Ultimate Nightmare Ultimizations

Nurhachi

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Hey, what all ultimizations happened in Ultimate Nightmare?

The obvious ones were Falcon, Vision and Red Guardian, but what other ones were there?

I heard about Unicorn and Crimson Dynamo, but were they confirmed to be those characters or was that just speculation? and was there anyone else?
 

Goodwill

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Well, you've named all of the characters that were allegedly in the mini-series, however, no names were confirmed, so we really don't know. I didn't notice any other characters, however, I couldn't have recognized Unicorn, so who am I to tell you there weren't anymore?
 

E

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Nurhachi said:
Hey, what all ultimizations happened in Ultimate Nightmare?

The obvious ones were Falcon, Vision and Red Guardian, but what other ones were there?

I heard about Unicorn and Crimson Dynamo, but were they confirmed to be those characters or was that just speculation? and was there anyone else?

Unicorn, Crimson Dynamo, & Red Guardian were not confirmed by name, at least not in the comic. And it is beneath Warren Ellis to talk about his Marvel work, so if he hasn't said anything about it he probably won't.
 

ourchair

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UltimateE said:
And it is beneath Warren Ellis to talk about his Marvel work, so if he hasn't said anything about it he probably won't.
Hehehe, you speak the truth. I wish Grant Morrison would write for the Ultimate line, if only because he gives the wackiest interviews explaining his work: often a confusing mix in which you can't tell when he's kidding or not.

Which I LIKE. I care less about the REASONS behind Morrison's/Ellis' work than I do what they have to say about it. :D
 

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ourchair said:
I care less about the REASONS behind Morrison's/Ellis' work than I do what they have to say about it. :D

Agreed.

I'm subscribed to Ellis's email newsletter and unless I've missed it, he hasn't said anything about the delay in Ultimate Secret, other than saying he's had "bad luck" lately with scheduling or something along those lines; it was never mentioned by name. I would argue that Secret is probably his highest profile work right now; why wouldn't he at least address it? Or thank Bendis for explaining it?

Anyway, let me steer back on top before I go off on a rant. I just hate elitism.
 

ourchair

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UltimateE said:
Anyway, let me steer back on top before I go off on a rant. I just hate elitism.
Well, I don't mean to encourage that rant if you think its something you don't want to go into, but if you're suggesting what I think you're suggesting: I agree.

As much as I like a lot of what Ellis does, I also hate a lot what Ellis does, which is namely, take a big freaking poop on mainstream superhero comics and comics storytelling in general. The sad part is, he sort of has a point, it just doesn't entitle him to be so unequivocal and unapologetic about that.

I only forgive him once in awhile because even though Ellis can get derivative, he's pushing ideas into comics in general that few else are pursuing (not in terms of layout or the rules of the medium, but in terms of content) but its his precise brand of cynicism that I believe is holding back his work on Marvel.
 

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ourchair said:
Well, I don't mean to encourage that rant if you think its something you don't want to go into, but if you're suggesting what I think you're suggesting: I agree.

As much as I like a lot of what Ellis does, I also hate a lot what Ellis does, which is namely, take a big freaking poop on mainstream superhero comics and comics storytelling in general. The sad part is, he sort of has a point, it just doesn't entitle him to be so unequivocal and unapologetic about that.

I only forgive him once in awhile because even though Ellis can get derivative, he's pushing ideas into comics in general that few else are pursuing (not in terms of layout or the rules of the medium, but in terms of content) but its his precise brand of cynicism that I believe is holding back his work on Marvel.

You nailed it, and...

his precise brand of cynicism that I believe is holding back his work on Marvel

...sums it up perfectly. UFF could have been insanely good if he would have at least pretended to get over his elitist disgust with working on a superhero book.

When you only do a job, whatever vocation, for money and not because you like it, it shows in the final product. Compare with Millar's almost over-the-top enthusiasm for Ultimates 2 and the quality of the final product.
 

marvelman

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... Which was also frickin amazing.

I too believe that Ultimate FF coulda been better as of late, however, I have never before read Ellis and must say I did enjoy it to an extent.
 

Goodwill

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Ellis, before the characters started showing up, said that he'd be ultimizing a lot of characters in Ultimate Nightmare, which prompted the discussion of which Russian characters could show up. I think he intended the characters to be who we thought they were...
 

ourchair

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Goodwill said:
Ellis, before the characters started showing up, said that he'd be ultimizing a lot of characters in Ultimate Nightmare, which prompted the discussion of which Russian characters could show up. I think he intended the characters to be who we thought they were...
I wish Ellis would stay to work with the Ultimate U in some capacity or another. In spite of the flaws of his mentioned, I DO THINK he does a good job of introducing Ultimate-style quirks and characterizations in spite of his attitude. It's one of the only unquestionably good reasons why I like UFF in the first place.
 

ourchair

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UltimateE said:
UFF could have been insanely good if he would have at least pretended to get over his elitist disgust with working on a superhero book.

When you only do a job, whatever vocation, for money and not because you like it, it shows in the final product. Compare with Millar's almost over-the-top enthusiasm for Ultimates 2 and the quality of the final product.
Which is why I'm looking forward to Millar. I'm totally going to miss the pseudo-science and I'm not too hot on the idea of Ellis' smartypants dialogue being replaced with the self-narrating style that Millar is prone to using.

But Millar will most certainly be infusing this with the wacky over the top ness that is his trademark. Which is what UFF needs. The idea of fights at the end of time, beginning of time, being lost inside the bowels of a Presidents internal organs, large scale destruction caused by scientific mishap and cosmic anomalies are not only things that seem well suited to the book.
 

cmdrjanjalani

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Regarding the names, there are a lot of Ultimate characters who are never really properly named so that can't be used as basis. Shocker, Carnage, Hobgoblin and many others have never been referred to as their 616 counterparts, but it's pretty obvious from their appearance.

I like Ellis' writing, the psuedo-scientific explanations he gives to explain certain super powers and stuff is amusing. It would be cool if he would able to come up with some great explanations regarding mutants, OZ and the rest of the super-humans. I don't like his decompression though, makes the story drag too long. If I wasn't a diehard Ultimate Universe completist, I probably would have lost interest in some of Ellis' books.
 

Goodwill

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I think you guys bring up some good differences between Ellis and Millar and how they write, but keep in mind they are both quite effective with what they've written, no matter if Ellis liked writing it or not. You can tell that Ellis didn't like the whole super hero deal through the dialogue in a fight and with a villain, however, that can be ignored because of the shocking science behind what he's created... That made it interesting and he really made an impression on how the FF function with their powers. Has that been done in the 616 universe? I don't think so. Also, Millar does tend to write more enthusiastically and tells the story through the dialogue, which doesn't really make for a smart read (He's really not allowing his audience to put it together themselves), but it's entertaining as all get out, which is something of a feat in my opinion, especially in the politically correct UU.
 

ourchair

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cmdrjanjalani said:
Regarding the names, there are a lot of Ultimate characters who are never really properly named so that can't be used as basis. Shocker, Carnage, Hobgoblin and many others have never been referred to as their 616 counterparts, but it's pretty obvious from their appearance.
Yeah, but the arcs featuring Hobgoblin and Carnage are called "Carnage" and "Hobgoblin", so even if they were never referred to by those names in the story, the arc title does it for us.

I kind of miss the old titles though, in which they'd name the arc AFTER the story has been completed. Bendis and Millar use some really nice titles for their individual issues like "Average Bear", "Just A Guy", "How I Learned To Stop Worrying and Love the Hulk" are a few good examples.

cmdrjanjalani said:
I like Ellis' writing, the psuedo-scientific explanations he gives to explain certain super powers and stuff is amusing. It would be cool if he would able to come up with some great explanations regarding mutants, OZ and the rest of the super-humans. I don't like his decompression though, makes the story drag too long. If I wasn't a diehard Ultimate Universe completist, I probably would have lost interest in some of Ellis' books.
The thing is, I wish there were more writers like Ellis, not in terms of attitude, but in terms of both imagination and breadth of knowledge. Too many people working in the entertainment industry, including comics, seem to have their creative work informed ENTIRELY by what they learned from the entertainment industry. Instead of trying to sit up and look at the world, examine other cultures, find pet fascinations and use those thoughts as interesting concepts to inject into their books, these creators exist only in entertainment's self-referential cycle.

I remain staunchly critical of people like Ellis, but he will ALWAYS be on my list of awesome because he lets his mind act like a radar and pick up on those things that writers SHOULD. He knows, like Ultimate Reed that the "universe is a big place full of cool ideas and things", rather than try to be the kind of damned writer who just wants to "set up his own butt-hat franchise". And its "butt-hat franchises" that are exactly what science fiction and fantasy SHOULDN'T be about.

All of science fiction and fantasy is now just endlessly riffing on each other: a parade of uninspired rip offs of Star Trek, Tolkien and Star Wars-style universes, rather than a true sense of wonder, magic and imagination. To put it bluntly, where has all the imagination gone? Hopefully, it has not gone ALL to Warren Ellis, for surely there are less elitist conduits for all that imagination. :D
 

cmdrjanjalani

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If you guys are talking about the freak that looks like Juggernaut with glowing eyes, I don't think he's the Crimson Dynamo. He's most probably U-Titanium Man.

For the reasons why here is a link:

Titanium Man
 

Ice

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Ok, well, that doesn't look like what was in Ultimate Nightmare. It looks far from it. Is Titanium man even Russian?

It's still more to Crymson Dynamo.
 
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