'heeelllping people!' HELPING PEOPLE'S FOR HIPPIES!!!"

SUE: "You tell 'em Reed! I'm glad we home school Franklin and Val so they don't have to go to school with those filthy animals. Who do they think they are? With their 'superpowers'!"

REED: "Uh, Sue......we have superpowers too..."

SUE: "I know, but we're not mutants!"

REED: "Oh, I see your reasoning now!"

This reminds me of a bit in a Generation X comic. Skin is a teenaged mutant with grey skin that is disproportionately long. He can stretch his skin like Reed, but its only skin. While prehensile, his skeleton and organs remain the same. So he's in the city there are some people drowing, and he dives in to save them, but they refuse to be saved by a mutant, so he says, "I'm not a mutant! I was bitten by a radioactive elephant." and the drowing people go, "Oh. Okay then." :lol:

 

[ourchair]

And I do sincerely hope that Omega red isn't popping up in USm too. If Baldy ultimises him then it has to be just him getting back at people that say he can't ultimise and doing characters that people are fond off out of spite.

I hardly think he operates on such a petty level. Yet. Give him a couple decades and he'll be John Byrneing bridges everywhere.

So Baldy has had this Invasion idea in his head for one and a half years.
I hope this is promising, I would really like that he's actually not so good because he does rush things and that he doesn't muck up this at all. It needs to be done well and 100% canon with no deaths. Can he manage that?

Unfortunately, Bendis having "the idea in his head for quite some time" doesn't mean squat, seeing as just about most stories --- good ones and bad ones alike --- seem to have been thought out for awhile.

Claiming that he's had Ultimate Invasion in mind for awhile is to me, a meaningless disclaimer and it's chances of being suck are equal to its chances of being rock.

 

[elfreo]

in regards to a new power, maybe the hulk learns he has a healing factor. if im not mistaken, i dont believe the ultimate hulk has ever had one. i remiember thor busted him up, and he kept comming, but i think thats only because he's a tuff SOB. or maybe its his power to see spirits. imagine the hulk seeing all the people he killed haunting him forever. also i think this might be the favor that wolvie spoke of in uxm 62.

 

[E]

Give him a couple decades and he'll be John Byrneing bridges everywhere.

We simply must use that phrase more often. :lol:

 

[ProjectX2]

Going with E's flashback idea...

Remember when Norman Osborn said the Hulk escaped to Uatu in U6? And they stopped him with Richard's gene collar or something like that? Maybe Wolverine tracks Hulk for Fury, and then the Ultimates save the day with the help of Reed Richards.

I'd prefer it in the future though.

 

[DIrishB]

From the panel report:

Finally, Quesada said Bryan Singer [with Brian K. Vaughan] and Steve McNiven's Ultimate X-Men story arc should hit sometime in summer of '06, which is a change from information given just last month in San Diego, when it was announced the Singer arc would begin this winter after the conclusion of the current "Magnetic North" story arc.

Anyone else notice this? So it went from December 2005 to Summer 2006? More delays. But whats this mean for the title? Magnetic North will end in November, so what can we expect from the title from December until Summer 2006? Will Vaughn stay on the title longer than expected (man I would gladly accept this), or will a fill-in writer come on for several months?

 

[DIrishB]

Going with E's flashback idea...

Remember when Norman Osborn said the Hulk escaped to Uatu in U6? And they stopped him with Richard's gene collar or something like that? Maybe Wolverine tracks Hulk for Fury, and then the Ultimates save the day with the help of Reed Richards.

I'd prefer it in the future though.

You meant Utah right? That could be an interesting idea. I'm just curious to find out more about the Ultimate Hulk vs. Wolverine mini.

 

[ProjectX2]

You meant Utah right? That could be an interesting idea. I'm just curious to find out more about the Ultimate Hulk vs. Wolverine mini.

Yeah, I meant Utah. Damn you Earth X!

And the panel said it's a flashback story. So I guess this may be it...

 

[DIrishB]

Yeah, I meant Utah. Damn you Earth X!

And the panel said it's a flashback story. So I guess this may be it...

I didn't even notice that, thats awesome news, I really hope this is at least features some flashback scenes.

 

[TheManWithoutFear]

Thinking about this in the shower before I went out tonight...

Is no one concerened about Logans role in the UU.... Yeah, there's no stopping him in the 616 ut Ultimate Wolverine involved with Ultimate Hulk is pushing it. He's already involved with...

1. Ultimate X-Men (that's a lot of characters)
2. Ultimate Spider-Man
3. Ultimate Black Widow
4. Ultimate Daredevil
5. Ultimat Nick Fury
6. Ultimat Captain America

Yoooooo, why do we need him with Ultimate Hulk

Still pissed about this

and no one seems to think that maybe this might end up as a "Wolverine working for Fury hunting down the HULK" mission?

 

[ProjectX2]

Thinking about this in the shower before I went out tonight...

Is no one concerened about Logans role in the UU.... Yeah, there's no stopping him in the 616 ut Ultimate Wolverine involved with Ultimate Hulk is pushing it. He's already involved with...

1. Ultimate X-Men (that's a lot of characters)
2. Ultimate Spider-Man
3. Ultimate Black Widow
4. Ultimate Daredevil
5. Ultimat Nick Fury
6. Ultimat Captain America

Yoooooo, why do we need him with Ultimate Hulk

Still pissed about this

and no one seems to think that maybe this might end up as a "Wolverine working for Fury hunting down the HULK" mission?

Agreeing with you.

Another point made on a site was that Queseda apparently mentioned that when Hulk went rampaging through New York the first time in UMTU, Wolverine was one of the agents sent after him...