Batman Begins (Movie spoilers)

Here was a movie that I didn't think I wanted to see, but was glad I did. I went in there with the typical Marvel fan-boy attitude that anything DC did could not top what excellence Marvel did, however, I was surprised to see that I would equate this movie to the excellence that the first Spider-Man delivered. I thought the story was strong, the acting spot on, and the characters brilliant. It's a great movie and actually the best movie that I have seen in a while. ;) Definitely a 9/10 as someone said earlier.

Only problem I had was the lack of Scarecrow. I thought he was supposed to be the big villain in this one and he didn't really seem to show up all that much. Liam Neison was far better than the 'Crow, but I thought he was supposed to be a little bit more than he was.
 
The movie I have been long waiting for and I WAS NOT disappointed. God, it was all right, this is how Batman should be. I loved the way they played his origins out, I loved how it was about the CHARACTERS, especially Bruce Wayne, and not the props and villians. So much has already been said I don't think I need to reiterate but I will mention some of my favorite things from the film.

The references to the comics : Here is finally a Batman movie that treats the comics with respect. The only real reference I can remember from the Burton films were that the Jokers origins somewhat paralled the origins shown in "The Killing Joke" (the best Joker story ever written). Not so in this one. I mean, hell, they had freaking Zsasz making an appearance. Nobody knows who Zsasz is anymore (my third favorite Bat-rogue). Also, don't be fooled by people telling you this isn't partially based off of Year One. It's its own unique story but it definitely pays alot of homage too Millers work. Batman doing the pushups, his meeting Gordon, Flass, Loeb, Falcone. Quite a bit of reference there. It was great fun spotting things though that were obviously thrown in by a true Bats fan for the true Bats fan too find. I'll be more on the sly for these when I see it again.

The way Batman is treated : The biggest mistake ALL the previous films made was showing how Batman was preceived by the criminals and outsiders. They showed Batman definitely as a man, completely defeating his persona and the illusion. To them he's supposed to be more akin to a force of nature, something that they cannot understand or stop. That was performed beautifully here. From the way he battled the thugs on the dock too how he handled Flass, the mystique that is quintessential too Batmans persona was there. Excellent.

The Origins : They did such a great job of making the origin work and making it believable. I loved how they inserted the idea of Chill being caught but killed before Bruce could extract revenge. It added a great dimension too the origin I think, and a very interesting twist.

The Villians : I knew they were going too be great from the get-start. How? Because Liam Neeson is a great actor and Cillian Murphy rules. But god, they were more than I could have hoped for. Scarecrow was CREEPY AS HELL and Ra's was delicious. A real class act. And the setup for the rest of Bats rogues. It was terrific.

Finally, I just gotta mention the scene that blew my mind and fully made me say "Holy Hell they finally got this right!" It was the scene where Bats questions Flass in the rain after Flass bought the falafel. That. Was. AWESOME!! They couldn't have done it any better.

Oh, and Oldman RULED as Gordon. Plain and simple. They finally got someone with the look, the talent and gave Gordon the proper role too make him the quintessential partner to Batman. Overall, and this might be giddyness speaking here but I think it could be true, this could be the best superhero movie I've seen. Its almost definitely the best Batman incarnation. 10/10

ps

ManWithoutFear : I might be missing something but as far as I can remember, John Williams never did a Batman score, Danny Elfmann (a favorite of my own) was the one who composed the '89 score and the theme music we all associate with Bats. Perhaps you can enlighten me if I have incomplete info? Thanks.
 
Excellent... I think I found the person that can help me out!

Entropy, can you tell me who villain was/ their brief history in the comic books? Are they a big chunk of Batman lore?
 
Goodwill said:
Only problem I had was the lack of Scarecrow. I thought he was supposed to be the big villain in this one and he didn't really seem to show up all that much. Liam Neison was far better than the 'Crow, but I thought he was supposed to be a little bit more than he was.

Scarecrow was in it just enough. He was still a major villain who worked under Ra's. Too much of a double villain can be absolutely terrible. Cillian did a great job and IMO Scarecrow wasn't overdone and that's the important thing.

Entropy... I think you are right and I'm ashamed... then again no one else called me out on it so you are wiser than most.
 
I loved the movie. Everything was perfect. I had one slight problem, i did not like the way bruce changed his voice when he was batman, he sounded funny. I love the joker card at the end my whole theater started clapping. :D
 
Wow. I saw this movie last night. It was great, I loved Scarecrow. This movie might get be reading Batman comics again. :)
 
TheManWithoutFear said:
Just forget 1989's Batman happened and go and see this.

I still like BATMAN RETURNS. This one is good, but BATMAN RETURNS is classic.
 
Goodwill

Here you go, hope this helps. I'm not sure if I missed someone in a smaller cameo but these are the major villians/rogues that did make an appearance. In short, yes there were some very prominent villians shown here that have a large section of Batman lore revolving around them (especially Ra's).

The Scarecrow - Jonathan Crane. In the comics, as opposed too the movie, Crane was not the head of Arkham Asylum, but he was a psychologist who specialized in fear. Alot of how he's portrayed is pretty close too the comics, but there are some differences. For instance, while the movie simply has him wearing a mask (which looks awesome) in the comics he wears a mask in addition too a tall floppy hat and patchwork get-up that looks like a scarecrows. He also usually dispenses his fear-gas from a device that looks like a squeezable skull (but he has used many other methods, such as darts, serums, ect.) Overall, I really love the way they treated Scarecrow in the movie. Cillian Murphy was the perfect choice I think. Charismatic but incredibly creepy, with the wirey frame and "spooky" complexion (pale skin, dark hair, ect).

Oh, just for an interesting fact, in the comics, while quite a few people can outfight the fear effects his toxins bring on, there is only one person that I definitely know of that has shown a total resistance too the fear-gas. The Joker. Scarecrow sprayed him once and Joker preceded too beat the hell out of him with a chair.

Ra's Al Ghul - Denny O'Neil and Neal Adams created Ra's back in the early 70s during their definitive Batman run. He was meant too kinda be the ultimate threat to Batman, someone who rivaled him in knowledge, ability, resources, power and belief in mission. Ra's mission is of course too rebalance the Earth by reducing the human populace. While the movie has this same mission, comicbook Ra's is more large-scale in his attempts while the movie made him more surgical. Still, almost everything else is the same but there are a few differences. One was the Lazarus Pits. Comicbook Ra's is immortal and these things are the secret too it. While the movie didn't show these or hint at them, there is still the possibility they exist and could be introduced later on. It would also allow for Ra's too return from the dead in a sequel since they can restore life, but I doubt this will happen. Still, Ra's did speak as if he had been living and using the League of Shadows for centuries in the movie, so who knows.

The other major element was Talia, Ra's daughter. She was a long-standing love interest too Bats and Ra's had deemed Bruce worthy of his daughter and of being his successor. She was also an incredibly skilled assassin. I will note that it was at least hinted at that she could exist since Ra's spoke of his wife (her death is also taken from the comics, see Son of the Demon). I understand why they didn't feature her, but I hope she makes an appearance in a later film, she has such a great character and history.

Overall I was really impressed with Ra's handling and think they nailed it. BTW, the stories by O'Neil/Adams featuring him (as well as their overall Batman run) were fantastic. I recommend reading them if possible through reprinting or back-issues.

Zsasz - Zsasz or Mr. Zsasz is a serial killer with a kind of existential view of life. He was a wealthy individual but lost everything and was going to kill himself but decided to kill others after he was almost mugged in the process of suicide. He views killing you as freeing you. Every time he kills someone, he carves a tallymark into his skin (a pity they weren't more prominently displayed but they are visible if you look at him closely). He's a creepy guy and makes for a great story when written right. His origins are different in the movie of course, but his character and methods are obviously the same. I was elated too see him show up.

Carmine "The Roman" Falcone - Pretty much the same as shown in the movie. Falcone was the last old-school crimeboss in Gotham and ran the underworld (along with the rest of the city) when Batman was making his debut (see Year One). He was killed off when Bats traditional rogues came onto the scene (can't remember issues for this).

also, Joe Chill comes from the Pre-Crisis Batman universe. Batman eventually did discover who killed his parents (Chill). Batman resisted the urge for revenge though and turned Chill in (pretty sure this is the full story, I don't have the story myself I've gotten it secondhand. I can check it out a little more though).

ManWithoutFear : There's no reason to be ashamed, we all get mixed up. Danny Elfmann and John Williams are both brilliant composers and I am a huge fan of both. Movies are my religion though, so I usually catch all the little things ;).
 
TheManWithoutFear said:
I'm not saying 1989 BATMAN was bad... why do you like Batman Returns so bad?

One word... make it 4... MICHELLE PFEIFFER AS CATWOMAN. Danny Devito was amazing as the Penguin. It was also the first movie I went with my step dad to go see, just him and me, so that's a big reason, but the biggest reason is when Batman pulls up his cape and it becomes that glider thing. I just love it.
 
I just saw this movie and it rocked! Best DC movie ever! Best comic book movie ever! I loved it!

Ras As Ghul is one of my favourite bad guys and Scarecrow was indeed creepy.

I may have to pick up some Batman trades...
 
Anyone looking to pick up any Batman Trades, here's my two-bits

1. Batman: The Long Halloween
2. Batman: Dark Victory
3. Batman: Year One
4. Batman: Dark Knight Returns
5. Batman: Killing Joke
6. Batman: Hush
7. JLA: Tower of Babel (a Batman/Ra's conflict)
8. Justice League: A New Beginning (the formation of JLI, with Batman running the league for a while)
9. Superman/Batman: vol. 1
10. Superman/Batman: vol. 2 (Supergirl)

The Jeph Loeb stories basically follow up on Year One with the early Batman Stories (in #1 & #2). The writer of this movie hinted that the next two movies would take the creation of Two-Face and his first actions as a criminal from TLH and DV....

with 1/2 of those stories being Jeph Loeb stories, can anyone guess who I like as a Batman Writer?
 
Well, I've read most of them and enjoyed them. Still haven't picked up Hush yet.
 
I finally saw it last night.




...TOOO.........AWESOME.........FOR WORDS................................. :shock: :shock: :shock:



Greatest comic book movie ever. Without hesitation. Christian Bale was perfect. I loved when he was just Bruce Wayne and had to act like a drunk, arrogant, jerk to keep up his persona. I loved the scene where he interrogates Flass by dropping him off the building. Bale did an awesome job.

The supporting cast was great too. Every scene with Alfred was perfect. Michael Caine as Alfred was great casting. Liam Neeson was perfect as Ra's. Cillian Murphy was very creepy as the scarecrow. I loved the scenes between Bruce and Lucius Fox and all the excuses that he has for why he needs the various peices of technology. Gary Oldman did a great job as Gordon (though I wish we had seen more of him). Really everybody was perfect.

The batmobile chase was one of the best I've ever seen. And the scene where the fear gas is released and Batman tries to stop the train...man was that scene cool.

And that last scene...."There's one guy...pulled a bank heist...committed a double homicide. Plus, he's got a thing for theatrics, like you. He leaves a calling card." *he gives Batman the Joker card* "I'll look into it." :D I can't wait for the next one!

So, yeah this movie :rockon: ed. Actually, it :rockon: ed so hard that Joel Schummacher's head must have exploded when he saw it.

:rockon: :rockon: :rockon: :rockon:
 
moonmaster said:
I finally saw it last night.




...TOOO.........AWESOME.........FOR WORDS................................. :shock: :shock: :shock:



Greatest comic book movie ever. Without hesitation. Christian Bale was perfect. I loved when he was just Bruce Wayne and had to act like a drunk, arrogant, jerk to keep up his persona. I loved the scene where he interrogates Flass by dropping him off the building. Bale did an awesome job.

The supporting cast was great too. Every scene with Alfred was perfect. Michael Caine as Alfred was great casting. Liam Neeson was perfect as Ra's. Cillian Murphy was very creepy as the scarecrow. I loved the scenes between Bruce and Lucius Fox and all the excuses that he has for why he needs the various peices of technology. Gary Oldman did a great job as Gordon (though I wish we had seen more of him). Really everybody was perfect.

The batmobile chase was one of the best I've ever seen. And the scene where the fear gas is released and Batman tries to stop the train...man was that scene cool.

And that last scene...."There's one guy...pulled a bank heist...committed a double homicide. Plus, he's got a thing for theatrics, like you. He leaves a calling card." *he gives Batman the Joker card* "I'll look into it." :D I can't wait for the next one!

So, yeah this movie :rockon: ed. Actually, it :rockon: ed so hard that Joel Schummacher's head must have exploded when he saw it.

:rockon: :rockon: :rockon: :rockon:




I just saw it and agree with everything you said!!!


'Cept Liam Neeson plays Henri Ducard, Ken Watanabe plays Ra's.
 
ultimatedjf said:
'Cept Liam Neeson plays Henri Ducard, Ken Watanabe plays Ra's.

Er......were you paying attention?
 
moonmaster said:
In the scene at the birthday party in Wayne Manor, Ducard reveals that he IS Ra's. It's the big plot twist of the movie.




I had a feeling you where gonna say that. See, there was a bit of a sound problem and that part got a little messed. :(
 

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