Darth Series Discussion: Ultimatum

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Re: Ultimatum series discussion [spoilers]

Oh E, ye of little faith!

That's right. I have returned to UC after a short hiatus which included a short sabbatical. Happy Holidays, New Year's Eve, New Year, MLK day and Inauguration day to you all. I had a great Christmas, followed by an ok New Year (had to work) but then I had an amazing trip to Vegas where I ate lavish meals, got into some of the best clubs in town and came home $5000 richer (thank you, Arizona Cardinals!).

Needless to say, I had a lot of catching up to do. In fact, I've still got a lot of catching up to do BUT guess what? I have caught up with Ultimatum issue 2 thanks to the wonder of the internets (as I've said before, I am flat-out refusing to buy this garbage) and boyoboy, do I have one hell of a review for you all!

Where do we start? Why, we start out with Loeb's attempt at recreating the oh-so-youthful banter we are used to seeing from Brian Michael Bendis' Ultimate Spider-Man. FAIL. Bendis has that stuff tacked down from years of practice, also from years of being a 15-year-old boy (and sometimes girl) trapped in a 40-something's body. Ol' Webhead is grumbling and mumbling about how he's supposed to save all these jacked up people around him, and how it's all that "dirtbag" Magneto's fault. Note to Loeb: knowing kids today, I think he probably would've at least called Magneto a *********, though considering that Magneto just kicked sand in the whole world's face, he probably would've gone for the much more appropriate *******. C'mon Loeb, this is no time for political correctness and "aw gee shucks" kiddy hijinks from Peter Parker... plus you've got THE BLOB EATING THE WASP'S INNARDS later on in the book. (Belated Spoiler Alert! Whoops, sorry!) You think people are going to be any more confused or offended because Spider-Man uses a bad word? I think not. *******!

Anyhoo, Spidey tries to solicit a little help from some Giant-Men, but for some reason, even though Pym and SHIELD can develop a formula that allows human beings to grow to such proportions, they haven't figured out a way to help them hear us regular-sized people. Guess they had to cut costs somewhere, what with all the helicarriers, the Triskelion's electric bill and other stuff (advanced military technologies, skintight tac-suits for Carol Danvers and her gigantic ****s, IKEA brand supervillain prison units). So who comes to help out Spider-Man? None other than the man-monster who killed his parents (shhh don't tell Pete!), Dr. Bruce Banner, also known as THE INCREDIBLE HULK! As written by Jeph Loeb, I must say that the Hulk is at his most retardedest. I'm not just talking about this Hulk, Ultimate Hulk. I mean The Hulk _period_ when Loeb writes him. I swear to Jeebus Loeb sits down before writing any Hulk dialogue and watches a marathon of retard movies and tv shows. I Am Sam, Forrest Gump, Sling Blade, Life Goes On, The Other Sister and so forth, then reads the front cover to David Sedaris' Me Talk Pretty One Day over and over and over again. Then he jumps up like "okreadygo" and writes Hulk gems like "Hulk help Spider-Man". There's your intro sequence. Took me two paragraphs to explain it, took me about two seconds to read through it and start yawning.

Cut away to the Triskelion, where Iron Man busts through the windows (and the folks who sign the checks for SHIELD collectively sigh "Dammit we just got that window fixed!") with an incapacitated Captain America and starts freaking out. "ZOMG! CAP IS HURT! MEDIC! MEDIIII--- oh damn, Carol Danvers! You just get a **** job? Say, let's go have a drink and talk about your future with Stark Enterprises. This SHIELD crap, it's so last year." Carol just stands there with her giant chest torpedoes and two other really ridiculously big guns she's somehow able to swing around with one hand each. Cap wakes up from his sorta-coma and says "What's her name tag say, just let me get a closer look. Schwing."

Not really, but that would've made this book worth buying.

I thought Robert Downey Jr. played a great Iron Man, but for some reason, Loeb channels Clooney in his ER days with the next bit of Dialogue, "You hang in there, Steve. You hear me? DON'T DIE ON ME! DON'T YOU...DARE...DIE...ON ME! IT NEVER...GETS...ANY...EASIER!"

Now, the next few pages are just too boring to really mention. They bust out the shock paddles for Cap, who despite being frozen in the Arctic Ocean (or was it the North Atlantic?) can't take a little water in his lungs right now. Blah blah blah, yawn yawn yawn.

Next up: Hawkeye and Yellowgiant. Ant-jacket. Yellow-Man. Yellowjacket AHA THAT'S IT! Something happens and Henry Yellowpym grabs Clint and they have a man-to-man, heart-to-heart that involves some teeth clenching and then the realization that the one thing they have in common is the love of their wives, even though Clint's is dead and Hank once tried to kill his with a swarm of ants after he smacked her around like his name was Ike Turner and Tina just told him she was going solo.

Moving right along, the Thing and Sue Storm. Yawn! Reed Richards and Namor fighting over a woman, IMAGINE THAT! Yawn! Doctor Doom somehow back from the Zombieverse and hooking it up with Zarda, the Power Princess... or Princess Power. She's looking... far less impressive than when Gary Frank drew her. Her arrogance is out of place when she looks like a late-teenaged Psylocke. Reed gives Doctor Doom the ol' what for and talks about what a douche Namor is, even though he really didn't do nothin', which despite being a super-genius, Reed can't seem to figure out. They talk science, or at least Loeb's version of science. Y-A-H-A-W-NNNNNN.

Onto Thor. Now, if Mark Millar was writing this, everyone would be pumped at this point. Instead, I thought about taking a nap. Thor said thee nay or something and almost shed a tear over a dead-ish Valkyrie but then Hela shows up looking like Hela from 616 had a quick costume change just in time to make a cameo in the Ultimate Universe. Something about bringing Valkyrie back at a price after Thor fought some dead guys. Y'mean to tell me that fighting the dead guys isn't the damned price? What a ******. So Thor, being back to his old 616ish self in the Ultimate Universe, says something like "Verily!" and away he goes, hacking away at bone-bags until GUESS WHO shows up!?!?

CAPTAIN FREAKIN' AMERICA! YEAHHH! LOVE IT OR LEAVE IT, BABY! PUT ON THE TOBY KEITH CD AND GRAB A LARGE ORDER OF FREEDOM FRIES BECAUSE IT'S TIME TO LET THE EAGLE SOAR! (If only Jim Ross wrote Marvel Comics!) But yeah, it's Captain America. About five or six pages ago they had to break out the shock paddles and still weren't getting any vitals, his uniform was torn to hell and his future looked grim. Apparently, in the time that those five or six pages represented, they brought him back from the dead, gave him a shower and a fresh change of clothes and he felt just fine to get back into the thick of battle with Thor versus every Viking who ever died.

And this scene gives us the most telling line of the entire mini series. This gem of wisdom sums up Ultimatum in full:

THOR: Captain! Here? How is it possible?
CAP: I DON'T KNOW. WE'LL FIGURE THAT OUT WHEN THIS IS OVER...!

I figured you out, Jeph Loeb! You have absolutely NO CLUE where this train is headed, but after it's gone completely off the tracks and blows to bits as it collides with a fuel truck, you're going to sift through the rubble and FIGURE IT OUT! OK OK OK OK! NOW I GET IT! STORY'S OVER! BRING MILLAR BACK IN! Whew. Talk about art imitating life.

I would normally end the review there. I thought that might just be the last thing I needed to read of this issue and this entire series. MAAAAAAN was I wrong. I already mentioned it, but two pages later, Clint "Hawkeye" Barton finds Mr. Fred J. Dukes aka The Blob chowing down on Janet Pym Intestines Tartare. WHAAAAT? Loeb, have you been reading Crossed by Garth Ennis lately? Blob might be a disgusting pig but really... now he's a cannibal? This happened when? Nobody got the memo.

Really... I just... I have absolutely nothing to say here. I've tried to think of something witty or clever to say but... it's no use. The Blob is eating Janet's guts. Oh, and he says "Tastes like chicken". Thanks, Jeph, for another cliche. You're redeeming yourself with every turn. I wish you'd just go help Rob Liefeld with whatever it is he's doing these days. Ugh.

For the finale... Xavier and Magneto have their little showdown. Then, Magneto snaps Charles' neck and says some super-villainy crap. To Be Continued. Roll Credits.

To sum it up: IT SUCKS. There's your thoughtful review from someone who really hates it. Good to be back. Now I'm going to read something that doesn't make me hate that I read comic books... see you later.

UPDATE Not really an update, but my prediction for how this will all end: Scarlet Witch isn't dead and we're left with Ultimate Reverse House of M. Wanda restores everything back to the way it was. Millar steps back into the fold and everyone just kind of pretends Jeph Loeb never wrote an Ultimate book.

...and they all lived happily ever after. Except Loeb, who should be demoted down to writing Spider-Ham after this is all said and done.

Brilliant. Some of this was fantastic, especially the idea that Loeb has his own science.

However, you made a mistake: Cap is in the land of the dead because he's dead.

Also, I think Loeb won't write Spider-Ham. I think it will be like Bush and Obama. Loeb has so royally screwed the Ultimate Universe we'll get someone completely out of left field to fix it like Bryan Lee O'Malley.
 
okay guys... i hated it just as much as you and possibly more, but it think it had been implied that Blob might be a canibal before this. IIRC it was either during ultimate war or when the x-men were caught by weapon x...

Also, that shot of carol danves might have been the most out of place pin up i've ever seen in any comic. She has two huge guns and she isnt using them or anything. She's just hanging out in the lobby of the Triskelion coordinating shield cleaning up the city (because damage control is evil now:cry::cry::cry::cry::cry:). Why the hell does she carry all those guns? Just put a couple down you dumb broad! You'll be more efficient that way!!

Also, valkyrie is dead. Wow. So a 2d character get killed off before she even got her backstory and we're supposed to care? Please tell me they'll jsut give up next issue and leave her in hell or puragtory or whereever she is.
 
"Umbrella Academy, on Dark Horse Comics is a great read - Its quirky, and requires a few readings to pick up all the nuggets, but very rewarding. It follows a 'team' of seven 'super' characters, mostly along two timelines - as kids and adults. Some major changes have taken place between the two timelines, and we are left to try to piece together what must have happened between the two....."


Sorry - I thought it would be funny to find every Ultimatum thread on the internet, and start talking about a far superior indy comic, with no explanation... I might be able to turn a few Loeb 'readers' into fans of other comics instead. Surely my summary of an unrelated comic would be almost as eye-catching as the nuances and complexities of "Whatcha' need ta know" or "Hulk like sex. Pants bad." or Blob saying "Chicken-fried bowels"..or ...whatever.

Then I thought I'd just stay here and preach to the choir. :)
 
Wait...wait...



Janet's now dead in 616 AND 1610???



HAHAHAHAHA!!!
 
robje posted what I was going to but forgot to.

I'm pretty sure Millar implied Blob's cannibalism before. I was first like "WTF?" myself, but then I part of me remembered something like that.
 
I'm so ashamed of myself for trying to find an explanation for why Blob is a cannibal. I know that the explanation is "Loeb is a hack", but I can't help but try to rationalize it.

Also, I was watching this show called Food Detectives and they talked about why so many foods taste like chicken, and human intestines wouldn't taste like shut up brain!

Its just gross and vile and not needed, it wastes a character and it reeks of torture porn.
 
Since this thread is for complaining, I won't feel bad (or OVERLY whiny :) ) for doing just that -

I have been collecting the Ultimate U from pretty much the beginning -

I have the good ( post clone-saga USM, early UFF, Millar UFF,
early UXM, Ultimate Vision)

I have the great (Ultimates 1, Ultimates 2, BKV UXM, early USM up to Gwen's death, Ultimate Human

I have the mediocre (Ultimate War, Ultimate six, most of the rest of UXM, most of the rest of UFF, most of the rest of USM, Ultimate Origins, Ultimate DD, Ultimate Elektra, Ultimate Galactus trilogy)

I have the awful (Ultimate Iron Man 1 and 2, Ultimate Power, most of U3)

Like many collectors, I keep hanging on when titles go sour in the hopes of regaining past glory.

Ultimatum made me think it was FINALLY time to pack it in... but after ALL of this, it was Ultimate Hulk Annual that completely ended it for me. This really was the worst comic possible.

My store owner looked shocked as I cancelled every Marvel title (including all Ultimates), except Immortal Iron Fist and Captain America

instead, I picked up:

Invincible
Walking Dead
Umbrella Academy
Kull
Dead Irons

Not that anyone cares about these particulars - mostly I'm just trying to describe on a 'single collector's level' that Loeb accomplished what even Ultimate Iron Man couldn't.

Though I ripped up my Ultimate Hulk Annual in disgust, shame, and embarrassment, I might print a copy of the cover off of the net and tape it to my comic collection, the way a heavier person might use a picture of themselves on the fridge - as motivation for what I want to change. It will induce a vomity feeling, and be a reminder to drop a book when it becomes awful.

Some good has come from Loeb - by setting a new industry low, I doubt - even by default - that I will ever be this disappointed in comics again. Next time I would rather chew $4 worth of tin foil, $0.10 at a time.


PS - Thank you for starting this thread - This was exactly what I needed, and - I think - the place I needed to say it.

I didn't read Ultimate Hulk Annual but I'd really like to know more about it, because lately I really kind of enjoy the feeling I get when I read a Loeb book. I hate them but I'm the type of guy who likes watching trainwrecks. If it is truly as horrible as you say (and I'm sure it is) then I would like to give it a look.

I'm not going to buy it, but I'd like to read it. ANGER IS CLEANSING!

UPDATE OK, I read it. What has been seen cannot be unseen. You are correct, sir. This is the worst thing I've ever seen. Wow. Even Ultimatum is good in comparison.

Bass said:
However, you made a mistake: Cap is in the land of the dead because he's dead.

No Bass, that's not how it works. Your intentions are sound but the proof is in the pudding, and your pudding recipe sucks. First of all, Steve Rogers is not a Viking. He's probably a Methodist, so I don't think he'd just be hanging around in the Land of the Viking Dead. Plus, if you die and you go to the Land of the Viking Dead, then you work for Hela at that point. You don't get to say "Nuh-uh, ******! I ain't working for you anymore. My boy Thor is in the house and we're about to get all Ragnarokish up on that ***." There are no choices for a zombie soldier. I COULD BE WRONG THOUGH. (Not likely.) Maybe in the processing center for the recently deceased, there was a routing error and instead of being sent off to "Land of the Methodist 85-year-old-man-in-a-30-year-old-man's body Dead" he was sent to Land of the Viking Dead... but see, Loeb's not that creative. Cap is there for no reason other than to make the people who actually enjoy this book say "AWESOME!" because Cap and Thor are kicking *** together. Sadly, the people who actually enjoy this book are either people with an IQ of less than 60 or 8-year-olds.

8-year-olds, dude.

robje said:
Also, that shot of carol danves might have been the most out of place pin up i've ever seen in any comic. She has two huge guns and she isnt using them or anything. She's just hanging out in the lobby of the Triskelion coordinating shield cleaning up the city (because damage control is evil now). Why the hell does she carry all those guns? Just put a couple down you dumb broad! You'll be more efficient that way!!

THIS! I get carrying huge freakin' guns (I mean the firearms, not the ****s) if the Liberators are attacking the Triskelion. But honestly, those guns have no real practical application during a gigantic flood. I suppose she was planning on shooting the tidal wave. Then again, it's probably because Loeb told Finch to sexy Carol Danvers up, and that big machine guns look great when paired with big ****s.

Also, why does Carol Danvers need a damn name tag on her SHIELD gear? She's the current director of SHIELD in the absence of Nick Fury, I don't think she's worried about the people who work for her not knowing who the **** she is.

DANVERS: Agent McGillicuddy, go get me a cup of coffee.
McGILLICUDDY: Excuse me, who are you?
DANVERS: Oh, I'm sorry, I guess you didn't see my name tag because it's sitting on top of my giant breast! I'm Carol Danvers, your boss!
McGILLICUDDY: Guess I didn't get the memo. Go get your own coffee, *****!

I don't think so.
 
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No Bass, that's not how it works. Your intentions are sound but the proof is in the pudding, and your pudding recipe sucks. First of all, Steve Rogers is not a Viking. He's probably a Methodist, so I don't think he'd just be hanging around in the Land of the Viking Dead. Plus, if you die and you go to the Land of the Viking Dead, then you work for Hela at that point. You don't get to say "Nuh-uh, ******! I ain't working for you anymore. My boy Thor is in the house and we're about to get all Ragnarokish up on that ***." There are no choices for a zombie soldier. I COULD BE WRONG THOUGH. (Not likely.) Maybe in the processing center for the recently deceased, there was a routing error and instead of being sent off to "Land of the Methodist 85-year-old-man-in-a-30-year-old-man's body Dead" he was sent to Land of the Viking Dead... but see, Loeb's not that creative. Cap is there for no reason other than to make the people who actually enjoy this book say "AWESOME!" because Cap and Thor are kicking *** together. Sadly, the people who actually enjoy this book are either people with an IQ of less than 60 or 8-year-olds.

No no no. See, you're thinking it through too much. Loeb doesn't do this. He's in the land of the dead because he's dead.

And my pudding is awesome.
 
robje posted what I was going to but forgot to.

I'm pretty sure Millar implied Blob's cannibalism before. I was first like "WTF?" myself, but then I part of me remembered something like that.

All I know about Blob in Millar's run was he really believes in the Brotherhood's cause and he was able to make good intellectual arguments with Beast during their chat while he was pretending to be a supermodel. Even Bendis added another layer to him by having Liz Allan be his daughter who he appears to care for. For Loeb, Blob thinks intestines taste like chicken. The only thing he saw in Blob was he loves to eat, so why not make him a cannibal?

As we all know, Loeb loves caricatures and his characterizations suck. Maybe if he was making a parody of the Ultimates in MAD Magazine then I wouldn't find it bad.

Still Blob is nothing compared to Thor. I miss old Ultimate Thor. He used to be a hippie who gave a damn about the world and had genuine principles whether skewed it may be. Now, all he cares now is banging some air-headed, one-dimensional chick who just happen to have superpowers. You don't even know why she deserved them and why some stupid divine force chose her out of all the women in the world. Even a doofus like Johnny Storm is smart enough to avoid (or at least try to) women like that.
 
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As we all know, Loeb loves caricatures and his characterizations suck. Maybe if he was making a parody of the Ultimates in MAD Magazine then I wouldn't find it bad.

This, I think, is really quite astute - as soon as you said MAD Magazine parody, I thought, that is EXACTLY how Loeb writes Ultimates (sometimes crossed with an 11-year old's impression of pornography)

Creating the awful is easy (see Ultimate line, in various proportions, last 2-3 years)
Carefully, economically describing the awful is a trickier, and important task - I appreciate your quote here. :)
 
No no no. See, you're thinking it through too much. Loeb doesn't do this. He's in the land of the dead because he's dead.

And my pudding is awesome.

OK. I see what you're saying a little clearer now, and it makes sense. My vision of the subject was previously clouded, but I understand where you're coming from now. Of course, Loeb doesn't think anything through, like why the hell a Methodist super-soldier from the 20th century would end up in Viking hell. Loeb, after watching today's episode of "OW! My Balls!" simply thought to himself "Well, Cap's dead and stuff so he goes to the land of the dead."

Still, I'm asking: Why isn't Dazzler in the land of the dead? Why just Cap. Now I think, not only does Loeb suck, but he's sexist, too.

So how about some of that pudding you've been bragging about?
 
OK. I see what you're saying a little clearer now, and it makes sense. My vision of the subject was previously clouded, but I understand where you're coming from now. Of course, Loeb doesn't think anything through, like why the hell a Methodist super-soldier from the 20th century would end up in Viking hell. Loeb, after watching today's episode of "OW! My Balls!" simply thought to himself "Well, Cap's dead and stuff so he goes to the land of the dead."

Still, I'm asking: Why isn't Dazzler in the land of the dead? Why just Cap. Now I think, not only does Loeb suck, but he's sexist, too.

So how about some of that pudding you've been bragging about?

Actually, I'm thinking this is frighteningly planned. He's going to have all the dead heros show up to help Thor, then Hela will make Thor choose between them and Valkyrie.
 
Actually, I'm thinking this is frighteningly planned. He's going to have all the dead heros show up to help Thor, then Hela will make Thor choose between them and Valkyrie.

Oh god yes! let the ***** remain dead!!!

Bro's before ho's, Thor!!!!
 
Oh god yes! let the ***** remain dead!!!

Bro's before ho's, Thor!!!!

This is awful that it's even being discussed! If that's the big plan Loeb has for this part of the story, then it's just a big bag of WTF that is going to get torn apart by stray dogs and strewn all over the street on WTFTrash pickup day. Thor is not Peter Parker, he is not motivated by love. What a bunch of crap.

If he's going to make Ultimate Thor into a straight-up clone of 616 Thor, the least he could do is have him drinking mead and chopping the heads off of frost giants. Not playing house with Valkyrie.

END IT NOW. JUST END IT.
 
Has Loeb acknowledged or responded to all of the negative response to his comics?
 
Has Loeb acknowledged or responded to all of the negative response to his comics?

He has responded QUITE loudly - he proves that any given comic about which we are complaining is not so bad - by putting out a worse comic the following month.

In all honesty, he has responded - I heard someone laughing all the way to the bank (granted, it was a child-like laugh, muffled by a gurgly, drooly sound)

OK...that's all I got :(
 
Has Loeb acknowledged or responded to all of the negative response to his comics?

This is an interesting question. I'm not aware of any online presence he maintains, and I don't read Newsarama or any other comic site frequently enough to know if it has been brought up in any interviews (although I'd expect that it would be linked to from here if there was).
 
Has Loeb acknowledged or responded to all of the negative response to his comics?

This is an interesting question. I'm not aware of any online presence he maintains, and I don't read Newsarama or any other comic site frequently enough to know if it has been brought up in any interviews (although I'd expect that it would be linked to from here if there was).
Oh I'm pretty sure that writers, editors, etc. are aware of most comments about the work. The thing is that they'll never outright say anything about it, 99%. Even if you ask them outright, they'll squirm their way around them most of the time.

I've seen this first hand in one of the panels...I think at one of the Philly cons I attended.Quesada said that they don't base much of anything on [negative] reviews. Because there can be a lot of them, but if the books sells, they'll go with that over the reviews that may "tarnish" series.
 
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Oh I'm pretty sure that writers, editors, etc. are aware of most comments about the work. The thing is that they'll never outright say anything about it, 99%. Even if you ask them outright, they'll squirm their way around them most of the time.

I've seen this first hand in one of the panels...I think at one of the Philly cons I attended.Quesada said that they don't base much of anything on [negative] reviews. Because there can be a lot of them, but if the books sells, they'll go with that over the reviews that may "tarnish" series.

On one hand I understand that. The negative reviews are always going to louder than the positive or non-negative.

But at the same time, a large number of negative reviews can DEFINITELY foreshadow a decrease in sales. Too many times readers will stick with something until it gets better. When it doesn't get better and they get used to hearing people rant about it, they drop it.

Completely ignoring negativity is suicide.
 
On one hand I understand that. The negative reviews are always going to louder than the positive or non-negative.

But at the same time, a large number of negative reviews can DEFINITELY foreshadow a decrease in sales. Too many times readers will stick with something until it gets better. When it doesn't get better and they get used to hearing people rant about it, they drop it.

Completely ignoring negativity is suicide.

Yeah but....Loebs sales don't go down. His books are some of Marvels best sellers. So the problem really isn't Loeb. If his sales numbers went in the toilet Marvel would drop him like a bad habit.
 
I wish I could hate Loeb in such a strong and pure way that he couldn't write another comic.
Just by hating him.
That's what I felt reading Ultimates 3 and then Ultimatum.
I felt like crying, killing someone, eventually this blind hate made me lose my mind temporarily.
I'm back but I still hate it.

PS: Can someone change my name to just Quicksilver? I mean since Ultimate Quicksilver got Loeb'd...
 
I wish I could hate Loeb in such a strong and pure way that he couldn't write another comic.
Just by hating him.
That's what I felt reading Ultimates 3 and then Ultimatum.
I felt like crying, killing someone, eventually this blind hate made me lose my mind temporarily.
I'm back but I still hate it.

PS: Can someone change my name to just Quicksilver? I mean since Ultimate Quicksilver got Loeb'd...

I don't know dude... regular quicksilver is getting slotted
 
My little brother just read Ultimates 1 and 2. Which got me into rereading them, and then Ultimate X-Men.

...I got thinking about these characters again. Reading this thread hurt my soul.

The Ultimate Universe is like being in an abusive relationship. You remember the best parts and get hit with Blob eating Wasp all the while thinking it'll eventually get better again.

In the words of a random Maury viewer, "You leave that ******* and you don't look back!"

This thread keeps me from buying another issue.
 
My little brother just read Ultimates 1 and 2. Which got me into rereading them, and then Ultimate X-Men.

...I got thinking about these characters again. Reading this thread hurt my soul.

The Ultimate Universe is like being in an abusive relationship. You remember the best parts and get hit with Blob eating Wasp all the while thinking it'll eventually get better again.

In the words of a random Maury viewer, "You leave that ******* and you don't look back!"

This thread keeps me from buying another issue.

I think you are looking at it the wrong way. I've taken to doing all of my buying by creators. You should treat Loeb comics this way. Here, lets fix it for you:

Reading a Jeph Loeb comic is like being in an abusive relationship. You remember the best parts like his old Batman stories and some of his stuff with Tim Sale and get hit with Blob eating Wasp or the red hulk all the while thinking it'll eventually get better again but knowing deep down in the pit of your stomach it won't. Oh well, at least there is good Ultimate stuff written by Millar coming this summer.
 
Oh well, at least there is good Ultimate stuff written by Millar coming this summer.

You hope!!!

I don't know tho. While I do have faith in Millar, the UU has ben bastardized to such a degree over the last couple years that I think it will be difficult, if not impossible to get the cool back.

Every tool in Millars tool box has been broken or lost all together. I am sure it won't be as bad as what Loeb has done, but the UU won't ever go back to being what it was.
 

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