Rom-Coms

Random said:
Well I really didn't see it that way, there was a lot more focus on Shaun growing as a character in all aspects of his life and the romance part was really secondary and played down compared to the rest. And Also, my professor, who is a professional movie critic, always says they way you can tell what a movie is about, look at the final shot which is
Shaun and Ed playing video games
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That is an interesting way to look at things... I think I will focus on the final shot in movies a lot more now.
 
ProjectX2 said:
That is an interesting way to look at things... I think I will focus on the final shot in movies a lot more now.
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Yeah, whenever he asks the class what the movie was about and no one answers, he just asks what was the final shot and someone will get it.
 
Random said:
Well I really didn't see it that way, there was a lot more focus on Shaun growing as a character in all aspects of his life and the romance part was really secondary and played down compared to the rest. And Also, my professor, who is a professional movie critic, always says they way you can tell what a movie is about, look at the final shot which is
Shaun and Ed playing video games
Click to expand...

You are right in that it is a maturation plot; the entire movie is Shaun trying to 'sort his life out', which he does by putting away all his childhood attachments (though he's allowed Ed provided he keeps it outside). However, the maturation plot is merged with the romance. Love stories are often merged with a character arcing plot, for example, GROUNDHOG DAY is an education plot (Phil Connors goes from being a cynical pessimist into a man capable of loving others) merged with a love story. Usually, the main character's entire life is changed as they grow up in some fashion through the loving relationship they have. This is true in A FISH CALLED WANDA and BRINGING UP BABY as well. But it's primarily a romantic comedy because the 'prize' as it were, the thing that makes him grow up, is a healthy relationship with Liz, which is the last action of the movie.

Speaking about the whole, "check the last scene - that tells you what the movie about", that's precisely what I did. Except, rather than looking at the last scene, you look at the last climactic action the protagonist takes. If you just use the 'last scene', that means THE BRIDGES OF MADISON COUNTY is about the Iowa landscape - that's all you see, shots of the Iowa landscape. It's not at all, it's about the romance of Clint Eastwood and Meryl Streep, and after their last scene, there's a five minute resolution focusing on Streep's children, and the movie certainly isn't about them. THE EMPIRE STRIKES BACK ends on a shot of a rebel fleet, but it's not about the rebel fleet, in so much as it's specifically about Luke Skywalker's role in the galaxy-spanning war. The final shot of JAWS is two people swimming for shore - the shark isn't even in it. And the final shot of THE RETURN OF THE KING is of a little hut in the Shire.

The principle is accurate - the most powerful moment at the end of the film tells you what it's about - but the specificity of 'the last shot' is inaccurate since, typically, most films will, after their powerful climactic action, have a couple of minutes of resolution that ties up all the loose ends. Typically, the last shots show you what sub-plots were left open and what things, outside the scope of the central plot or setting, are left unresolved. It contextualizes the ending and gives the audience to catch their breath and leave. In SHAUN OF THE DEAD, the most powerful moment at the end of the film is
Shaun's decision to enter the outside world, alone with Liz, leaving everything (and everyone) behind and not playing video games with Ed. That's just a coda, it's not a climax.
 
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Bass said:
You are right in that it is a maturation plot; the entire movie is Shaun trying to 'sort his life out', which he does by putting away all his childhood attachments (though he's allowed Ed provided he keeps it outside). However, the maturation plot is merged with the romance. Love stories are often merged with a character arcing plot, for example, GROUNDHOG DAY is an education plot (Phil Connors goes from being a cynical pessimist into a man capable of loving others) merged with a love story. Usually, the main character's entire life is changed as they grow up in some fashion through the loving relationship they have. This is true in A FISH CALLED WANDA and BRINGING UP BABY as well. But it's primarily a romantic comedy because the 'prize' as it were, the thing that makes him grow up, is a healthy relationship with Liz, which is the last action of the movie.

Speaking about the whole, "check the last scene - that tells you what the movie about", that's precisely what I did. Except, rather than looking at the last scene, you look at the last climactic action the protagonist takes. If you just use the 'last scene', that means THE BRIDGES OF MADISON COUNTY is about the Iowa landscape - that's all you see, shots of the Iowa landscape. It's not at all, it's about the romance of Clint Eastwood and Meryl Streep, and after their last scene, there's a five minute resolution focusing on Streep's children, and the movie certainly isn't about them. THE EMPIRE STRIKES BACK ends on a shot of a rebel fleet, but it's not about the rebel fleet, in so much as it's specifically about Luke Skywalker's role in the galaxy-spanning war. The final shot of JAWS is two people swimming for shore - the shark isn't even in it. And the final shot of THE RETURN OF THE KING is of a little hut in the Shire.

The principle is accurate - the most powerful moment at the end of the film tells you what it's about - but the specificity of 'the last shot' is inaccurate since, typically, most films will, after their powerful climactic action, have a couple of minutes of resolution that ties up all the loose ends. Typically, the last shots show you what sub-plots were left open and what things, outside the scope of the central plot or setting, are left unresolved. It contextualizes the ending and gives the audience to catch their breath and leave. In SHAUN OF THE DEAD, the most powerful moment at the end of the film is
Shaun's decision to enter the outside world, alone with Liz, leaving everything (and everyone) behind and not playing video games with Ed. That's just a coda, it's not a climax.
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You know what... too much text so **** it you win just because I don't feel like reading pass the first semicolon
 
I agree that the final shot isn't always the best way to judge what a movie is about(the example I was thinking of would be Back To The Future, another excellent romantic comedy), but I disagree with some of your examples. The final shot of Jaws is a perfect summation, because the movie isn't about sharks, it's about how people bond and clash under intense crisis.
 
BACK TO THE FUTURE is not a romantic comedy. Neither Marty nor Doc have any romantic desires. Yes, Marty tries to hook his mum and dad up, but his desire is not to get some booty. And Jennifer is a tertiary character. Only Doc has a proper romantic subplot and that's in the third film. It's a question of the story's structural focus. The romance is a small part of BACK TO THE FUTURE as opposed to the whole "preserve the future" and "get back to the future" plot lines.
 
Bass said:
BACK TO THE FUTURE is not a romantic comedy. Neither Marty nor Doc have any romantic desires. Yes, Marty tries to hook his mum and dad up, but his desire is not to get some booty. And Jennifer is a tertiary character. Only Doc has a proper romantic subplot and that's in the third film. It's a question of the story's structural focus. The romance is a small part of BACK TO THE FUTURE as opposed to the whole "preserve the future" and "get back to the future" plot lines.
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Agreed Again
 
... what are you talking about? At the end of the BACK TO THE FUTURE, Marty McFly's entire timeline has irrevocably altered for the better, and the next two films are him trying to keep it that way. He never even risks losing Jennifer once in all three films. They're relationship isn't even in conflict. And his parent's love is immaterial for two and three.
 
Bass said:
... what are you talking about? At the end of the BACK TO THE FUTURE, Marty McFly's entire timeline has irrevocably altered for the better, and the next two films are him trying to keep it that way. He never even risks losing Jennifer once in all three films. They're relationship isn't even in conflict. And his parent's love is immaterial for two and three.
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Who said anything about the sequels, or Jennifer?
 
Anyway, I think, looking at the first film as a self-contained movie, it's definitely as much a romantic comedy as it is a science-fiction film. For most of the film's screen time, Marty is analyzing George and Lorraine's feelings and emotionally directing them towards each other, with Doc's setting up of the lightning plan serving as a subplot.

I mean, saying "preserve the future" is the core of the film, more central to it than the love part .... they don't preserve it at all. They completely change it. Marty never gets back to his future. He gets "back" to a better one, because he was able to lead Lorraine to fall in real love with George(as opposed to the pity-love from before).

That's always been the heart of the movie to me. Time-travel is the glue.
 
Okay, I see what you mean. But it's not a love story. The protagonist, Marty, doesn't want love. He wants to live and get back home. It's an action adventure, not a love story because the main character doesn't want a romantic relationship. The conflict in the film isn't him trying to get a relationship, but to stay alive and return home.
 
Well lets see it this way, what's the final shot of Back to the Future? Doc, Marty, and Jennifer going on another adventure. So I'd say action adventure.
 
Planet-man said:
I think it gets viewed as unevolved because, with exceptions, any time a rom-com actually is really clever, breaks its boundaries, or is set anywhere other than modern-day New York or wherever, it isn't labeled as a rom-com any more. Groundhog Day is a rom-com. The Princess Bride is a rom-com. Enchanted, The 40 Year-Old-Virgin, etc. I think what you're talking about, and what a lot of people use rom-com synonomusly with these days, is the "date movie".
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I agree with this.



But I will say this. I do not think they are "the most unevolved film genre ever" IMO that would be the "Slasher" Movies. Really they all pretty much the same. At least Romantic comedies have evolved a little with films like "Definitely, Maybe" and "Love Actually" have taken to doing the Multiple story type feel to it. (ok Definitely, Maybe = one story but is presented in way that is kind of like multiple stories linking up)
 
ultimatedjf said:
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Very good point. :D

Random said:
Well lets see it this way, what's the final shot of Back to the Future? Doc, Marty, and Jennifer going on another adventure. So I'd say action adventure.
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Let's look at this way too: what's the greatest climactic action the protagonist takes? Driving the delorian into a lightning bolt. Action, baby.

SSJmole said:
I agree with this.

But I will say this. I do not think they are "the most unevolved film genre ever" IMO that would be the "Slasher" Movies. Really they all pretty much the same. At least Romantic comedies have evolved a little with films like "Definitely, Maybe" and "Love Actually" have taken to doing the Multiple story type feel to it. (ok Definitely, Maybe = one story but is presented in way that is kind of like multiple stories linking up)
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Isn't ALIEN a slasher movie? Isn't THE SHINING and THE TERMINATOR?
 
My favorite Rom-Com is Wet Latin Butts 8.

The quiet evolution of the relationship between Tawny and Asia is one of the most subtle and touching relationships in the history of film.
 
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