Holy Terror by Frank Miller

Re: Batman vs Al Qaeda - By Frank Miller

Jaggyd said:
See as much as Miller's jingoism/sexism/homophobia and Byrne's sexism/homophobia now bothers me, I'm able to detach myself from any disgust i have for them. I'll reread Miller's Daredevil and Elektra and Byrne's X-Men/Alpha Flight until i go blind. I feel that those pieces of work are some of the best in comic book storytelling.
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I'm with you.
 
Frank Miller's Lords of Warcraft.
 
Bass said:
I find that I can't.
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Well I don't agree Clint Eastwood's political opinions, but I still enjoy his work. However I think Eastwood is far more respectful and thoughtful then Frank Miller is and Eastwood never had such a decline in his work as Miller has. Miller hasn't written anything good in the last decade and has been living off fumes the 80s. Eastwood has made some of his best movies in this past decade.
 
There's a fundamental difference in Clint Eastwood's anti-war, pro-choice political views in which he believes in inalienable rights for all human beings, even if those views seem opposed to yours, and vitriolic hate-speech masquerading as patriotism and a denial of people's humanity that Frank Miller and John Byrne espouse. A person can have different views to you and yet you can respect them greatly for having the opposing view.

Clint Eastwood has made, and continues to make, wonderful work due to his humanity and his understanding of other people's humanity. This is irrespective of where he falls on the political spectrum. John Byrne and Frank Miller were relevant in the 80s, but can no longer produce anything of quality because their mindset is so inhumane towards others, that people are offended by their unfounded, irrational, and hateful lecturing.

To put it another way: The reason I cannot tolerate or respect (I never actually liked Miller's work, I just respected its position in the industry) Miller or Byrne's works is not because their views are right-wing, but because they're rather morally abhorrent people. (At least, they appear so in their forays into the public sector.)
 
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Bass said:
There's a fundamental difference in Clint Eastwood's anti-war, pro-choice political views in which he believes in inalienable rights for all human beings, even if those views seem opposed to yours, and vitriolic hate-speech masquerading as patriotism and a denial of people's humanity that Frank Miller and John Byrne espouse. A person can have different views to you and yet you can respect them greatly for having the opposing view.
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Its not those views that I disagree with Clint Eastwood, Clint Eastwood is a moderate right winger, but he still is a right winger and I am not. He supports John McCain in the last US election and I did not. But that's irrelevant to how much I enjoy his work. One can disagree and not be disagreeable.

To but it another way, Steve Ditko is a really hardcore Objectivist and I am not, but I still like the work he did for Marvel in the 60s, even though his other stuff is too preachy. Considering Ditko designed many of the characters in Spider-man, he did make an important contribution to comic books in general, even if his politics are a bit out there.

Bass said:
Clint Eastwood has made, and continues to make, wonderful work due to his humanity and his understanding of other people's humanity. This is irrespective of where he falls on the political spectrum. John Byrne and Frank Miller were relevant in the 80s, but can no longer produce anything of quality because their mindset is so inhumane towards others, that people are offended by their unfounded, irrational, and hateful lecturing.

To put it another way: The reason I cannot tolerate or respect (I never actually liked Miller's work, I just respected its position in the industry) Miller or Byrne's works is not because their views are right-wing, but because they're rather morally abhorrent people. (At least, they appear so in their forays into the public sector.)
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Fair enough, I can personally like separate the man from his work and still enjoy some of the stuff from the 80s. Frank Miller comes off as a different person in the 80s, with his work having more humanity make then. In the 80s he even injected some humor and fun into his Daredevil stories despite the darkness of those stories, it was a good balance of light hearted and dark that many writers can't seem to do nowadays. Now Miller writes stories where Batman forces Robin to eat rats, there is no humanity in a story like that. I think Miller was changed for the worse by 9-11, which is why I think he is writing is far less likable then it was in the 80s.
 
Bass said:
I find that I can't.
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I would hate it if that was the case. I can't imagine letting that affect how I enjoy a comic (or anything else for that matter).
 
A repost from my Facebook, felt like people will actually read it here.

Y'know, it amuses me how many people are defending Frank Miller's recent web posts. Most of them don't seem to understand, or want to, the OWS movement. They, and Miller, also seem to believe that Muslim = Terrorist. When you point out the truths of the world, such as without being taxed and regulated, Corporations will crush us all, they scream that you "don't understand economics, or the real world". You point out the BILLIONS of Muslims who aren't terrorists, or the Christians who are terrorists, they scream "You're a terrorist sympathizer!". It amazes me how they are so willing and able to wear the Martyr/Oppressed sign, when they are the Oppressors.
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Sorry Jaggyd, but I've been to our secret meetings and we all want to kill all white men and enslave all women. Any colour. We're egalitarian in that way.
 
Bass said:
Sorry Jaggyd, but I've been to our secret meetings and we all want to kill all white men and enslave all women. Any colour. We're egalitarian in that way.
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I met this guy, in person. This is completely true.
 
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