Hawkeye's Revenge (Ults. 2 spoilers) [sensitive matter]

compound

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 28, 2005
Messages
2,772
Location
Metro Manila, Philippines
While on the subject of Hawkeye exacting revenge on Widow, I'd like to express my faith in Millar not to even imply rape as part of the payback deal.

Yes, she probably deserves it more than any other female comic character who has been subjected to it EVER, quite frankly.

And yes, it IS a crime of violence rather than a crime of passion.

But not only would it be horribly out of character for Hawkeye (torture-induced trauma notwithstanding) it would just needlessly amp up the gratuity level beyond what it's already reached by showing the ostensible Good Guys to be not above the same level of depravity as the designated antagonists.

Do you think Millar and Hitch would go there?
 

MoS

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 9, 2005
Messages
1,034
Location
Portland, OR
Re: The 'R' Word

compound said:
While on the subject of Hawkeye exacting revenge on Widow, I'd like to express my faith in Millar not to even imply rape as part of the payback deal.

Yes, she probably deserves it more than any other female comic character who has been subjected to it EVER, quite frankly.

And yes, it IS a crime of violence rather than a crime of passion.

But not only would it be horribly out of character for Hawkeye (torture-induced trauma notwithstanding) it would just needlessly amp up the gratuity level beyond what it's already reached by showing the ostensible Good Guys to be not above the same level of depravity as the designated antagonists.

Do you think Millar and Hitch would go there?

Have you read Millar's The Authority run?

But, no, I don't think that'll happen, not in a Marvel comic, and not by one of the "heroes"
 

TheManWithoutFear

#1 reason not to join UC
Joined
Nov 30, 2004
Messages
16,716
Location
Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, United States
Re: The 'R' Word

compound said:
While on the subject of Hawkeye exacting revenge on Widow, I'd like to express my faith in Millar not to even imply rape as part of the payback deal.

Yes, she probably deserves it more than any other female comic character who has been subjected to it EVER, quite frankly.

And yes, it IS a crime of violence rather than a crime of passion.

But not only would it be horribly out of character for Hawkeye (torture-induced trauma notwithstanding) it would just needlessly amp up the gratuity level beyond what it's already reached by showing the ostensible Good Guys to be not above the same level of depravity as the designated antagonists.

Do you think Millar and Hitch would go there?

What the?! No. Who said anything about Rape?

And I don't think Widow will die either. She's gonna be locked up. She'll be asked "Why did you do it" She'll interact with Tony after Vol. 2, she'll interact with Hawkeye, and she'll interact with Fury. People want to see her stick her nose up to these people or breakdown and beg for forgiveness. But yeah, somebody losing it and killing her would be "kewl" wouldn't it?
 

compound

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 28, 2005
Messages
2,772
Location
Metro Manila, Philippines
Re: The 'R' Word

Rhyo said:
Have you read Millar's The Authority run?

But, no, I don't think that'll happen, not in a Marvel comic, and not by one of the "heroes"
Yup. That's precisely why I brought it up.

I just didn't mention the specific context, because I didn't want to spoil it.

I have no doubt the idea has probably crossed their minds.

Heck, Wanted practically ends with the implied ***-raping of the readers.
re: Wanted

And incestuous devil-raping was the unfortunate "punchline" of the otherwise lovely Chosen.
re: Chosen

I was just wondering if they'd go through with it precisely in a Marvel title.
 
Last edited:

E.Vi.L.

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 15, 2005
Messages
1,276
Location
Montréal
Re: Ultimates V2 #9 discussion (SPOILERS!!)

Huh. I read The Authority. Don't remember a rape.

Only rape of a villain in a comic book I can think of is Mr Hyde raping the invisible man in the The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen Vol 2.

Quite shocking and, seriously, this was Hyde we're talking about so it was disturbingly in-character.

Don't see it happening in this case. Who would do it?!
 
Last edited:

compound

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 28, 2005
Messages
2,772
Location
Metro Manila, Philippines
Re: Ultimates V2 #9 discussion (SPOILERS!!)

E.Vi.L. said:
Huh. I read The Authority. Don't remember a rape.
Midnighter raped the Cap analog who was leading "The Americans", as revenge for assaulting Apollo, if I remember correctly. I'd need to read it again.

E.Vi.L. said:
Don't see it happening in this case. Who would do it?!
A seriously pissed-off, vengeance-crazed, torture-ravaged Hawkeye.

Besides, what could possibly be more demeaning, as a psy-op tactic, than capturing Widow alive, and figuratively pumping her for information?

Excessive? Sure! But so are electrodes wired to a POW's testicles...

Yes, I did just go there.
 
Last edited:

E

Moderator
Excelsior Club
Joined
May 17, 2004
Messages
33,346
Location
MI
This can continue because I know what compund's intent was, but it's being watched closely.
 

ProjectX2

Don't expect me to take you with me when I go to s
Joined
Sep 15, 2004
Messages
25,007
I'd have more satisfaction with Hawkeye slicing off her head with a dinner plate.
 

Entropy

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 23, 2005
Messages
1,080
Location
North of the equator
Re: Ultimates V2 #9 discussion (SPOILERS!!)

compound said:
Midnighter raped the Cap analog who was leading "The Americans", as revenge for assaulting Apollo, if I remember correctly. I'd need to read it again.

Em, pretty close. The Commander raped Apollo (though that was all implied) and after Apollo takes out the good majority of the group The Commander was leading, he leaves the paralyzed guy at the mercy of Midnighter. Who appears carrying a jackhammer.

In regards to the topic of this thread, I DO NOT want to see it happen, or even have it be implied and I don't think Millar will go there. It would be totally out of character for Hawkeye and a completely demeaning to the entire story. Widow should be punished in a more fitting manner, and Hawkeye should have a more fitting revenge. I mean hell, if they wanted a far more terrifying and satisfying revenge, they should have a scene of Hawkeye standing at the caskets of his family, apologizing because he couldn't protect them and has to bury them. Then he turns to another casket and whispers in through an airhole "For you, I'm not so sorry". Of course, inside would be Widow and then we get a shot of him filling in her grave.
 

Random

Didn't **** any of those *****es
Joined
Jun 16, 2005
Messages
13,680
Location
Philadelphia, PA
Yeah it is definitely out of character for Hawkeye. Widow killed the woman he loves and he family, when he sees her he will probably think of her shooting his son. I cannot in any way see him even considering that.
 

Friday

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 6, 2004
Messages
8,903
Location
Washington, PA
See, now I didn't see any implied rape in Millars Authority, aside from the road drill, and even then it seemed like a creative and scarring way to kill the guy. The bit with Apollo and The Commander I didn't see atall, and I'll have to re-read it soon to see where you guys are coming from on it.
As for Hawkeye, I seriously doubt he'll be raping anyone. Will he kill Widow? I doubt that too. I'd expect him to do something similar to what The Wasp did in V1, wreack havock in the anti-ultimates base and then **** up The Corperal/Red Skull/Darth Maul since he was more than liekly the person impsersonating Cap in the assult that killed his family.
 

ProjectX2

Don't expect me to take you with me when I go to s
Joined
Sep 15, 2004
Messages
25,007
The only rape scene I remember from the Authority was when that Commander guy knocked out the receptionist.
 

E.Vi.L.

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 15, 2005
Messages
1,276
Location
Montréal
Re: Ultimates V2 #9 discussion (SPOILERS!!)

UltimateE said:
I didn't think you did mean to offend, it was just with the description it was a little over the top.

That's how I do business!

But I guess I see your point. I was really posting a reply to Compound who is reasonably mature but who knows who was going to read it next, right? TGO? DirishB? Bass? This could have been ugly.

;)
 
Last edited:

E

Moderator
Excelsior Club
Joined
May 17, 2004
Messages
33,346
Location
MI
Re: Ultimates V2 #9 discussion (SPOILERS!!)

E.Vi.L. said:
But I guess I see your point. I was really posting a reply to Compound who is reasonably mature but who knows who was going to read it next, right? TGO?

EXACTLY. Nail on the head.
 

thee great one

Master of TOG-fu.
Joined
Jan 27, 2005
Messages
15,570
Location
Mormon Land.
Re: Ultimates V2 #9 discussion (SPOILERS!!)

UltimateE said:
EXACTLY. Nail on the head.

...

why me? Why would I even joke about someone being raped? It's one of the worst things you can do to a person.
 
Last edited:

E

Moderator
Excelsior Club
Joined
May 17, 2004
Messages
33,346
Location
MI
Re: Ultimates V2 #9 discussion (SPOILERS!!)

thee great one said:
...

why me? Why would I even joke about someone being raped.

Laziness. You're too easy. Sorry man.
 

E

Moderator
Excelsior Club
Joined
May 17, 2004
Messages
33,346
Location
MI
Re: Ultimates V2 #9 discussion (SPOILERS!!)

thee great one said:
Are you calling me a slut senor?

Whoops - I didn't read your whole post and then you edited it. I didn't mean joking about people getting raped, I meant taking a joke too far. Didn't mean to imply you thought it was funny that people get raped...
 

E.Vi.L.

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 15, 2005
Messages
1,276
Location
Montréal
My opinion on the subject of the possibility of Hawkeye raping Widow is simply that it's out of character. One doesn't become a rapist just because he's pissed and we have no reason to think that Hawkeye is that kind of man.

I disagree though that this isn't the kind of situation that could be depicted in The Ultimates.

We already have a wife beating incident in this book, after all. And murder of a little boy. And an incident of cannibalism.

This book isn't really for kids.

But Hawkeye raping Widow would be just gratuitous and would have no storytelling merits as well as being out of character.
 
Last edited:

thee great one

Master of TOG-fu.
Joined
Jan 27, 2005
Messages
15,570
Location
Mormon Land.
Re: Ultimates V2 #9 discussion (SPOILERS!!)

UltimateE said:
Whoops - I didn't read your whole post and then you edited it. I didn't mean joking about people getting raped, I meant taking a joke too far. Didn't mean to imply you thought it was funny that people get raped...

It's cool. I have to have a funny joke to take it to far.
 
Last edited:

Latest posts

Top