Hawkeye's Revenge (Ults. 2 spoilers) [sensitive matter]

E

Moderator
Excelsior Club
E.Vi.L. said:
Except in this case it's not the removal of the hammer but of the belt that caused him to lose his powers.

Mjolnir is a famous enchanted weapon from mythology. Not so with the belt.

Seldes had posted something waaaaay back when (I think in one of Bass's manifestos) about how Thor from Norse mythology needed his belt to lift Mjolnir.
 

DIrishB

The Timeline Guy
UltimateE said:
Seldes had posted something waaaaay back when (I think in one of Bass's manifestos) about how Thor from Norse mythology needed his belt to lift Mjolnir.

Interesting...so even way back when the Vikings were integrating clothing-coordination with their gods. Metrosexuals, look out!
 

Seldes Katne

Site mom
I've seen different interpretations of the question of whether Thor needed the belt to lift and swing Mjolnir or not. Certainly having the belt (which is called Megingjord, or a variation thereof, in the myths) allows Thor to use the hammer much more effectively. Megingjord either doubles or triples Thor's strength, depending on whose version of the stories you read. If I recall correctly, Thor acquired Mjolnir before Megingjord, but I'll have to check that.

I think it worth noting, however, that Mark Millar doesn't seem to be drawing on Norse mythology so much as he's re-interpreting the Marvel version of Norse mytholgy, and both he and Marvel seem to play rather fast and loose with the subject matter. (For example, Volstagg doesn't appear in any of the myths of which I'm aware, and here in the Ultimate Universe he resembles mythological Thor much more closely than Ultimate Thor does.)

By the way, here's an interesting little tidbit people might enjoy: The Staff of Jord. Note what Jord has to say about the magical items at the end of the story. Again, a different interpretation of the myths, so make of it what you wish.

Which reminds me: I've got a comment to add to the Issue #9 thread about Mjolnir when I get a minute....
 
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train

Member
i'm a little late to the party here, but i've read thru this thread. several people have theorized that perhaps the Red Skull may have impersonated Cap during the raid on Hawkeye's apartment. i don't see this as being possible, as the Red Skull is obviously middle eastern. Cap is a aryan as it gets. it would be the equilivant of Osama bin Laden impersonating Brad Pitt. just doesn't work. had to have been Loki.
 

TheManWithoutFear

#1 reason not to join UC
train said:
i'm a little late to the party here, but i've read thru this thread. several people have theorized that perhaps the Red Skull may have impersonated Cap during the raid on Hawkeye's apartment. i don't see this as being possible, as the Red Skull is obviously middle eastern. Cap is a aryan as it gets. it would be the equilivant of Osama bin Laden impersonating Brad Pitt. just doesn't work. had to have been Loki.
Agreed but the last part; "Had to have been Loki" isn't necessarily true. It couldn't been a number of things. Not just Loki.
 

DIrishB

The Timeline Guy
SeAcoW said:
Have to go the same way with you. Please if you have any, show me something on paper !

I could say the same thing. One, Hawkeye's called Hawkeye because he's a frigging sharp-shooting professional. He uses bow and arrow because thats what he's trained the most with, and those are substantially harder shots to make using a bow than a handgun in terms of aim. Second, from Ultimates 2 #7 and the beginning of #9 alone, we know he can turn pretty much anything into a deadly weapon and hit very accurately with it. Thats something Black Widow can't do. Why are you being so difficult when the answers are staring you right in the face? Here's your "something on paper":

Ultimates 2 #9, page 3, panel 1:

The doctor (speaking to Hawkeye): "And there's nothing less frightening than the best shot in the world with nothing in his hands."

It doesn't get any more plain than that. Why you would think Black Widow is a better shot than the (now established, but already obvious) best shot in the world is beyond me, but thats where we're at. Hopefully this will help you get your mind made up.

I'm really trying not to be a dick, but seriously, you had it coming with that one.
 

J. Agamemnon

Well-Known Member
E.Vi.L. said:
Huh. I read The Authority. Don't remember a rape.

Only rape of a villain in a comic book I can think of is Mr Hyde raping the invisible man in the The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen Vol 2.

Quite shocking and, seriously, this was Hyde we're talking about so it was disturbingly in-character.

Don't see it happening in this case. Who would do it?!
Have you read Preacher? There's a hilbilly that eff's a chicken. And what about Watchmen? The Comedian takes it to that one chick. Her name slips me. Then, he gets his ace kicked by the Night owl guy...that was awesome...

train said:
i'm a little late to the party here, but i've read thru this thread. several people have theorized that perhaps the Red Skull may have impersonated Cap during the raid on Hawkeye's apartment. i don't see this as being possible, as the Red Skull is obviously middle eastern. Cap is a aryan as it gets. it would be the equilivant of Osama bin Laden impersonating Brad Pitt. just doesn't work. had to have been Loki.
Yeah, but in the original run, wasn't red skull a clone of Rogers. Just that his face got melted. I heard Abomination, Crimson Guardian, and I think the Mandarin are apart of the "anti-ultimates"...

One more thing, Aryan IS middle eastern, not anglo. Cap is as anglo as it gets. So, Red Skull being the culprit would make more sense. Or am I missing something...
 

Entropy

Well-Known Member
J. Agamemnon said:
One more thing, Aryan IS middle eastern, not anglo. Cap is as anglo as it gets. So, Red Skull being the culprit would make more sense. Or am I missing something...

When he said Aryan, he was thinking in terms of 19th Century and Aryan Race philosophy. You are indeed right, Aryan is a proper terminology for Persians or Iranians. The concepts have just become muddled due to historical events.
 

J. Agamemnon

Well-Known Member
Entropy said:
When he said Aryan, he was thinking in terms of 19th Century and Aryan Race philosophy. You are indeed right, Aryan is a proper terminology for Persians or Iranians. The concepts have just become muddled due to historical events.


Yeah, I see what you're trying to say. Arya actually translates to noble. I think the Nazi's took it to mean master. They then thought they were the master race. I don't actually think there was any historical evidence to back this up. But I still think it's possible that it's the Red Skull.
 

E.Vi.L.

Well-Known Member
J. Agamemnon said:
Have you read Preacher? There's a hilbilly that eff's a chicken. And what about Watchmen? The Comedian takes it to that one chick. Her name slips me. Then, he gets his ace kicked by the Night owl guy...that was awesome...

Firstly, the Night Owl never lifted a finger againts the comedian. You are thinking of Hooded Justice.

Secondly, my statement concerned of Villains being raped as a result of their action. Never read precher but the Watchmen example doesn't qualify.

Thirdly... Have we gone back in time?! ;)
 
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J. Agamemnon

Well-Known Member
E.Vi.L. said:
Firstly, the Night Owl never lifted a finger againts the comedian. You are thinking of Hooded Justice.

Secondly, my statement concerned of Villains being raped as a result of their action. Never read precher but the Watchmen example doesn't qualify.

Thirdly... Have we gone back in time?! ;)


Oh, well I thought you meant just rapes in general. Yeah I just started reading Watchmen so I get people mixed. Who's the guy in the trenchcoat. His name slips me. I liked him the best.
 

J. Agamemnon

Well-Known Member
E said:
Seldes had posted something waaaaay back when (I think in one of Bass's manifestos) about how Thor from Norse mythology needed his belt to lift Mjolnir.


True, I think the belt also had a name...not sure though.
 

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