Ultimate FF TPB Vol. 6 : Frightful

[Jack of Hearts]

In the big scheme of things, it was a good read, but I do have questions...

So the Chitauri are renegade Skrulls? Hmmm. OK. So let me see if I have this right. The Super-Skrull first showed up on Earth 500 years ago and it was actually Ben Grimm in some damaged alien armor? I'm not liking that angle much. The tech level of the Skrulls (their super-nifty pill) bothers me a bit too. That opens a can of worms because now we have to wonder why the heck they don't use that pill all of the time.

Thank goodness those stupid zombies are finally gone. Zombie Reed's escape plan could have been concocted by any 10 year old and the very notion that the Baxter Building security could fall for it is ridiculous.

Doom's changes were interesting. His nobility is an angle that seems to come and go when convenient in the mainstream Marvel Universe. I'm not especially keen on the idea that he's already mastered Atlantean sorcery, but I'll go with it and see how it goes. Readers of the regular series probably already know how he gets back to the Ultimate universe, but I'll be interested to see that one. I would think it'll have to involve the sorcery since Reed has already scientifically determined that the planets were shifting out of convergence.

 

[E]

The tech level of the Skrulls (their super-nifty pill) bothers me a bit too. That opens a can of worms because now we have to wonder why the heck they don't use that pill all of the time.

Not sure what you mean. They DO use it all the time, but they pretty much can only use it once in each world.

Zombie Reed's escape plan could have been concocted by any 10 year old and the very notion that the Baxter Building security could fall for it is ridiculous.

That's the point.

 

[Jack of Hearts]

Maybe I didn't really state my position on the Skrull pill very well. First of all, if we assume that an entire population WON'T get suckered into taking the pill, what's to keep the Skrulls from just putting it in the water supply? With this pill, I don't see why the Skrulls haven't taken over all known space. That's a very potent bio-weapon. And then there's the anti-assassination suit. Are we to assume that only one was ever made and then the inventor died and it could never be duplicated? And how did Ben's arm become all orange and rocky when he jumped back in time since there wasn't a Thing to mimic? I don't know, the whole thing just seems so contrived so that Millar could set up that one moment where Ben takes down the Super-Skrull.

And then there's the Frightfully Dull Four and the pen trick. Let's assume for the moment that the security believes that Reed COULD have made such a teleporter. I'll give you that one. But if you just saw a highly dangerous group of 4 villains teleport away... what is the POINT of rushing in to look at the spot where they were standing? And you're going to tell me that cell didn't have a 1001 kinds of sensors watching it? Radar is only ONE obvious way to find Sue. AND you see the four of them vanish, a power you KNOW that they have. Aren't you a little suspicious? No, again, it seems like Millar just wanted to set up his little joke where Reed faked others out and he didn't care about any of the obvious flaws in his story.

Here's another one for you. Doom and Reed's mind switch. Does it make sense that Reed knows all of the Atlantean sorcery that Doom did? Should we assume he'll just forget it all when he switches back to his own body? Again, a silly mistake which Millar could have easily avoided. I also wonder how Reed deduced the super-vomit power without ever having seen it done before, but I digress.

 

[omega234]

First of all, if we assume that an entire population WON'T get suckered into taking the pill, what's to keep the Skrulls from just putting it in the water supply? With this pill, I don't see why the Skrulls haven't taken over all known space.

Actually Super Skrull said, they took over so many planets he lost count. They were mentioning numbers of fifty thousand, a hundred thousand, a million and for a very long time.

And then there's the anti-assassination suit. Are we to assume that only one was ever made and then the inventor died and it could never be duplicated?

Why would they need more than one? When was the last time they failed to conquer a world before Ben Grimm pulled what was left of Super Skrull out of that suit? Besides, I got the idea that his highness wanted to be the only super alien around.

But if you just saw a highly dangerous group of 4 villains teleport away... what is the POINT of rushing in to look at the spot where they were standing?

For one, they believed that Reed could make such a device but even with what was said, they were not certain what happened. They were trying to secure the area (even hit the alarms before they went in). So the answer to one of your later questions is that yes, they were suspicious but unfortunately they underestimated Reed's ingenuity.

And you're going to tell me that cell didn't have a 1001 kinds of sensors watching it?

Are you telling me there was no way Sue could of manipulated those sensors? Particularly with Reed's brains behind it? Let's not forget, this Fantastic Four is older and more experienced with their abilities.

Does it make sense that Reed knows all of the Atlantean sorcery that Doom did? Should we assume he'll just forget it all when he switches back to his own body? Again, a silly mistake which Millar could have easily avoided. I also wonder how Reed deduced the super-vomit power without ever having seen it done before, but I digress.

The same way Doom did. How did Doom find out that he could do it? Not to mention, Reed has seen it before or at least a variation of it. Also Reed did not know all the Atlantean sorcery.

 

[jack]

The same way Doom did. How did Doom find out that he could do it? Not to mention, Reed has seen it before or at least a variation of it. Also Reed did not know all the Atlantean sorcery.

Plus Reed's super stretchy brain power that lets him "adapt" to solve any probelm, like memorizing Atlantean sorcery

 

[E]

Plus Reed's super stretchy brain power that lets him "adapt" to solve any probelm

Was that idea formally mentioned in the book? What issue?

 

[omega234]

Was that idea formally mentioned in the book? What issue?

Ultimate Fantastic Four #25, I think.

 

[jack]

The one after Namor was released, Ms Storm suggested it

 

[E]

OK, thanks. I thought I remembered it but couldn't recall when it happened.

This is interesting given the revelation of Randall Dowling by John Stone in Planetary #25.

Now I can't remember which issue came out first.

 

[Jack of Hearts]

Why would they need more than one? When was the last time they failed to conquer a world before Ben Grimm pulled what was left of Super Skrull out of that suit? Besides, I got the idea that his highness wanted to be the only super alien around.

That's plausible, but I just thought of another reason which I like. The suit seems to do more than replicate the powers. It seems to accumulate them, so that the Super-Skrull would have the combined strength of all of the superheroes. If that's the case, you probably couldn't have more than one suit within range of another because it'd create an infinite loop which would overload both suits.

For one, they believed that Reed could make such a device but even with what was said, they were not certain what happened. They were trying to secure the area (even hit the alarms before they went in). So the answer to one of your later questions is that yes, they were suspicious but unfortunately they underestimated Reed's ingenuity.

I considered that angle, but it still doesn't sit well with me. If they were suspicious, if there was ANY chance that the zombie FF might still be in that room, why would they go in? It'd be an obvious suicide move no matter how wary those guards were. However, it seems apparent to me that they DID intend to enter the room anyway, to take away their puzzle books and such. I see absolutely nothing that would indicate they could have hoped to even survive that 'expedition'. If I'm to accept that they had some super-secret means to survive their planned entry, I'll have to accept that they thought it'd be enough to protect them when they secured the area. That explains the guards motivations, but it leaves me wondering how they thought they'd possibly survive entering in the first place.

Plus Reed's super stretchy brain power that lets him "adapt" to solve any probelm, like memorizing Atlantean sorcery

But he wouldn't have that stretchy brain power in Doom's body, right?

Here's another one for you : When the Ben/SS popped back in time the first time, why was his arm becoming orange and rocky?

 

[E]

That's plausible, but I just thought of another reason which I like. The suit seems to do more than replicate the powers. It seems to accumulate them, so that the Super-Skrull would have the combined strength of all of the superheroes. If that's the case, you probably couldn't have more than one suit within range of another because it'd create an infinite loop which would overload both suits.

Give this guy a No-Prize!

 

[jack]

But he wouldn't have that stretchy brain power in Doom's body, right?

Here's another one for you : When the Ben/SS popped back in time the first time, why was his arm becoming orange and rocky?

Well I believe the exact line from DoomReed was "Swapping BRAINS with your worst enemy.." so I was under the assumption that he did. Different interpretations :wink: As for the Ben/SS situation, maybe the suit has a memory function? Or if the suit does indeed accumulate powers as you suggest, problem solved

 

[Jack of Hearts]

Swapping BRAINS? I don't know. That seems the be the domain of pseudo-science surgery. Sorcery is more in line with MIND swapping.

I don't follow you on your explanation of the orange and rocky arm. Can you lay it out a bit more for me? I don't see how a memory function or an accumulation function affects this.

 

[jack]

Checked the issue, DoomReed says brains. With the suit, I meant if it can replicate powers then why not let it remember those powers and replicate any power at any time? If crazy aliens invading earth and giving superpowers like candy makes sense, I figure that makes sense too

EDIT: Unless you mean that Ben's ACTUAL arm and not the suits arm starts to change, then I have no explanation whatsoever. I don't have the President Thor arc in front of me, just the Frightful Four

 

[omega234]

I considered that angle, but it still doesn't sit well with me. If they were suspicious, if there was ANY chance that the zombie FF might still be in that room, why would they go in?

Because they had to consider more than one worse case scenario and again, they had to be certain which they were not. The situation was very dangerous but they could not afford to not take any chances. They had to act quickly and that's why they had their weapons out. Also, just guessing here but they would have called on the UFF but they were away and Johnny was in the hospital.

 

[Jack of Hearts]

Checked the issue, DoomReed says brains. With the suit, I meant if it can replicate powers then why not let it remember those powers and replicate any power at any time? If crazy aliens invading earth and giving superpowers like candy makes sense, I figure that makes sense too

EDIT: Unless you mean that Ben's ACTUAL arm and not the suits arm starts to change, then I have no explanation whatsoever. I don't have the President Thor arc in front of me, just the Frightful Four

No, there's no memory in the suit. Otherwise Ben would never have been able to take the Super-Skrull down.

It's the suit's arm that changes into a 'Thing'-arm. It doesn't make any sense to me that it'd do that. <shrug>

 

[jack]

No, there's no memory in the suit. Otherwise Ben would never have been able to take the Super-Skrull down.

It's the suit's arm that changes into a 'Thing'-arm. It doesn't make any sense to me that it'd do that. <shrug>

Point conceded

 

[Hellsbuttmonkey]

Picked up this volume today. Forgot how much I loved Doom in Frightful!

Then I suggest you reset your watch, Mrs Storm. Doctor Doom does NOT make mistakes...

Best line ever......

 

[Hibiki]

Picked up this volume today. Forgot how much I loved Doom in Frightful!

Then I suggest you reset your watch, Mrs Storm. Doctor Doom does NOT make mistakes...

Best line ever......

I read this yesterday. Total awesome

 

[Hellsbuttmonkey]

It was probably the best of all six UFF volumes. President Thor was really good, but Frightful was the crown jewel. Doom was awesome (albeit missing his goat legs), the interaction between Doom and Reed was brilliant, and Doom's sacrifice, and final line was really well done.
I loved the fact that Doom wanted to swap bodies not because he wanted what Reed had, but because he wanted to take what he had away from him.