How should Batman be written?

SSJmole

SSJmole

Face-Punching As Foreign Policy
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Spun off from Planet-man's how many heroes thread


Planet-man said:
I only mention him here because he's publicly affiliated with the Justice League, and seems to be thought of as a superhero within the DCU, which like you I don't think he should be.

I think Batman works best if no one knows if he has powers or not, because he's never made a public appearance. He comes out at night and fights criminals from the shadows. He rarely speaks, and when he does it's in a terrifying below, a la Batman Begins. The only people aware of his great detective skills are the main members of the JLA, who secretly work with him unbeknownst to the world.

But once again....this is more of a "How should Batman be written?" discussion.;)
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I 100% agree with this.

That is one of things I tried to do in My ultimate batman story is add more detective elements.

See I've read batman comics and alot from 1990's-now just don't do it for me. why? because to me it seems alot of modern stories try and make it dark just to be dark. Yes he is a dark character but that is just part of what he should be


The dark element and the scary act he does is like you mentioned him doing that to get a mental edge over his opponent. He's not the last son of Krypton , He wasn't bitten by radio active bugs He is basically a normal man.


When they loose the detective element they to me loose his best quality. He has no powers he relies in mind games , been a detective and big boy toys. That is what I like when they add Robin.

When they add robin it shows he kinda thinks of the young robin as a little him and a son and shows more emotion to him. I think when Robin left Batman should NOT of got another robin thou

In doing that it took away from the father figure. Sure add batgirl maybe a batboy or something but not another Robin as it's like trying to replace a dead/run away child by getting another kid and dressing them the same.

The batmobile to me should be a slick small sports car type. like batman-batman and robin. This again adds to the stealth factor and keeping him hidden as maybe a legend. If its a tank like begins then people know he is real as a tank tends to stand out.

Like i've tried to do with my story (not trying to self promote it's just kinda relevant to topic) Lex is supperman villain yes but we are always lead to believe he's a ruthless business man who would eliminate any rival company. LexCorp and WayneEnterprises seem very similar so Lex Should be used in batman too as Bruce's rival using dirty tactics to try and get the upper hand
 
Honestly, I've preferred Morrison and Dini's runs. He's dark, he's intelligent (3rd most intelligent hero in the DCU) and most of all, not 100% stable.
 
If you ask me, Batman shouldn't even be part of The JLU or any other superhero teams; outside of "The bat family" he should be pretty reclusive.

I know that I'm sorta alone on this...but I love Frank Millar's Batman. The anti-social, angry guy who refuses to get over his Parent's death, as portrayed in Year one, DKR and All Star (to a lesser extent).
 
Wade_Wilson said:
If you ask me, Batman shouldn't even be part of The JLU or any other superhero teams; outside of "The bat family" he should be pretty reclusive.
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I partially agree.

I think he should secretly be affiliated with the JL. but the public never suspects it. And no matter how big or small the JL gets, the only people who should know of the partnership are the main 10 or 15 members.

However like I said I don't think there should be a bat-family at all.

I also wouldn't be opposed to a long-distance internet partnership with The Question, for the various scoops and crucial information they can trade with eachother.

I know that I'm sorta alone on this...but I love Frank Millar's Batman. The anti-social, angry guy who refuses to get over his Parent's death, as portrayed in Year one, DKR and All Star (to a lesser extent).
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I love him too.;)
 
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Planet-man said:
I also don't think he should work with the GCPD, just Cmnr. Gordon himself. Has anyone read Dennis O'Neal's novelization of Knightfall? Gordon contacts Batman, or vice-versa, and they meet secretly in various locations to tip each other off. The Bat-signal is used by the GCPD, who claim they use it to alert Batman in order to frighten criminals, but don't actually know that Batman has a contact inside the force(let alone the Cmnr. himself).

I think that's perfect.

Now, I'd also like to mention another huge issue for me, and probably the one that generates the most controversy with other Bat-fans...

I don't think he should have any sidekicks at all apart from Alfred. No Dick Grayson, no Batgirl, MAYBE an Oracle, but even that I'm opposed to because Alfred can do it anyway. He should have a few allies than can come show up to rescue him if anything goes wrong, like Superman(who would be one of the few people other than Alfred to know his secret identity), but other than that, I absolutely despise the idea of Batman having sidekicks.

It just makes no sense. What's scary about a 15-year-old in red and green tights? Why would he need a combat partner? He's the best martial artist in the world!



I totally agree with this too, and it completely fits with my philosophy too(whether or not you agree with all of it).


By the way, who are the #1 and #2 smartest heroes?
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I totally agree with you on this, as MUCH as I love Babs, Dick, Tim and Kate (even though, she's a rogue heroine like Huntress)...I just really don't like the sidekick thing for him. It just SCREAMS 1960's sillyness.

If they were going to use Robin, Nightwing or Batgirl...they should be derivative heroes, and not endorsed by Bruce.


According to several comics during IC/52/OYL. The list of top three smartest men in the DCU is.

1. Mr Terrific
2. Dr Magnus
3. Bruce Wayne
 
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Planet-man said:
I partially agree.

I think he should secretly be affiliated with the JL. but the public never suspects it. And no matter how big or small the JL gets, the only people who should know of the partnership are the main 10 or 15 members.

However like I said I don't think there should be a bat-family at all.

I also wouldn't be opposed to a long-distance internet partnership with The Question, for the various scoops and crucial information they can trade with eachother.



I love him too.;)
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I would agree that it's out of character for Batman to employ teenage sidekicks...but I'm a Cassandra Cain fan, I'm a Nightwing fan, I'm a Barbara Gordon fan and I like Tim Drake as a character. Not to mention Huntress, Black Cannary, Azrael etc.
 
Wade_Wilson said:
I would agree that it's out of character for Batman to employ teenage sidekicks...but I'm a Cassandra Cain fan, I'm a Nightwing fan, I'm a Barbara Gordon fan and I like Tim Drake as a character.
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Same deal here... Although I think Dark Victory does a good job of explaining Robin and why Batman lets him in...
 
Wade_Wilson said:
I would agree that it's out of character for Batman to employ teenage sidekicks...but I'm a Cassandra Cain fan, I'm a Nightwing fan, I'm a Barbara Gordon fan and I like Tim Drake as a character. Not to mention Huntress, Black Cannary, Azrael etc.
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I dont see it out of character, it reminds me of a master and apprentice relationship, when a ninja or knight gets an apprentice they are very young
 
Random said:
I dont see it out of character, it reminds me of a master and apprentice relationship, when a ninja or knight gets an apprentice they are very young
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I just meant that it seems very out of character for Batman to be putting teens (even preteens) in the path of bullets and psychopaths just so that he can have "an apprentice". The deaths of Jason Todd and Stephanie...whatever her last name is (Spoiler/Robin #4) have proven that.

On another note, Batman should NOT be involved with the Justice League, or any other super teams. If anything at all, I could see them at opposition with one another.
 
Random said:
I dont see it out of character, it reminds me of a master and apprentice relationship, when a ninja or knight gets an apprentice they are very young
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But it's different here.

It's not so much the letting someone in, it's the fact that having anyone stand next to him(literally stand there next to him) when he's fighting criminals looks ridiculous, and Batman is all about physical presence.

A Ninja and knight(whether Medieval or Jedi;)) can show up with an apprentice and have people say "Oh no! He's got backup!". With Batman, they'd say "Who the hell's that?", followed by the realization that Batman must be a normal vigilante dressed like a bat, and not a monster at all.

Also, I still can't figure out what he'd need one for. Like I said, he's pretty much the world's best martial artist, and he's a belt full of gadgets. On top of that he's fighting enemies who can't see him and are already scared ****less. He's pretty much set.
 
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Planet-man said:
But it's different here.

It's not so much the letting someone in, it's the fact that having anyone stand next to him(literally stand there next to him) when he's fighting criminals looks ridiculous, and Batman is all about physical presence.

A Ninja and knight(whether Medieval or Jedi;)) can show up with an apprentice and have people say "Oh no! He's got backup!". With Batman, they'd say "Who the hell's that?", followed by the realization that Batman must be a normal vigilante dressed like a bat, and not a monster at all.

Also, I still can't figure out what he'd need one for. Like I said, he's pretty much the world's best martial artist, and he's a belt full of gadgets. On top of that he's fighting enemies who can't see him and are already scared ****less. He's pretty much set.
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So why is Lady Shiva always kicking the crap out of him?
 
skotti-chan said:
I totally agree with you on this, as MUCH as I love Babs, Dick, Tim and Kate (even though, she's a rogue heroine like Huntress)...I just really don't like the sidekick thing for him. It just SCREAMS 1960's sillyness.
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Exactly, and that's why I think it was a mistake to try and have those characters cross over to the modern age anyway. They're staples of the Silver Age, just like my other biggest Bat-peeve that's made it into the modern age....the light blue and grey costume.

According to several comics during IC/52/OYL. The list of top three smartest men in the DCU is.

1. Mr Terrific
2. Dr Magnus
3. Bruce Wayne
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Cool, but does that refer to heroes, men, or people?

Wade_Wilson said:
So why is Lady Shiva always kicking the crap out of him?
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I said "pretty much", there are a few more contenders give or take.;)
 
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Planet-man said:
Exactly, and that's why I think it was a mistake to try and have those characters cross over to the modern age anyway. They're staples of the Silver Age, just like my other biggest Bat-peeve that's made it into the modern age....the light blue and grey costume.



Cool, but does that refer to heroes, men, or people?
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As for the sidekick thing, there have been numerous attempts to explain why "Batman needs Robin". But yeah...and I too hate the blue and grey costume. It's my arch nemesis.

I don't think it includes villains, otherwise Lex Luthor would be in there somewhere.
 
I agree with Skotti's assessment of the current Batman books. I feel like Dini and Morrison have pulled Batman out of an awful slump that he's been in since, honestly, Frank Miller took over.

I like Miller's take on Batman in moderation, but he's honestly turned his portrayal of the character into a complete parody in recent years.

I don't agree with the argument that "Batman" is the real personality of the character and that "Bruce Wayne" is a mask. I feel like, when he's going out to fight crime, he's putting on a role, projecting monstrosity and severity to instill fear in criminals, because that's what he needs to do to survive. I don't feel like he needs to be a psychopathic agent of vengeance, like Miller portrays him. I think Batman is a character with good intentions, trying to win the fight on crime. The Bruce Wayne playboy image is a mask he puts on to keep up appearances and the terrifying Batman image is a mask he puts on to do his job. But the actual character underneath it all is caring and driven. He's distant, but that's because he spends so much of his time working his job that he finds it nigh-impossible to interact with other people. He has a tendency to be too analytical, but he's hardly the psychotic, Charles Bronson mother****er that Miller paints him to be.

I like the idea that in his early days, the Batman is a complete myth, the origin of which no one knows, but to be honest, the character is too big, and has been going on for too long, for that to be retained. I feel like DC's doing a pretty good balancing act as it stands now. It's publicly known that there is a Batman, and it's publicly known that he works with the Justice League, but no one's quite sure about what powers he has or what his intentions are.

I don't have a problem with Robin either, and I think it's been pretty well explained in the books. But Batman knows what it's like to be obsessed with vengeance. He knows what could happen if he doesn't channel these kids' rage in a positive direction. He's aware that they'll keep trying to be heroes, with his help or not.
 
Wade_Wilson said:
As for the sidekick thing, there have been numerous attempts to explain why "Batman needs Robin". But yeah...and I too hate the blue and grey costume. It's my arch nemesis.

I don't think it includes villains, otherwise Lex Luthor would be in there somewhere.
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Yeah, if you did Smartest People in the DCU; you'd have to add villains like Luthor, Dr Silvana, and T.O. Morrow.
 
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