Ultimate Marvel Timeline / Chronology (v 5.0)

[DIrishB]

Updated for Survive #1 and Ultimate Comics: All-New Spider-Man #200.

Will be back to regular updates now that the relaunch is underway.

 

[DIrishB]

Updated for All-New Ultimates #1.

 

[wyokid]

That can't seriously be where All-New X-Men's current arc takes place.

 

[the watcher]

Not sure if you know already but there is a small prequel story to spider-verse in the free comic book day guardians of the galaxy issue.

 

[DIrishB]

Not sure if you know already but there is a small prequel story to spider-verse in the free comic book day guardians of the galaxy issue.

Does it feature Miles or any of the other Ultimate universe characters?

 

[the watcher]

No, just Murlun, Spider (1602) and Mairon Jane Watsonne. (1602).

 

[DIrishB]

No, just Murlun, Spider (1602) and Mairon Jane Watsonne. (1602).

Ok, that's what I figured. No reason to include it on the timeline then. Appreciate the heads up, though.

The approach I take with the timeline is to only directly include entries that take place in the Ultimate universe (most of the entries), feature Ultimate characters in other universes (a few of the Ultimate Fantastic Four stories, Miles in Spider-Man, Ultimate Doom in Marvel Zombies, Spider-verse tie ins which feature Miles or Jessica, etc), or which act as a direct continuation of one of those situations (Marvel Zombies 2, the Deapool comic entries, and etc).

If I start using the extended degrees of separation, it would make the timeline unruly and near impossible to follow.

On that note I do need to update it, given its been several months since the last update, but I was waiting on the ongoing (MM-USM) to finish its run and the associated Secret Wars issues to come out so I could do one huge final update.

I'm still unsure if I'll continue it with Miles' appearances in 616 (or whatever they call it once Secret Wars are done), though I may.

 

[DIrishB]

Just updated for the first time in 4-5 months. Updated for all the current issues of MM-USM, the final issues of the horrible All-New Ultimates (thank God that's over), and all the All-New X-Men and Spider-verse crossovers featuring Ultimate characters, as well as the current running arc in Avengers. Added tentative placements for the remaining upcoming issues through Secret Wars and Ultimate End.

Finally, the end is in sight. After over ten years (think I've been doing it since 2003, and posted it here in 2004), I'm almost done with this timeline.

And while a wistful part of me is sad to see the Ultimate universe end, there's a bigger part that's glad its almost over, since the quality level has dropped so much since the early days. MM-USM is still good, and I'm sure I'll read Miles' adventures in the 616 universe, and may include those in the timeline... maybe not. We'll see.

That can't seriously be where All-New X-Men's current arc takes place.

I just did an update and moved it, now that I've read the ending of All-New Ultimates and the most current issues of MM-USM. Should work now.

Also, I placed the entire run of MM-USM after Spider-verse since in the first issue of Spider-verse (ASM #9) Miles mentions his dad is still gone, which must place it before the end of MM-USM #7 when his dad returns and they reconcile... and since the first six issues happen one after the other and #7 picks up the next day, there's no break to insert the Spider-verse stuff, thus it must happen before.

 

[PureMitch]

Woohoo! It'll be nice to actually feel like this timeline is "complete". I'll stop collecting the comics as well. You've done such a kick ass job on this thing.

 

[DIrishB]

Woohoo! It'll be nice to actually feel like this timeline is "complete". I'll stop collecting the comics as well. You've done such a kick ass job on this thing.

Thanks, man. I think I posted the first version of this timeline a month or two after I joined the forum, so it's coming up on 11 years I'll have been updating it and working on it once the Ultimate verse finally ends.

 

[DIrishB]

Updated for Miles Morales - The Ultimate Spider-Man #11 and Avengers #42.

 

[Matten]

Hello there Timeline guy!

I created a reading order based on your Ultimate Marvel Timeline, and now reading through it. I'm here to possibly help in your work by pointing out any wierd contradictions during my read to improve the timeline further, and also to get a little insight on why you did it the way it is now. I should note that I'm NOT reading it page-by-page, as it is presented in your timeline, I just put every issue in order taking the "present day" happenings in the issue into consideration while securing it's place in the continuity. So it is possible that I didn't see something because it happened in a flashback in an issue from much later.
I'm currently in Year 0, and just finished Ultimate X-Men #7. So here are some of the contradictions I found so far.

1. In Ultimate Fantastic Four #5, page 5 Doctor Storm yells at Johnny not to go fight the giant monster and "Let The Ultimates handle it". According to your timeline the Ultimates hasn't been assembled yet.
2. In Ultimate Spider-Man #6, page 14 Peter Parker says "This can't be how Captain America does it!" The sentence is in present tense, altough the Cap hasn't been defrozen and put back to action yet by this point.
3. In Ultimate Marvel Team-Up #1, page 27 one of the citizens mentions the Sentintels who are actually making their debut on the first pages of Ultimate X-Men #1.
4. Ultimate Marvel Team-Up #11 happens after USM #16 I'm sure, but it cannot happen BEFORE Ultimate X-Men #7, because Wolverine leaves for Weapon X in #6 and arrives in #7. Therefore he cannot be present in Ultimate Marvel Team-Up #11.

That's all I found so far, I hope you don't mind my nitpicking. I'm really looking forward for your reply.

Thanks for your work!

 

[DIrishB]

Hello there Timeline guy!

I created a reading order based on your Ultimate Marvel Timeline, and now reading through it. I'm here to possibly help in your work by pointing out any wierd contradictions during my read to improve the timeline further, and also to get a little insight on why you did it the way it is now. I should note that I'm NOT reading it page-by-page, as it is presented in your timeline, I just put every issue in order taking the "present day" happenings in the issue into consideration while securing it's place in the continuity. So it is possible that I didn't see something because it happened in a flashback in an issue from much later.
I'm currently in Year 0, and just finished Ultimate X-Men #7. So here are some of the contradictions I found so far.

1. In Ultimate Fantastic Four #5, page 5 Doctor Storm yells at Johnny not to go fight the giant monster and "Let The Ultimates handle it". According to your timeline the Ultimates hasn't been assembled yet.
2. In Ultimate Spider-Man #6, page 14 Peter Parker says "This can't be how Captain America does it!" The sentence is in present tense, altough the Cap hasn't been defrozen and put back to action yet by this point.
3. In Ultimate Marvel Team-Up #1, page 27 one of the citizens mentions the Sentintels who are actually making their debut on the first pages of Ultimate X-Men #1.
4. Ultimate Marvel Team-Up #11 happens after USM #16 I'm sure, but it cannot happen BEFORE Ultimate X-Men #7, because Wolverine leaves for Weapon X in #6 and arrives in #7. Therefore he cannot be present in Ultimate Marvel Team-Up #11.

That's all I found so far, I hope you don't mind my nitpicking. I'm really looking forward for your reply.

Thanks for your work!

The Ultimate universe has a number of continuity problems, even early on.

The FF/Ultimates thing was a blatant screw up on Bendis/Millar's part (that specific question has been asked and that was essentially the answer).

Same applies to most others. Ultimately (see what I did there), you'll likely see why I placed certain things in the order they're in once you've read further.

Another screw up was the fact the original Ultimate Fantastic Four were exactly like their 616 counterparts when first seen in Ultimate Marvel Team Up. In fact I believe the FF are mentioned in the first Ultimates run as well, hence you can't have them both have been created first (in Ultimates, I think they reference the FF in one of the early issues, as they already existed... but this was before the Ultimates were technically created so one must be a mistake.

 

[Matten]

Yeah, I'm aware of Team-Up #9 not being canon, it's not included in my reading order. To my knowledge Team-Up #4-5 with Iron Man isn't canon either because of the suit and the backstory (also it was kinda Silver Age-ish and silly XD). So I'm not really taking into account those.
Thank you for your answer. So basically what you're saying is that you are well aware of these problems, and took them into consideration while creating this timeline. Well that should've been obvious to me. But I just love pointing these out, and I feel like your answers to these questions are enchancing the experience.

So thank you for your time, I'll be back once I dug myself much deeper into the books. Probably after I finished Ultimatum.
Thank you for your work!

PS.: I see what you did there

 

[DIrishB]

Yeah, I'm aware of Team-Up #9 not being canon, it's not included in my reading order. To my knowledge Team-Up #4-5 with Iron Man isn't canon either because of the suit and the backstory (also it was kinda Silver Age-ish and silly XD). So I'm not really taking into account those.

UMTU #4-5 I believe are still meant to be canon. It's been a long time since I read that early stuff, so I'm fuzzy oh the details of each issue. Stylistically I know it doesn't match up (the Silver Age type artwork as you said), but it's merely a stylistic approach, not necessarily a determining factor on its canonicity or not. Different artists portray characters differently (in terms of physical appearance based on the artists' own personal styles and influences, etc). If we were to use that same logic you are, does that mean, to account for the different "looks" Peter Parker has when drawn by different artists (as well as every other character), are we to assume they're all undergoing some degree of cosmetic surgery and hair style changes between every different artist?

I'm only messing with you, but just to make the point that the art style doesn't necessarily make it non-canon just because it's got that Silver Age look.

Thank you for your answer. So basically what you're saying is that you are well aware of these problems, and took them into consideration while creating this timeline.

Exactly.

If anything, if it's not too much trouble, I'd ask you to keep track of any continuity glitches like that so that I can offer detailed explanations for those problems with small links where they occur (to a footnote type explanation). It's something I always meant to do but just never got around to sitting down and re-reading the universe in its entirety.

That would offer immediate answers to many of those problems.

Well that should've been obvious to me. But I just love pointing these out, and I feel like your answers to these questions are enchancing the experience.

No worries. And I appreciate your interest. It's really encouraging to know people enjoy and use my various timelines. Keeps me at it!

So thank you for your time, I'll be back once I dug myself much deeper into the books. Probably after I finished Ultimatum.
Thank you for your work!

Please, chime in regularly. Like I said, any continuity problems you notice, let me know, and I can explain it. Then I'll collate all those explanations and add footnote tag links (like a wiki page) to explain why I placed things as I did.

Ultimately (did it again), there's sometimes no valid explanation requiring the reader to come up with their own explanations.

I merely attempted to keep those continuity problems to a minimum with this timeline.

PS.: I see what you did there

 

[Matten]

UMTU #4-5 I believe are still meant to be canon. It's been a long time since I read that early stuff, so I'm fuzzy oh the details of each issue. Stylistically I know it doesn't match up (the Silver Age type artwork as you said), but it's merely a stylistic approach, not necessarily a determining factor on its canonicity or not. Different artists portray characters differently (in terms of physical appearance based on the artists' own personal styles and influences, etc). If we were to use that same logic you are, does that mean, to account for the different "looks" Peter Parker has when drawn by different artists (as well as every other character), are we to assume they're all undergoing some degree of cosmetic surgery and hair style changes between every different artist?

I'm only messing with you, but just to make the point that the art style doesn't necessarily make it non-canon just because it's got that Silver Age look.

It's not the art-style, it's the writing. The way Tony's backstory is handled, and the fact that one of Earths mightiest superhero and biggest brain gets instantly deactivated without any explanation just so the main character can take the spotlight is not really Bendis-esque, it sounds like something from the Silver Age. It was alright, I enjoyed it, but the dialogues were so simplistic and over-the-top like it was written in the sixties. I believe it's an intentional flavor they wanted to add.
I say it's not canon, because the Marvel wiki states so. I only read it because you included it.

Thank you for your interest, I'll be back later then!

 

[DIrishB]

It's not the art-style, it's the writing. The way Tony's backstory is handled, and the fact that one of Earths mightiest superhero and biggest brain gets instantly deactivated without any explanation just so the main character can take the spotlight is not really Bendis-esque, it sounds like something from the Silver Age. It was alright, I enjoyed it, but the dialogues were so simplistic and over-the-top like it was written in the sixties. I believe it's an intentional flavor they wanted to add.

Fair enough. I'd forgotten about the back story mentions, but again, I know there was a way of explaining away the differences. Essentially it's just a case of trying to make it all work.

I say it's not canon, because the Marvel wiki states so. I only read it because you included it.

Thank you for your interest, I'll be back later then!

I didn't realize the Marvel wiki claimed it was non-canon. I wonder if that's an official position (stated by an editor on the Ultimates line or Bendis himself), or just an assumption based on the fact the Tony origin is different (more like the 616 1960's origin I believe).

I think I explained it away as being a PR story crafted around Tony by his company or something that was fed to the public.

As for UMTU #4-5 not being canon, I just looked it up on Marvel Wiki. It claims UMTU #4-5 takes place on Earth-TRN526. If you check out that page it's clearly listed as an unofficial reality number (I presume TRN means "temporary reality number" or something along those lines). So essentially the fans are just assigning random alternate reality classifications until Marvel reveals official names/numerical designations (like 616-the regular Marvel universe, and 1610-the Ultimate universe).

They're also misreading the answer given about the different origins for Iron Man given (Card's UIM minis are already considered an alternate reality or TV show within the 1610 universe). The actual quote, from 2011 Comic Con:

A fan confused by the status of Orson Scott Card's "Ultimate Iron Man" series and the original origin of Iron Man in "Ultimate Spider-Man Super Special" and what version would count as the actual origin of the Armored Avenger was looking for answers. "While the Orson Scott Card series was great, it didn't match up with where we were going," Amanat said. The just arrived C.B. Cebulski admitted that in the early days of the Ultimate Universe, Marvel "didn't always know what we were doing" and that the specific origin was one place where things didn't match up. "We used to have No Prizes to figure this stuff out," he added.

It's a pretty big leap in logic to take that to mean the issue is non-canon. Tony's origin as given in it, sure, but the rest is canon. And as I said, the Tony origin as recounted by Peter can be explained as a PR twist on what actually happened. Maybe it polled better?

It's almost always possible to find a way to explain away problems like that. Almost always... sometimes not, though.

 

[Matten]

Yeah, I get what you're saying. But there's also a Latverian Ambassador working for a dictator (allegedly Van Damme), which should be a bankrupt Third World country at this point if I'm not mistaken negotiating with Stark, AND with a Nick Fury (with hair) in UMTU#4-5.
That's enough inconsistency for me to render it non-canon.

 

[DIrishB]

Yeah, I get what you're saying. But there's also a Latverian Ambassador working for a dictator (allegedly Van Damme),

Allegedly, not confirmed.

which should be a bankrupt Third World country at this point

Even bankrupt Third World countries have ambassadors... usually, anyway.

if I'm not mistaken negotiating with Stark,

Perhaps for weapons... as a precursor to "aggressive expansion". Who is to say that mindset didn't dominate Latverian government even before Doom's arrival? Even as a bankrupt country, perhaps they had mineral deposits or some other natural resource that was there, they just didn't have the infrastructure to profit from it. And Tony could help with that... etc.

It's a reach, granted, but the timeline is meant to be as comprehensive as possible, hence their inclusion.

AND with a Nick Fury (with hair) in UMTU#4-5.

That's not a big deal. If it had been Nick Fury with both eyes, that would stand out.

That's enough inconsistency for me to render it non-canon.

I agree it's wonky as hell, but as you continue, you'll find MANY more such problems (though many not so big and blaring).

It's the reality of the comic industry. Hundreds of issues (or thousands), written by scores of different writers with likely thousands of different plot threads and characters. Mistakes are bound to happen, and it's just a sign that they hadn't sat down and considered the bigger world they wanted to build at that point.

 

[DIrishB]

Updated for Secret Wars #3.