Marvel Cinematic Universe - Timeline

[SexySnorlax]

(presumably a month before events of Defenders, though if there is a mention in the show later on relating to events of that show already having occurred, its possible to move Punisher up a bit to occur just after Defenders, in mid or late November, if necessary).

There are no references to the Defenders.

 

[selfishmisery]

2 minutes and 55 seconds into the first episode, this is VERY easy to miss, but from what I can make out on the passport ticket it says "April 16 2017".

I think there's also a way to unblur screenshot'd text.

 

[dsethlewis]

I've got another suggestion based on the time zones:



According to the map from Civil War, Wakanda is between Uganda, Kenya, South Sudan and Ethiopia.

This means it is around 11 hours ahead of California.



As shown in Black Panther Prelude 1, the "I am Iron Man" press conference took place a few hours before the beginning of the comic. Said press conference took place in broad daylight (in California local time).

Due to the time difference between California and Wakanda, plus the few hours since the press conference, there's a gap of at least 13 hours (based on the local time of both), meaning Black Panther Prelude 1 likely starts the following morning.

When T'Challa in in Congo, the sky appears an orange tint (meaning it could be early morning), while when he arrives at Wakanda, the sky is blue (meaning daytime), which I believe backs me up.



So I'm thinking:

2008:

May 25:
-Daytime (California): "I am Iron Man"

May 26:
-Early morning (Congo): Events in Congo.
-Morning (Wakanda): T'Challa returns to Wakanda.

Does this make sense?

I don't get how a shootout in North-Kivu, DR Congo can approach the Wakandan border, when according to this, Wakanda does not border DR Congo.

I think Wakanda more likely borders Uganda to the south. Doesn't mean that map is wrong, just that it might have South as up and North as down. I have no clue how African borders are drawn in the MCU, but it's reasonable to conclude that Wakanda controls territory that, in our universe/Earth-1218, is controlled by DR Congo, and maybe Uganda. Maybe Rwanda, too. Who knows.

The upshot for timeline purposes is that that puts it most likely in the CAT (UTC+2) time zone. That's 10 hours ahead of PST (UTC-8 ) in winter and 9 hours ahead of PDT (UTC-7) in summer. I'm not sure that actually affects the timeline since all the times are pretty fuzzy anyways, but I can't quite wrap my head around this without mapping it out in a spreadsheet. Maybe one of you can tell.

Anyways, it might be helpful later on once the movie comes out to know it takes place in CAT (UTC+2).

 

[Craig]

In Punisher 1x03 "Kandahar", in the flashback to Micro faking his death a year before, his son mentions a haunted house and Micro walks through a Halloween/fall festival that they're going to, implying it occurs in October sometime before Halloween. That would align with Daredevil Season 2 ending in December, 2015, with Frank spending around 3-4 months (January to March/April) hunting down those connected to death of his family (shown in opening of the first episode), with the majority of show picking up six months later, in October, 2016 (presumably a month before events of Defenders, though if there is a mention in the show later on relating to events of that show already having occurred, its possible to move Punisher up a bit to occur just after Defenders, in mid or late November, if necessary).

Also, a character mentioned that it was 40 degrees outside, and another is later bow hunting. Definitely Fall.

Also, when Micro wishes Frank a happy birthday, he tells him it's the 15th. I see the MCU wiki lists his birthday as November 15, but I don't know their source. That would be too close to Defenders anyways, so I'm leaning towards October right now.

 

[DIrishB]

2 minutes and 55 seconds into the first episode, this is VERY easy to miss, but from what I can make out on the passport ticket it says "April 16 2017".

I think there's also a way to unblur screenshot'd text.

If you're able to sharpen it so we can confirm please let me know, as I was looking for date on the ticket but couldn't see any on it date-wise. Mid-April would line up with events of show picking up a little over 6 months later in early to mid November.

Also, a character mentioned that it was 40 degrees outside, and another is later bow hunting. Definitely Fall.

Also, when Micro wishes Frank a happy birthday, he tells him it's the 15th. I see the MCU wiki lists his birthday as November 15, but I don't know their source. That would be too close to Defenders anyways, so I'm leaning towards October right now.

I'm not sure where they got that date from either (really hope they're not just assuming its November based on the fact the show comes out in November, as they've done with other timeline placements). That said, the November 15 date does work, as it lines up with Halloween occurring a little over a year prior, when Micro faked his death and went into hiding. If the November 15 date is accurate, that means the first 3 episodes of Punisher occur at same time as the entirety of The Defenders (which complicates my job, means I have to rewatch Defenders to find best time code ordering approach to account for time of day in each episode and how they relate to each other...crap).

Also, I'm wondering when exactly Frank and Russo were in Kandahar (Frank mentions in a flashback in 1x03 that they'd been there for a year, meaning around a year passes between first Kandahar flashback and that scene). Frank does mention how his wife bought him Springsteen tickets at Meadowlands for his birthday (this occurs 29 days before he returns home, the next day after which his family is killed). In real world Springsteen played there in August, 2016, though that doesn't really jive with timeline of the shows since we know his return occurred before events of Daredevil Season 2 which occurred in latter portion of 2015. This is another occurrence where we'll have to assume difference between real world dates and the MCU's dates.

EDIT: Ugh, looking at the MCU wikia timeline again and not sure where they're getting all their specific dates from, especially since many directly clash with dates given onscreen. I honestly think they just use the release date approach for almost everything. Nothing lines up with the dates actually shown in the films or TV shows themselves.

 

[Lebnyx]

Also, I'm wondering when exactly Frank and Russo were in Kandahar (Frank mentions in a flashback in 1x03 that they'd been there for a year, meaning around a year passes between first Kandahar flashback and that scene). Frank does mention how his wife bought him Springsteen tickets at Meadowlands for his birthday (this occurs 29 days before he returns home, the next day after which his family is killed). In real world Springsteen played there in August, 2016, though that doesn't really jive with timeline of the shows since we know his return occurred before events of Daredevil Season 2 which occurred in latter portion of 2015. This is another occurrence where we'll have to assume difference between real world dates and the MCU's dates.

Apparently, in Daredevil 2x05, Ellison says the article on Castle's family being killed was published on April 14, and it had taken him a week to get it published. So, maybe that helps narrow it down.

 

[DIrishB]

Apparently, in Daredevil 2x05, Ellison says the article on Castle's family being killed was published on April 14, and it had taken him a week to get it published. So, maybe that helps narrow it down.

Hmmmm... that does help, though it conflicts with the November 15 date as Frank's birthday (which again the wikia doesn't seem to cite a source for, we know it's the 15th based on Micro's dialogue, but not the specific month). Further, if he got a birthday card and Springsteen tickets 29 days before he returned home (as 1x03 specifies in one of the Kandahar flashbacks), and Frank's family was killed the day after he returned home as specified on wikia, that'd place his birthday on March 15 (which is exactly 29 days before April 14, so that works, except it took a week to get published so that doesn't work).

Not sure on this one...

 

[TalonCard]

If you're able to sharpen it so we can confirm please let me know, as I was looking for date on the ticket but couldn't see any on it date-wise. Mid-April would line up with events of show picking up a little over 6 months later in early to mid November.

It looks like April 2017 to me as well (the date is to the right of the 2:45 boarding time on the ticket), but it's definitely out of focus for a reason; either to pull the viewer's attention to the name and departure time (which is completely clear and legible) and/or to deliberately obscure the date on the prop. *shrugs*

I noticed that the newspaper editor was carrying around the "Chaos Under the Streets" newspaper, and I thought it was a Defenders reference cause I recognized the cover, but it seems it's actually from Daredevil season 2. They've really got to get another set of newspaper props printed.

TC

 

[TalonCard]

November is confirmed in Episode 4; Frank's friend who runs the veteran's support group goes to help out one of the members who has moved into a foxhole in the backyard "in November".

TC

 

[DIrishB]

November is confirmed in Episode 4; Frank's friend who runs the veteran's support group goes to help out one of the members who has moved into a foxhole in the backyard "in November".

TC

Awesome, thanks for confirmation (I stopped after a Episode 3 before bed, lol). The Wikia was on point there then.

 

[Craig]

I didn't catch that line about the foxhole, but wouldn't that indicate that it was later than November? If it was the same month, you'd just say "a few days/weeks ago" or "earlier this month".

 

[selfishmisery]

I think April 2017 is probably correct for the first five minutes of episode one. Karen Page's actress mentioned in an interview that the events of The Defenders are still bugging her during the events of The Punisher.

 

[TalonCard]

I didn't catch that line about the foxhole, but wouldn't that indicate that it was later than November? If it was the same month, you'd just say "a few days/weeks ago" or "earlier this month".

Nah, I just didn't really do a good job of explaining the scene. Frank's friend goes out to this guy's house, and he's living in the backyard in a foxhole. Frank's friend is trying to tell this young guy that this isn't normal behavior, saying something like "You're living in the backyard. In a foxhole. In November." So it's definitely November when the conversation is taking place--he's laying out the guy's situation to him in real time, not talking about it to someone else later. (It would probably have been more clear if I could remember the names of the characters outside the main cast. )

Depending on how much time passes between episodes, it's still possible that Frank's birthday could have been October 15th, but November does seem more likely.

Episode 5, Gunner, ends on a Sunday--there's a reference to Frank being invited to a Sunday dinner that he hasn't shown up to when the episode ends.

TC

 

[selfishmisery]

I think April 2017 is probably correct for the first five minutes of episode one. Karen Page's actress mentioned in an interview that the events of The Defenders are still bugging her during the events of The Punisher.

April/October/November 2016 actually, I guess. The female FBI agent said that Schoover (Clancy Brown's character) was killed "a year ago", in the first episode.

 

[Craig]

Nah, I just didn't really do a good job of explaining the scene. Frank's friend goes out to this guy's house, and he's living in the backyard in a foxhole. Frank's friend is trying to tell this young guy that this isn't normal behavior, saying something like "You're living in the backyard. In a foxhole. In November." So it's definitely November when the conversation is taking place--he's laying out the guy's situation to him in real time, not talking about it to someone else later. (It would probably have been more clear if I could remember the names of the characters outside the main cast. )

Depending on how much time passes between episodes, it's still possible that Frank's birthday could have been October 15th, but November does seem more likely.

Episode 5, Gunner, ends on a Sunday--there's a reference to Frank being invited to a Sunday dinner that he hasn't shown up to when the episode ends.

TC

Ok, I remember the scene. I know he pointed out that it was only 40 degrees, but I don't recall him specifying the month.

 

[DIrishB]

I think April 2017 is probably correct for the first five minutes of episode one. Karen Page's actress mentioned in an interview that the events of The Defenders are still bugging her during the events of The Punisher.

Yeah, if the November 15 date is accurate for Frank's birthday and corresponding placement of episodes, then the first three episodes of Punisher occur at same time as Defenders.

I have to see if that makes sense regarding Karen's appearances in Defenders or not, though. It may work out since Karen appears only in the 1st, 5th, 7th, and 8th episode of Defenders, which cover the first three episodes of Punisher time wise, so perhaps her absence from some of Defenders episodes is due to her being busy helping Frank in Second Punisher episode. I'll have to rewatch Defenders to nail it down for sure and order time code sections properly in terms of apparent time of day.

 

[selfishmisery]

Plus, if Legion ends up being retconned into the MCU (taking into account that it is confirmed to be separate from the X-verse, the very secluded events, Clark Gregg's assumption in a AMA and the current Disney/FOX discussions), then we would have three different Marvel shows taking place concurrently in November 2016.

 

[DIrishB]

Punisher 1x06 has a few references to Thanksgiving, both a dream of Frank's at beginning noting its Thanksgiving, and later in the episode (around 25:00 minute mark) Frank and Micro discuss Thanksgiving traditions of their respective families over TV dinners, also indicating that day was Thanksgiving.

Thanksgiving is always held on Thursdays, but the previous episode 1x05 ended on a Sunday per dinner Micro's wife prepared for Frank (and who missed said dinner due to gunshot wounds).

Madani also mentions her and Russo had slept together two nights in a row, putting 1x06 at most beginning the very next day after 1x05.

Plus, if Legion ends up being retconned into the MCU (taking into account that it is confirmed to be separate from the X-verse, the very secluded events, Clark Gregg's assumption in a AMA and the current Disney/FOX discussions), then we would have three different Marvel shows taking place concurrently in November 2016.

Yeah, I wouldn't expect that anytime soon, if ever. Even should Marvel and Fox work out a deal, its extremely unlikely Marvel will fold in existing works as opposed to rebooting/making their own.

 

[DIrishB]

Was thinking, in terms of Thor - Ragnarok, the mid credits scene where the Asgardian ship encounters Thanos' ship may very well occur months after the main film. This allows placement of that scene in early 2018 to set up Avengers - Infinity War. That said, Loki asking Thor if bringing him to Earth is a good idea indicates it happens not long after Thor deciding to head to Earth. Ultimately, have to wait for Infinity War to come out so we can see how its set up.

 

[Craig]

Was thinking, in terms of Thor - Ragnarok, the mid credits scene where the Asgardian ship encounters Thanos' ship may very well occur months after the main film. This allows placement of that scene in early 2018 to set up Avengers - Infinity War. That said, Loki asking Thor if bringing him to Earth is a good idea indicates it happens not long after Thor deciding to head to Earth. Ultimately, have to wait for Infinity War to come out so we can see how its set up.

Yeah, that could work. Like, maybe they're getting kinda sorta close to Earth, so Loki feels the need to bring it up again? We'll see.

As for the Punisher/Thanksgiving thing, I caught that too. Perhaps it's not quite Thursday yet, and with the day approaching, he started dreaming about it and felt compelled to bring it up in conversation. I finished episode 7 and it's stated to take place on a Saturday night. So Turkey day had to have happened during a time skip either later in ep 6 or earlier in 7.

 

[selfishmisery]

Yeah, I wouldn't expect that anytime soon, if ever. Even should Marvel and Fox work out a deal, its extremely unlikely Marvel will fold in existing works as opposed to rebooting/making their own.

No way they will start over with David Haller; since Legion is practically one of Marvel's most acclaimed shows.

Their best bet is to continue the series; regardless of new management.

 

[DIrishB]

No way they will start over with David Haller; since Legion is practically one of Marvel's most acclaimed shows.

Their best bet is to continue the series; regardless of new management.

Think you're kidding yourself on that front. No matter how critically acclaimed it is, should Marvel/Fox deal happen, at best they'd keep it in a separate self contained continuity.

I'm telling you, Marvel are way too controlling and protective over their flagship (the MCU as a whole) to merely fold an existing show into the continuity like that. That controlling/protective nature is something any director or scriptwriter who has worked for Marvel will reiterate. Feige is a control freak, and he has to be in that position.

Nah, I can say with 100% certainty you'll never see Legion brought into the MCU. At best, should the Fox/Marvel deal happen, it'd just be left in its own continuity.

Any new stuff that may arise from that deal (if it ever happens) would be new rebooted material, and maybe folding Deadpool in due to its popularity, but even that I doubt.

 

[DIrishB]

Yeah, that could work. Like, maybe they're getting kinda sorta close to Earth, so Loki feels the need to bring it up again? We'll see.

I don't think that was intention but it's a possible break point to make sense of Ragnarok in 2017 and IW in 2018.

As for the Punisher/Thanksgiving thing, I caught that too. Perhaps it's not quite Thursday yet, and with the day approaching, he started dreaming about it and felt compelled to bring it up in conversation. I finished episode 7 and it's stated to take place on a Saturday night. So Turkey day had to have happened during a time skip either later in ep 6 or earlier in 7.

Ugh, the timeline for Punisher is weird. It works fine up until beginning of December. December 1 is a Sunday on this timeline, since Thanksgiving happens on Thurs Nov 28, 2016 in the MCU. Unfortunately the day/night cycle and dialogue pretty specifically date occurrences ("this happened x days ago" or whatnot), and the mission in 1x07 is specifically said to occur on a Saturday, which requires inserting 6 days to make it work for the following week.

 

[DIrishB]

Punisher 1x08 "Cold Steel", at around the 0:07:30 mark, Rawlins CIA file mentions he started working for the agency in 2015 as Director of Covert Affairs, which tells us the flashbacks to Kandahar had to occur during 2015 (after he was made Director of CA).

 

[DIrishB]

Punisher 1x09 confirms that the events of Daredevil Season 2 occurred a year prior (latter portion of the season anyway).

 

[selfishmisery]

Think you're kidding yourself on that front. No matter how critically acclaimed it is, should Marvel/Fox deal happen, at best they'd keep it in a separate self contained continuity.

I'm telling you, Marvel are way too controlling and protective over their flagship (the MCU as a whole) to merely fold an existing show into the continuity like that. That controlling/protective nature is something any director or scriptwriter who has worked for Marvel will reiterate. Feige is a control freak, and he has to be in that position.

Nah, I can say with 100% certainty you'll never see Legion brought into the MCU. At best, should the Fox/Marvel deal happen, it'd just be left in its own continuity.

Any new stuff that may arise from that deal (if it ever happens) would be new rebooted material, and maybe folding Deadpool in due to its popularity, but even that I doubt.

What can I say? I'm extremely open minded when it comes to these sorts of things.

 

[Craig]

Damn, Irish. Have fun with episode 10 lol.

 

[DIrishB]

At beginning of 1x10 Billy Russo mentions to the cop that its been a couple years since he's seen Frank, which while a lie (since he knows he's alive and saw him days earlier) does indicate the stuff in Kandahar occurred in early 2015 (can't be 2014 due to Rawlins CIA file showing he began working as Director of Covert Affairs in 2015). So, we can assume the events in Kandahar occurred in early 2015, with the events of the show occurring through November - December, 2016 (a year after events of Daredevil Season 2's closing). That fulfills the dialogue and props in all respects...so far.

And yeah, 1x10 is complicated in terms of chronological ordering of it. The scene detailing the Senator's rendition of the attack on him isn't treated as reality since Karen's account differed, so it's not included in the flashbacks to previously in the day, and treated only as a lie being told in modern portion.

 

[TalonCard]

Punisher 1x08 "Cold Steel", at around the 0:07:30 mark, Rawlins CIA file mentions he started working for the agency in 2015 as Director of Covert Affairs, which tells us the flashbacks to Kandahar had to occur during 2015 (after he was made Director of CA).

I had a slightly different read on this one; his position as Director of Covert Affairs seems to be the position he currently occupies in Virginia at the beginning of the series, which would mean that anything that happened in Kandahar would have taken place before he was sworn in. The file begins in 2015 with his current position, but the information on his career prior to that indicates a timeline that allows for slightly different conclusions.

The file goes on to state that he had a career as a CIA agent from 1992-1997, after which he began working for a series of private security firms until 2001-2004, when he was contracted by the US to work in Afghanistan and Iraq as a Chief Special Agent. It's at this point that he became a leader leader in the US intelligence community in Afghanistan, before returning to the US to be sworn in by the Senate. At some unspecified point his return, he was Deputy Director of Covert Affairs, but it's not clear if he was in Afghanistan, stateside, or both during that point. (In episode 5 we also see him being asked to become a deputy director in the present day, but this appears to be for the entire CIA.)

So essentially, it's possible for the Kandahar flashback to have happened at any time during 2001-2015, if needed. It's obviously not so early as 2001; and it seems likely that it did actually take place in 2015 as you state, but the file actually allows for quite a bit of flexibility, save that the flashback can't occur after 2015.

Madani also mentions her and Russo had slept together two nights in a row, putting 1x06 at most beginning the very next day after 1x05.

That's one way to interpret the line, but all we really know from the dialogue is that while the first time Russo and Madani slept together, Madini could have attributed their encounter to drinking, and that they have since slept together two nights in a row, the most recent of which at least did not involve alcohol. It's possible there was one depicted liaison that occurred the night before, and others less frequently. In their second on-screen encounter, Madani does seem to have recovered from her injuries from the car crash more than she had during the first, which seems to indicate more time having passed than one night.

Okay, so I feel absurd being that pedantic about fictional characters and their sex lives (and it's not the first time in this thread either, lol,) but hey, this is the life we lead. :lol:

TC

 

[DIrishB]

Ok, timeline is updated for The Punisher episodes. Not sure if the fact its first couple episodes occur at same time as The Defenders is intentional or just a production error, but it is what it is. It is a bit weird there's no mention of the earthquake that occurred in Defenders, and also the fact Karen sees Frank the same day after events of The Defenders in the early morning hours (November 11, 2016) and mentions nothing about what happened in that series. Honestly, I think, as usual, the showrunners weren't really paying attention to the timeline aspects and just overlooked it.

Anyway, also had to move events in Kandahar to 2014, since Frank was still in Kandahar on November 15 when he gets his birthday card and Springsteen tickets (doesn't align with real world timeline but thats no surprise), and mentions he'll be home in 29 days (December 14, 2014). Now, his family is killed the day after he gets back from deployment, but according to the MCU wikia page for him Frank was re-deployed after Kandahar to Iraq for unspecified time and returned home again (couldn't have been more than a few months, which is a short deployment time but perhaps he was only needed for particular mission or two, which makes sense given his being cream of the crop as shown when he and Billy were cherry picked for the Operation Cerberus team), at which point his family was killed the next day. This is partially supported by the flashback scenes in Punisher 1x13 to day his family died, as it looks like spring time, they're wearing light jackets and trees are green, which indicates early Spring most likely. This also allows Frank several months to recuperate from his injuries in that attack and begin tracking down who he thought was responsible, setting up events of Daredevil Season 2 to pick up in July.

I had a slightly different read on this one; his position as Director of Covert Affairs seems to be the position he currently occupies in Virginia at the beginning of the series, which would mean that anything that happened in Kandahar would have taken place before he was sworn in. The file begins in 2015 with his current position, but the information on his career prior to that indicates a timeline that allows for slightly different conclusions.

The file goes on to state that he had a career as a CIA agent from 1992-1997, after which he began working for a series of private security firms until 2001-2004, when he was contracted by the US to work in Afghanistan and Iraq as a Chief Special Agent. It's at this point that he became a leader leader in the US intelligence community in Afghanistan, before returning to the US to be sworn in by the Senate. At some unspecified point his return, he was Deputy Director of Covert Affairs, but it's not clear if he was in Afghanistan, stateside, or both during that point. (In episode 5 we also see him being asked to become a deputy director in the present day, but this appears to be for the entire CIA.)

So essentially, it's possible for the Kandahar flashback to have happened at any time during 2001-2015, if needed. It's obviously not so early as 2001; and it seems likely that it did actually take place in 2015 as you state, but the file actually allows for quite a bit of flexibility, save that the flashback can't occur after 2015.

Yeah, I came to same conclusion for different reason (basically the timeline of Frank's deployment, returning home, and estimated date his family was killed). I'm going to assume he was deployed in Kandahar for most of 2014, returning home in mid December.

That's one way to interpret the line, but all we really know from the dialogue is that while the first time Russo and Madani slept together, Madini could have attributed their encounter to drinking, and that they have since slept together two nights in a row, the most recent of which at least did not involve alcohol. It's possible there was one depicted liaison that occurred the night before, and others less frequently. In their second on-screen encounter, Madani does seem to have recovered from her injuries from the car crash more than she had during the first, which seems to indicate more time having passed than one night.

Okay, so I feel absurd being that pedantic about fictional characters and their sex lives (and it's not the first time in this thread either, lol,) but hey, this is the life we lead. :lol:

TC

Eh, no real reason to discard the dialogue itself. Pretty clear it was their second night together (rather the morning after their second night together--in a row), based on the dialogue.