Ultimate Red Skull

[The Overlord]

You kind of answered your own questionedBy focusing on the character Blonsky and perhaps beefing up the abomination serum. Abomination isn't completely thrown away, you can still do a very good ultimatzation of Emil Blonsky and still fit in with U2

Perhaps, but you have to be careful introducing more than version of a character, it makes the character confusing

I would like skull to come about in a new manner, something original but still holds the same sense of evil and threatening the 616 version had. Handled by a really good writer this could be great. Instead of having him someone only connected to Cap, have him be a new villain threating the world and eventually becoming extremely hateful of Cap. Lets see their meeting and development in the present instead of a flash back

Easier said then done, making Ultimate Skull different but still as fearsome is very tricky.

For example I wouldn't want an Islamic Red skull, I don't think he should be updated to fit whatever enemy America is fighting at the moment. That's why the Communist version of the Red Skull from the 50s was never popular. Plus it wouldn't make a whole lot of sense, Islamic fundamentalists are very stylish so he wouldn't very look cool and the Nazis were bizarre (SS officers wore Skulls on their caps for example). Seriously Nazis just look scary. Also an Islamic red skull would be too similar to the colonel.

What is as evil as a Nazi war criminal, that's a hard question to answer. I guess you could make him a serial killer, but that doesn't feel right either, feels too low key for him, someone with political power would kill more people than just a lone serial killer. Skull isn't just some crazed loner.

I think the only real option is to make him an international arms dealer. There is the George Maxon version of the Red Skull, who was in Captain America 1, he was an American business man and arms maker who was secretly an Nazi agent (though later he was retconned into being an agent of Johann Schmidt).

Ultimate Schmidt wouldn't work because take away the nazi background and you leave an huge hole in the character, but Maxon doesn't have that problem.

Anyway I was thinking George Maxon is an international arms dealer and American ex pat. Not only does he sell arms, he causes wars as well so he can sell the arms to both sides. He assassinates political leaders who try to promote peace and places the blame on others to ensure wars continue. he gives aid to violent rebel groups in the developing world, so that can gain control of their country's resources and give him their nation's treasures in exchange for his aid. He undermines young democracies because the military dictatorships that replace them are better customers.

His face was deformed when international authorizes tried to arrest him while he was testing a new biological agent, he survived but his face looks like a red Skull.

That can be interesting, anyone who has seen "Lord of war" knows how evil the arms industry can be and one would only have to look at blood diamond see how much money one can make off the suffering of people in the developing world.

 

[Random]

Easier said then done, making Ultimate Skull different but still as fearsome is very tricky.

For example I wouldn't want an Islamic Red skull, I don't think he should be updated to fit whatever enemy America is fighting at the moment. That's why the Communist version of the Red Skull from the 50s was never popular. Plus it wouldn't make a whole lot of sense, Islamic fundamentalists are very stylish so he wouldn't very look cool and the Nazis were bizarre (SS officers wore Skulls on their caps for example). Seriously Nazis just look scary. Also an Islamic red skull would be too similar to the colonel.

This is the problem, you're very stuck on the fact that he was a nazi. For him to work it needs to be something original that keeps a live the essence of the character. The UU isn't just an updated idea of a character but also breaking new grounds exploring the characters giving them original, interesting, AND logical twists. And like I said he needs a great writer like Millar to pull it off, definitely not someone like Bendis or god forbid, Loeb. There are a lot of possibilities besides the obvious ones

 

[The Overlord]

This is the problem, you're very stuck on the fact that he was a nazi. For him to work it needs to be something original that keeps a live the essence of the character. The UU isn't just an updated idea of a character but also breaking new grounds exploring the characters giving them original, interesting, AND logical twists. And like I said he needs a great writer like Millar to pull it off, definitely not someone like Bendis or god forbid, Loeb. There are a lot of possibilities besides the obvious ones

I'm not hang up on the Skull being a nazi, that's why I suggested arms dealer Red Skull, didn't you read my whole post? I said he doesn't have to be a nazi, but he has to be political and pure evil.

This thread should be more than bust stating that maybe Millar can make an interesting red skull, suggesting some ideas generates more conversation.

I just don't like an Islamic Red Skull, it just seem a little too ham fisted like all those communist villains from the Silver age (plus he would be too much like the colonel).

They tried having cap fight Islamic terrorists in 2002, everyone hated that history, right wingers thought the terrorist was too sympathetic, left wingers thought Marvel was demonizing Muslims and no one was happy.

That's why I think the red skull should be an arms dealer, it meshes with some aspects of the Red Skull's 616 history (Maxon being an arms manufacturer) and gives people a villain everyone can hate, plus deals with political issues like the arms trade.
Maxon wouldn't be a Nazi, he would a more general scum bag who causes war and suffering in order to acquire wealth.

 

[Random]

I'm not hang up on the Skull being a nazi, that's why I suggested arms dealer Red Skull, didn't you read my whole post?

... to be honest, I'm not entirely sober

 

[The Overlord]

... to be honest, I'm not entirely sober

Well it is st. Paddy's day, read again after you have a hangover.

And watch "Lord of war". Arms dealers are scum.

 

[Void.M]

Well it is st. Paddy's day, read again after you have a hangover.

And watch "Lord of war". Arms dealers are scum.

Well, i dunno.

My uncle use to work armory and he's an ok guy.


as for Ultimate Skull.....why not have him be the grandson of Hitler or Fidel Castro.

 

[The Overlord]

Well, i dunno.

My uncle use to work armory and he's an ok guy.


as for Ultimate Skull.....why not have him be the grandson of Hitler or Fidel Castro.

Does your uncle sell to African warlords, because .....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n4jMzKxYB74

International arms dealers who sell to African warlords are evil.

Hitler didn't have children and Fidel's grandson would just be lame.

Ultimate Skull wouldn't just be an rms dealer, he would also be a terrorist who promotes chaos to drum up business. He would be promoting death and suffering on a wide scale to acquire wealth, he actually start wars and kill peace makers to do it.

Also exactly how would Fidel's grandsone be pure evil?

 

[Void.M]

Does your uncle sell to African warlords, because .....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n4jMzKxYB74

International arms dealers who sell to African warlords are evil.

Hitler didn't have children and Fidel's grandson would just be lame.

don't you mean ''Lord of war''? i love that movie.

Besides wouldn't the truly evil person be the guy buying em ?

Hitlers dead but he was the super-villain Hate-monger. They don't need to be historically accurate.

 

[The Overlord]

don't you mean ''Lord of war''? i love that movie.

and hey we all need money. Besides wouldn't the truly evil person be the guy buying em ?

Hitlers dead but he was the super-villain Hate-monger. They don't need to be historically accurate.
And how would a Castro be lame? Ask the people of cuba he's freaking evil.......plus he was able to escape all his assassination attempts with his life that's pretty badass.

we all need money but selling weapons to African warlords is evil, get a different job. If you are selling weapons to them, you are just as bad as they are, you enable them to commit their crimes. That's like saying selling slaves is okay because people need money.

Also the ultimate skull I suggested would actively promote chaos to drum up business, by undermining democracies and assassinating political leaders to promote war. That is why he would be pure evil.

I don't care if Cubans think Castro is evil, how is he half as bad as Hitler, or Pol Pot? He just another tin pot, not an icon of evil. They aren't objective, do people in France or Germany think Castro is evil or do they not care. The skull should be universally evil.

Hate monger is lame, making Hitler into a super villain is stupid and giving him a fictional grandson (Ted Hitler, I guess) is lame. i don't believe historical figures or their children as villains.