Ultimate X-Men #63 Discussion (Spoilers)

[iceman]

Familiar face'll be Rogue. Or zombie Gambit. (zombies are lifeless bodies, too)

Failed seduction will be Magneto and Polaris.

X-men near death will be Cyclops. (whoever it is, i certainly don't think they'll die. they would have advertised it)

Pigs with wings is Angel with wings.

 

[Ice]

X-men near death will be Cyclops. (whoever it is, i certainly don't think they'll die. they would have advertised it)

Not always. They didn't announce it when Beast died. They never posted "someone will die" or anything.

 

[DIrishB]

My issue had a miscut page and I missed some dialogue...I think I got the gyst of it but I'm not sure...might have to ask someone to post it. I think it's just a couple lines. I'll have to look it up and see what page it was...

I had the same problem, was yours the Magneto/Lorna conversation as well? Something with Mags mentioning Sentinels, etc...

 

[DIrishB]

Oh cripes!! I missed the best part. In the start of the issue Fury is taking Longshot to his cell and he's explaining to him why DeathStrike and Essex are there.

I liked Essex and Deathstrike's appearance. Good to see Sinister didn't kill himself after all, but Fury mentioned the attempt which was also cool.

And with the last page showing Widow in her armor, this confirms the Magnetic North arc occurs sometime after the first Ultimates 2 volume (issue #4 specifically).

 

[DIrishB]

Baby being born?

Sinister saying that?

Mentioning Apocalypse ("He's coming")


I think of

Spoiler

Cable

but I somehow doubt it here.

I was thinking of the same thing. Could very well be a mention of Ultimate Cable. He doesn't necessarily have to be Cyke's and Jean's kid, as it seems way too early for that. Then again it could be something totally unrelated...just one of those things Vaughan threw in for a possible future arc by another writer (though I doubt Singer would tackle something like that).

I definitely think a death is around the corner. If not for Colossus then Dazzler would be the next best thing and it would bring Angel to a darker edge. Let's kill her.

I agree...I like Dazzler, but with all the Apocalypse hints being dropped (well, at least in this issue and way back in Tempest) it would make sense for Angel's character...at least in terms of turning him into Archangel. Whether this will be by Apocalypse's hand or not, it still makes sense.

So Sinister is alive?????

Yup...Fury mentions he's been on suicide watch since he tried to swallow his own tongue, referencing the ending of Tempest when Apocalypse ordered him to choke himself.

 

[Ice]

I was thinking of the same thing. Could very well be a mention of Ultimate Cable. He doesn't necessarily have to be Cyke's and Jean's kid, as it seems way too early for that. Then again it could be something totally unrelated...just one of those things Vaughan threw in for a possible future arc by another writer (though I doubt Singer would tackle something like that).

Its just me, but I dont think they'll change parentage for him, even in ultimates. But that's just me.

 

[DIrishB]

Its just me, but I dont think they'll change parentage for him, even in ultimates. But that's just me.

I do, as if he were still Jean and Scott's kid, then it would involve time-travel or rapid aging, one of the two, and I don't see either being used effectively in the Ultimate universe. Though I could be wrong since Millar brought it into UFF, but thats a whole different corner of the universe and in a book like UFF it sort of makes sense. UXM is the racial examination book, while UFF is the whacky science based adventure book.

 

[Ice]

I do, as if he were still Jean and Scott's kid, then it would involve time-travel or rapid aging, one of the two, and I don't see either being used effectively in the Ultimate universe. Though I could be wrong since Millar brought it into UFF, but thats a whole different corner of the universe and in a book like UFF it sort of makes sense. UXM is the racial examination book, while UFF is the whacky science based adventure book.

Rapid aging would be worked better than time-travel, though you know its going to happen sooner or later. But it would be too much of a change if he's made into someone else's kid.

But hopefully we will see soon enough. Maybe the next writer will pick this up.

 

[DIrishB]

Rapid aging would be worked better than time-travel, though you know its going to happen sooner or later. But it would be too much of a change if he's made into someone else's kid.

But hopefully we will see soon enough. Maybe the next writer will pick this up.

Possibly, and I agree on the rapid-aging working better than time-travel point. But why would his parentage changing be too much, as opposed to say the Mad Thinker's Ultimate sex-change, Thor's God-hood in question, or Colossus being gay? The Ultimate universe is supposed to be different, doesn't have to be a near carbon copy of the 616 universe, as you know. I don't think Cable coming from different parents and not being from the future would lessen his character any. Might, in fact, make him more interesting. His name could just be Nathaniel Dayspring or Nate Askani or something. Crap, with names like that they could even turn him into an American Indian or Asian character...who knows?

 

[Ice]

I don't know. To me it just wouldn't be right. At least with the Mad Thinker there wasn't too much to the character in the first place (616). But with him, it's different. Don't know how to explain it, but it just is, for me.

 

[DIrishB]

I don't know. To me it just wouldn't be right. At least with the Mad Thinker there wasn't too much to the character in the first place (616). But with him, it's different. Don't know how to explain it, but it just is, for me.

I understand what you're saying, but you never know. I think an Ultimate Cable could be approached totally originally, retaining some of the aspects, characteristics, and powers of 616 Cable, without being a time-traveling half-cyborg warrior who's basically a Wolverine rehash. I'd like to see a storyline with Ultimate Cable introduced as some mutant drifter who eventually somehow ends up as a sort of Messiah to the mutant race, some follow him, others don't. I'd like to see him kind of avoid his destiny at first, not believing in himself or the people's beliefs of him, and Apocalypse try to influence him and other's away from this destiny (since its bad news to Apocalypse for whatever reason). The X-Men would naturally play an intrinsic role...I don't think it would necessarily work as a prominent storyline at first, but as a long-running subplot to the book which eventually culminates in an arc or two (but not for a long while yet).

 

[roguefan]

Anyone think that maybe the child is Jean and Scotts, except a baby from the future whihc has been sent back in time to save it from Apocalypse. That way, it's kinda like Scotts' child in 616, except it's been sent back, not forward.

 

[Ice]

Anyone think that maybe the child is Jean and Scotts, except a baby from the future whihc has been sent back in time to save it from Apocalypse. That way, it's kinda like Scotts' child in 616, except it's been sent back, not forward.

But how would it be explained that Sinister knew? Saying he "had a dream" seems like such a not very good explanation if that was used.

 

[DIrishB]

Anyone think that maybe the child is Jean and Scotts, except a baby from the future whihc has been sent back in time to save it from Apocalypse. That way, it's kinda like Scotts' child in 616, except it's been sent back, not forward.

But how would it be explained that Sinister knew? Saying he "had a dream" seems like such a not very good explanation if that was used.

And it still involved time travel, which I would like to see them avoid. I really don't think its necessary to have Cable be Scott and Jean's kid. His amazing power makes sense due to him obtaining some of his mother's powers, but then again he doesn't have to be Jean's son to be capable of immense mutant powers.

 

[E]

The pigs with wings could be a clue to something...does anyone remember anything that has been mentioned in the past that might happen "when pigs fly"? It might have been so unremarkable a reference that no one thought anything of it....

 

[Ice]

And it still involved time travel, which I would like to see them avoid. I really don't think its necessary to have Cable be Scott and Jean's kid. His amazing power makes sense due to him obtaining some of his mother's powers, but then again he doesn't have to be Jean's son to be capable of immense mutant powers.

He's not even Jean's son, though.

 

[DIrishB]

The pigs with wings could be a clue to something...does anyone remember anything that has been mentioned in the past that might happen "when pigs fly"? It might have been so unremarkable a reference that no one thought anything of it....

Well Bass getting laid supposedly only happens when pigs fly, so maybe next month will be really good for him.

 

[DIrishB]

He's not even Jean's son, though.

Oh I forgot, I thought he was based on the Cyclops and Jean mini where they traveled to the future. He's Madeline Pryor's son though, who is a clone of Jean, so close enough.

 

[roguefan]

I still think it would be good. Maybe:

Scott has an affair with Madylyne Pryor in the future, and she becomes pregnant with his child. Jean finds out and unleashes the Phoenix, whihc attracts Apocalypse, who becomes interested in her. Jean realsies she must love Scott ad his child if their is a hope they will stay together. To keep the child safe from Apocalypse, she sends him back in time to now.

 

[Ice]

Oh I forgot, I thought he was based on the Cyclops and Jean mini where they traveled to the future. He's Madeline Pryor's son though, who is a clone of Jean, so close enough.

Damn clones! They're everywhere!!!!


And again, really hope the next writer picks up with this. We'll see next week with the online solits, since it seems Marvel isn't bothering as of yet to tell us who the new creative team is.

 

[Hi-Fi]

Please! No Cable in the UU...there are lots of characters i wanna see before him...good characters, like Banshee, Amanda Sefton, Dani Moonstar and Chamber.

I'm pretty sure that Vaughan was just making a reference with Sinister.

and i hope the familiar face is indeed Rogue...she belongs with the X-Men.

 

[DIrishB]

Damn clones! They're everywhere!!!!


And again, really hope the next writer picks up with this. We'll see next week with the online solits, since it seems Marvel isn't bothering as of yet to tell us who the new creative team is.

Which is what I've been dying to find out...so what do you think, next Monday or Tuesday they should be announced?

 

[DIrishB]

Please! No Cable in the UU...there are lots of characters i wanna see before him...good characters, like Banshee, Amanda Sefton, Dani Moonstar and Chamber.

Chamber was a good character in your opinion? And Moonstar and Banshee? Come on, you can do better than that.

I'm pretty sure that Vaughan was just making a reference with Sinister.

and i hope the familiar face is indeed Rogue...she belongs with the X-Men.

As for Cable, thats why I want his Ultimate version to be pretty different than 616. Thats one of the points of the Ultimate line, to reinvent and breathe new life on the older, played-out ideas of much of 616.

 

[Hi-Fi]

Chamber was a good character in your opinion? And Moonstar and Banshee? Come on, you can do better than that.



As for Cable, thats why I want his Ultimate version to be pretty different than 616. Thats one of the points of the Ultimate line, to reinvent and breathe new life on the older, played-out ideas of much of 616.

I didn't get Chamber before BKVs mini. It's really really good...and i kinda like English characters..Chamber has the english humour, especially when written by Vaughan. Banshee was always one of my favourites, and Moonstar was a really nice character back in the early New Mutants issues. They are not the best, the point is that i rather see those guys before the old time traveller crap...i can't stand it. If he appears as a totally redefined character, though, i guess it would be ok. 8)

 

[Hawkeye101]

Acctually, I was kind of hoping Cable would be born unto Scott and Jean, and be Rachel's twin brother, and Apocalypse wants tham for a prophecy involving twins with the power to destroy and re-create the world. And no adult cable, he and Rachel should be stuck in teenage or even pre-teenage years.

 

[DIrishB]

I didn't get Chamber before BKVs mini. It's really really good...and i kinda like English characters..Chamber has the english humour, especially when written by Vaughan.

Oh ok, I haven't read Vaughan's mini, but after Ultimate X-Men I've become a huge fan of his work and would love to check that out sometime. And you're right about the English humor.

Banshee was always one of my favourites, and Moonstar was a really nice character back in the early New Mutants issues. They are not the best, the point is that i rather see those guys before the old time traveller crap...i can't stand it. If he appears as a totally redefined character, though, i guess it would be ok. 8)

Thats what I'm saying, I don't want him to be anything like his 616 version, check out what I posted before about what I think Ultimate Cable should be like.

Hawkeye101 Acctually, I was kind of hoping Cable would be born unto Scott and Jean, and be Rachel's twin brother, and Apocalypse wants tham for a prophecy involving twins with the power to destroy and re-create the world. And no adult cable, he and Rachel should be stuck in teenage or even pre-teenage years.

Ummm, that would still require a huge time gap to occur for Cable/Rachel to get old enough to actually have a developed character. Hence me not wanting Ultimate Cable to be Scott or Jean's son. Heck, they could even call him Nataniel Pryor and make his mom a single mom or something named Madeline.

 

[eatinsloppyjoes]

He doesn't necessarily have to be Cyke's and Jean's kid, as it seems way too early for that.

who knows what those two have been doing lately *tee hee*

 

[DIrishB]

who knows what those two have been doing lately *tee hee*

Well lets put it this way, it took Wolverine a few issues to get into Jean's pants, Cyke's been dating her since a bit after that, and there have been no scenes or allusions to think their relationship spends anytime "in between the sheets". Cyke's a pansy, what can I say?

 

[Hawkeye101]

who knows what those two have been doing lately *tee hee*

Yeah, let's say Jean get's knocked up, right? By Scott.... and she gives birth to the twins at an NYC hospital. Except anit-mutant radicals attack the hospital and jean has to get away with them. the Fantastic Four call her over to help protect her and even the Ultimates come in to stop the mayhem. Some radicals get in and try to attack her. She accidentlly tosses her twins into the time machine that the Fantastic Four have, and moments later Cable and Pheonix quell the uprising, at age 16 maybe.

 

[DIrishB]

Yeah, let's say Jean get's knocked up, right? By Scott.... and she gives birth to the twins at an NYC hospital. Except anit-mutant radicals attack the hospital and jean has to get away with them. the Fantastic Four call her over to help protect her and even the Ultimates come in to stop the mayhem. Some radicals get in and try to attack her. She accidentlly tosses her twins into the time machine that the Fantastic Four have, and moments later Cable and Pheonix quell the uprising, at age 16 maybe.

See thats exactly what I'm hoping doesn't happen...the Ultimate and 616 verses aren't the same thing. I think my theory is much more likely to happen given the Ultimate universe's realistic-as-possible approach in their storytelling.