That's a great way to put it.Caduceus said:I wouldn't say he's a jerk, more that he's a full blown bad guy. He hasn't been watered down by the consistent reinvention and redefining of the 616 version. He hasn't been good then bad then dead then a baby then a bad baby then good then bad and so on. He is, in my opinion, a more powerful character because of it. He's convinced he's right and he's doing what he can to achieve his goals.
Caduceus said:I wouldn't say he's a jerk, more that he's a full blown bad guy. He hasn't been watered down by the consistent reinvention and redefining of the 616 version. He hasn't been good then bad then dead then a baby then a bad baby then good then bad and so on. He is, in my opinion, a more powerful character because of it. He's convinced he's right and he's doing what he can to achieve his goals.
Earlier, I'd have agreed with you. The moral debate inherent in his character would be interesting if it hadn't been dragged out, carried on and overused to the point of death. At this point in time, 616 Magneto has been good, bad, good with shades of bad, bad with shades of good, inbetween completely and everything in between. He's not evolving as a character, he's just flipping around from side to side.The Overlord said:I must disagree, Magneto as a gray character is more interesting and complex, then Magneto as a evil caricature. Ultimate Magneto comes off as being as complex as the villain from a bad action movie, he is just another boring, one dimensional, racist psychopath. He does nasty things for seemly no reason, killing the Animal evolutionaries and wishing that his wife has died in child birth. I mean when Quicksilver joins the Ultimates and Magneto blows his knee caps off, is there any reason given for his extreme response, besides the fact that he is evil. Personally I think the gray area Magneto is more realistic and interesting than Ultimate Magneto.
The Overlord said:I mean when Quicksilver joins the Ultimates and Magneto blows his knee caps off, is there any reason given for his extreme response,
René said:His son has just betrayed him, that's why.
I have to disagree with you. I think this Magneto is just as good as the 616 Magento.
What about when Xavier put the mental blocks in him? When see a Magento that is a pacisfist and not as bad. So the duality of the character is still there, but Magento is more of a badass than a good guy.
The Overlord said:Why is Ultimate Magneto such a jerk? It seems to me that instead of being Malcolm X like he was 616 MU, he is like Osama Bin Laden. He comes as a hateful, one dimensional, psychopath. Does anyone know why that is?
The Overlord said:The pacisfist Magneto was merely created by Xavier and thus is not a true extension of the character. Has Magneto ever become pacisfist since regaining his memory.
MaxwellSmart said:I disagree with the notion that Ultimate Magneto doesn't have any depth. When we first see his history he isn't a human killer. He was a man who simply thought of humans the way human think of apes. As humans became more vicious they lost his indifference and gained his wrath.
I think the problem is we're equating depth with moral uncertainty. Which is totally fallacious notion to me. That's like saying a neurotic superhero like Spider-Man is necessarily more "complex" than a resolute one like Batman or Superman.TheManWithoutFear said:Agreed. Who the hell sad Ultmate Magneto had no depth?
I DO think that it can be mistaken for that fact. I agree. But my point is that not all "two-dimensional" monochromatic characters are completely shallow.Goodwill said:I see what you're saying, but you don't think that can be mistaken for the fact that Millar writes characters one way or another? In all my days reading comics, there is no grey area with characters. Sure, in the Ultimates, he's got a lot of colorful people in that book, but there intentions are all the same...