Batman: The Brave and the Bold (series discussion)

[Gothamite]

Re: New Batman Animated Series to Air on Cartoon Network

no High School Musical sucks, Period.


But Fun can = batman. There have been some modern fun batman stories andd vintage one. Batman does not always have to be the dark brooding batman. In fact IMO The dark batman we have now days is Un-batman like.


Why? Original batman was fun. There was more focus on him been the world's greatest detective. Then they in invent him as a dark brooding vigilante and remove everything other than names and loose back stories e.g his parents.


To me that is outrageous. As much as I like Batman: Year One. I personally have always hated it equally for been the beginning of the downward spiral that pretty much killed EVERYTHING about the charracter in the first place.


Gone are the days of batman been seen as a genius detective. Now they try to hard to be "dark" and I stopped reading because of this. You can not do that. The change while respect people liking the new batman as it is their personal taste I do not.


So I welcome a more fun batman that actually looks like it could keep the spirit of the original. It is the batman I prefer and is the batman that I say is the TRUE batman.

:shock:

Everything you have just said is wrong. Everything.

I'll post a detailed response later on. Right now, I'm just going to bask in speechlessness.

 

[Gothamite]

Re: New Batman Animated Series to Air on Cartoon Network

In fact IMO The dark batman we have now days is Un-batman like.

Why? Because he dresses up as a Bat for a logical reason?! When you think about it, there's really no plausible explanation as to why the CampBat would dress as a 'Bat' and not a Ballerina or a flower or a marijuana joint.

Why? Original batman was fun.

I have to agree with you there. Original Batman (as created by Bob Kane) was a pretty fun guy. Fun things he did included punching a guy into a vat of acid and taking pride in it, watching a guy named 'Doctor Death' get burned alive and finding it amusing, swearing death upon a couple of mobsters if they didn't give him information, shooting up vampires with a revolver and (my favourite) hanging a load of Hugo Strange's monsters.

Yep. He ****ing hanged the bastards.

There was more focus on him been the world's greatest detective.

Every single ******* silver age plot-resolution was exactly the same. "Look at this shoe, Robin! It has a peculiar type of soil on it, that a self-respecting citizen could only find at the giant-typewriter factory! To the Batmobile!"

Cue punching and giant typewriter-shenanigans.

Then they in invent him as a dark brooding vigilante and remove everything other than names and loose back stories e.g his parents.

Batman was a dark, brooding vigilante in the tradition of Zorro and The Shadow. The fifties and sixties turned him into a fun-loving paedophile. Then, in the seventies, he became a dark and brooding vigilante once more. This 'Original Batman' you're talking about, doesn't exist except as a paranoid-of-the-russkies/marijuana-induced apparition.

To me that is outrageous. As much as I like Batman: Year One. I personally have always hated it equally for been the beginning of the downward spiral that pretty much killed EVERYTHING about the charracter in the first place.

Mole, I like you. You're a neat guy, and we have a lot in common.

But there is something wrong with you.

Gone are the days of batman been seen as a genius detective.

This just isn't true. There are just so many examples of Batman using semi-realistic forensic and detective skills in today's comics that the fact that you're saying this leads me to believe that the only 'dark' Batman comic you've ever read was All-Star Batman & Robin.

Now they try to hard to be "dark" and I stopped reading because of this. You can not do that.

You're right. It's morally wrong to return a character to its roots.

So I welcome a more fun batman that actually looks like it could keep the spirit of the original. It is the batman I prefer and is the batman that I say is the TRUE batman.

It's totally cool if you prefer this Batman and I can vaguely see the appeal, but calling it the 'true' Batman is wrong. He doesn't have any Bat-like features or idiosyncrasies. He's not a mysterious creature of the night, or a dark and brooding lawman, he's just a really friendly, scientist-guy who fights aliens and spanks Batwoman and sleeps with Robin.

 

[Planet-man]

Re: New Batman Animated Series to Air on Cartoon Network

Why? Because he dresses up as a Bat for a logical reason?! When you think about it, there's really no plausible explanation as to why the CampBat would dress as a 'Bat' and not a Ballerina or a flower or a marijuana joint.



I have to agree with you there. Original Batman (as created by Bob Kane) was a pretty fun guy. Fun things he did included punching a guy into a vat of acid and taking pride in it, watching a guy named 'Doctor Death' get burned alive and finding it amusing, swearing death upon a couple of mobsters if they didn't give him information, shooting up vampires with a revolver and (my favourite) hanging a load of Hugo Strange's monsters.

Yep. He ****ing hanged the bastards.



Every single ******* silver age plot-resolution was exactly the same. "Look at this shoe, Robin! It has a peculiar type of soil on it, that a self-respecting citizen could only find at the giant-typewriter factory! To the Batmobile!"

Cue punching and giant typewriter-shenanigans.



Batman was a dark, brooding vigilante in the tradition of Zorro and The Shadow. The fifties and sixties turned him into a fun-loving paedophile. Then, in the seventies, he became a dark and brooding vigilante once more. This 'Original Batman' you're talking about, doesn't exist except as a paranoid-of-the-russkies/marijuana-induced apparition.



Mole, I like you. You're a neat guy, and we have a lot in common.

But there is something wrong with you.



This just isn't true. There are just so many examples of Batman using semi-realistic forensic and detective skills in today's comics that the fact that you're saying this leads me to believe that the only 'dark' Batman comic you've ever read was All-Star Batman & Robin.



You're right. It's morally wrong to return a character to its roots.



It's totally cool if you prefer this Batman and I can vaguely see the appeal, but calling it the 'true' Batman is wrong. He doesn't have any Bat-like features or idiosyncrasies. He's not a mysterious creature of the night, or a dark and brooding lawman, he's just a really friendly, scientist-guy who fights aliens and spanks Batwoman and sleeps with Robin.

This is the most hilarious post ever.

(and it's all true)

Anyway, I'm proud to present you with the

 

[SSJmole]

Re: New Batman Animated Series to Air on Cartoon Network

You're right. It's morally wrong to return a character to its roots.

Huh? He wasn't dark batman in his first appearance back in Detective Comics 27. Sure he was a little darker than "campy batman." But he wasn't the over the top dark for the sake of been dark Batman he is today at all.

I'm not talking about camp bat. I'm not talking about more science fiction bat. I'm talking about the original where the stories were fun, He was the tough cop type sure but he wasn't "ooohhh look at me i'm so dark" batman we get today.

He shot people, He killed people but he was still not doing stuff like hiding the shadows and talking in a deep voice , There was no overly complicated stories. No back breaking , No robin , No batgirl.


He was just basically a guy who was a cop with out a licence. He dressed up as a bat for no reason other than to hide his identity. That makes sense with out going down the over-top reasons why.

Now from start to campy was actually more of a development. That's cool you can do that if it's a slow transformation over time. Same in the opposite way. Had they had kept camp batman BUT slowly started to build him to be coming darker over time till we had current that would be fine.


But NO it was was just a sudden thing that seemed to come from no where and quite frankly I find it insulting that they assumed people would not be able to deal with a slow transformation that could have worked out so great but instead gave us a reboot stripping all of his features and development they had done.


So Original - To campy is True batman as it eased in to the transition and flowed from one type to another. New batman that is the dark one I view as fake batman for that reason. As for new one been closer to his roots it's funny, sorry it is.


No offence to you batman's roots were not hiding the shadows and scaring people to over compensate for something. Nor was it "hey lets reboot him with a diffrent world every year because we are too lazy to fix it it" and I'm damn sure his roots didn't involve joker been how is today.


Close to the roots? HA. That's like saying Batman and robin was closer to the roots of that franchise. But again like I said it's cool that you and others like it. I personally enjoy some parts of new batman I do don't get me wrong, I just prefer the earlier stuff

 

[Jaggyd]

Re: New Batman Animated Series to Air on Cartoon Network

spanks Batwoman

*cough* I'll be in my bunk if you need me.... >.>



oh, and PS: Gothamite is 1000% correct on this. Period.

 

[Gothamite]

Re: New Batman Animated Series to Air on Cartoon Network

Huh? He wasn't dark batman in his first appearance back in Detective Comics 27. Sure he was a little darker than "campy batman." But he wasn't the over the top dark for the sake of been dark Batman he is today at all.

I'm not talking about camp bat. I'm not talking about more science fiction bat. I'm talking about the original where the stories were fun, He was the tough cop type sure but he wasn't "ooohhh look at me i'm so dark" batman we get today.

He shot people, He killed people but he was still not doing stuff like hiding the shadows and talking in a deep voice

Okay...you know nothing. Have you read Detective Comics #27?

There's all sorts of references to how he hides in the shadows and stalks criminals like a 'weird figure of the night'.

In Detective Comics 29, Batman used a number of different voices (impersonating different people, including Comissioner Gordon), including a 'grim and different' voice for when he was Batman.

There was no overly complicated stories. No back breaking , No robin , No batgirl.

You mention 'overly-complicated stories' and 'back-breaking' as though they were a bad thing and then you jump right into 'no Robin, no Batgirl'. Robin and Batgirl are one of the staples of the Silver Age Batman, you love so much.

He was just basically a guy who was a cop with out a licence. He dressed up as a bat for no reason other than to hide his identity.

Bruce Wayne in Detective Comics #33, Batman #1 and many, many other times, too vastly numerous to reference:

"My father's estate has left me wealthy. I am ready. But first...I must have a disguise. Criminals are a superstitious and cowardly lot. So my disguise must be able to strike terror into their hearts. I must be a creature of the night. Black, terrible...a...a..."

As if in answer, a huge bat flies in the open window

"A bat! That's it! It's an omen...I shall become a BAT!

He ****ing says that he's going to be a pretty durn dark individual. It's his gawd-d@mn plan!

...

He actually said it!

Now from start to campy was actually more of a development. That's cool you can do that if it's a slow transformation over time. Same in the opposite way. Had they had kept camp batman BUT slowly started to build him to be coming darker over time till we had current that would be fine.

:roll:

That's exactly what they did...

Go and read a bunch of stories from the late sixties/seventies/early eighties.

Batman very gradually drifted from being a campy caped crusader to once again being a Dark Knight.

But NO it was was just a sudden thing that seemed to come from no where and quite frankly I find it insulting that they assumed people would not be able to deal with a slow transformation that could have worked out so great but instead gave us a reboot stripping all of his features and development they had done.

...too much rubbish...can't hold it back...

No offence to you batman's roots were not hiding the shadows and scaring people to over compensate for something.

I'm damn sure his roots didn't involve joker been how is today.

as;dfhkqapwgdpaosidfh;ashdfapshdf

[/idiocy induced insanity]

Close to the roots? HA. That's like saying Batman and robin was closer to the roots of that franchise.

This post is so ludicrous that I think I'm just going to stop and let Parker take it from here. I'm too old for this ****.

 

[Jaggyd]

Re: New Batman Animated Series to Air on Cartoon Network

Close to the roots? HA. That's like saying Batman and robin was closer to the roots of that franchise. But again like I said it's cool that you and others like it. I personally enjoy some parts of new batman I do don't get me wrong, I just prefer the earlier stuff.

Wait.... what? You're criticizing people for liking Batman & Robin, which was in essence the closest modern adaptation of the goofy silver age Batman ever made. To quote an ancient robotic wise man; "Does not compute".

 

[SSJmole]

Re: New Batman Animated Series to Air on Cartoon Network

Wait.... what? You're criticizing people for liking Batman & Robin, which was in essence the closest modern adaptation of the goofy silver age Batman ever made. To quote an ancient robotic wise man; "Does not compute".

No i'm not. I'm saying batman and robin is not close to roots of Batman in that film universe.

 

[Gothamite]

Re: New Batman Animated Series to Air on Cartoon Network

No i'm not. I'm saying batman and robin is not close to roots of Batman in that film universe.

I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that you actually like Batman & Robin...

Well gang, I think this just about wraps up this mystery!

 

[Jaggyd]

Re: New Batman Animated Series to Air on Cartoon Network

No i'm not. I'm saying batman and robin is not close to roots of Batman in that film universe.

Snappy puns, elaborate death traps, a villainess who looks like a drag queen...


That is EXACTLY the Silver Age of Batman.

 

[Gothamite]

Re: New Batman Animated Series to Air on Cartoon Network

Snappy puns, elaborate death traps, a villainess who looks like a drag queen...


That is EXACTLY the Silver Age of Batman.

Don't forget blatant homoeroticism!

Plus, the idiotic giant statues that are so big that you can drive on them should replace the idiotic industrial props (typewriters, musical instruments, paintings) that Batman and Robin frequently found themselves fighting bad guys beside in the silver age.

 

[Planet-man]

Re: New Batman Animated Series to Air on Cartoon Network

Mole, come on. You're being ridiculous. Everything you're saying is wrong. Not disagreement of opinions wrong, but undeniably, factually wrong. Gothamite's even cited the earliest comics as proof.

I mean, look:

No offence to you batman's roots were not hiding the shadows and scaring people to over compensate for something.

That's EXACTLY what they were, and shown in great detail all throughout Det. 27 and Batman #1 and all the other stuff Gothamite's quoted. It's right there on almost 70-year-old paper.

Quote:
I'm damn sure his roots didn't involve joker been how is today.

Again, this is blatantly untrue. The Joker's first appearance was in Batman #1, and he was a scary, demented, lethal serial killer.

See for yourself.

He didn't become a flamboyantly silly, completely non-lethal art thief with a giant prop fetish until they camped things up a decade later.

This post is so ludicrous that I think I'm just going to stop and let Parker take it from here. I'm too old for this ****.

I'm four months older than you!

 

[SSJmole]

Re: New Batman Animated Series to Air on Cartoon Network

I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that you actually like Batman & Robin...

Well gang, I think this just about wraps up this mystery!

No I don't

That's EXACTLY what they were, and shown in great detail all throughout Det. 27 and Batman #1 and all the other stuff Gothamite's quoted. It's right there on almost 70-year-old paper.

Yes but what I mean now is they try to hard to make him do stuff like that. Now his hiding in the shadows has become too over the top. Too much of it and most times they do it for no reason other than to do it. That is not his roots that is just taking something he did a little and ruining it.

Imagine if Spider-man did nothing but stand still and fire a web. No spider-reflexes ect... to balance it out. It would suck. That what this is. They do the shadow thing. Now they do that too much and don't show the detective side of him as much as they use to why? like I said they try to hard to be dark.

Again, this is blatantly untrue. The Joker's first appearance was in Batman #1, and he was a scary, demented, lethal serial killer.

See for yourself.

He didn't become a flamboyantly silly, completely non-lethal art thief with a giant prop fetish until they camped things up a decade later.

Not what I meant but thanks for that. He didn't stuff like change the entire world. You said it yourself "scary, demented, lethal serial killer. " NOT someone who could hold cross-overs over the dc universe as he has no powers , He's not a world wide threat. They keep making him do stuff a powerless serial killer should NOT be able to do.


Shocker in spider-man is more believable comic wise as a world wide threat as at least he has powers. Joker has none how the hell can he be a world wide threat from Superman , wonder woman , green lantern , Supergirl, The flash and sooooo many more heroes with powers.


Now if you don't get that I'm sorry can't explain better than that.

 

[Gothamite]

Re: New Batman Animated Series to Air on Cartoon Network

No I don't
Yes but what I mean now is they try to hard to make him do stuff like that. Now his hiding in the shadows has become too over the top. Too much of it and most times they do it for no reason other than to do it. That is not his roots that is just taking something he did a little and ruining it.

The only way Batman would ever be effective is if he was a ninja-like creature who was 'more than just a man'.

A gung-ho vigilante like what you're describing would get shot very much and would be killed until he was dead.

Imagine if Spider-man did nothing but stand still and fire a web. No spider-reflexes ect... to balance it out. It would suck. That what this is. They do the shadow thing. Now they do that too much and don't show the detective side of him as much as they use to why? like I said they try to hard to be dark.

I'm not even sure I can make out what you're saying here. All Batman does is blend into the shadows for no reason?!

Not what I meant but thanks for that. He didn't stuff like change the entire world. You said it yourself "scary, demented, lethal serial killer. " NOT someone who could hold cross-overs over the dc universe as he has no powers , He's not a world wide threat. They keep making him do stuff a powerless serial killer should NOT be able to do.

Please, Mole, for your sake and mine, think about what you're saying here.

The Joker's been around for 70 years and he's been the most popular supervillain ever for most (maybe all) of that time.

When he was created, they didn't even have a DCU Universe for him to destroy. It hadn't been established yet. Just like his character was only beginning to develop.

Superman, Batman and just about every other superhero at the time rarely found themselves in world-beating battles, because the writers of the time were establishing the characters with smaller, low-key adventures.

It's as if you're speaking about the writing and drawing styles of the thirties and complaining that comics aren't still written like that.

Shocker in spider-man is more believable comic wise as a world wide threat as at least he has powers. Joker has none how the hell can he be a world wide threat from Superman , wonder woman , green lantern , Supergirl, The flash and sooooo many more heroes with powers.

I don't know. What story are you even referring to?

The only one I can think of is the 'Emperor Joker' saga from the early 00s where he does actually become an omnipotent God after stealing Mxyzptlk's powers.

Other than that, any story where he was anything resembling a threat to Superman or any of the other DC heavy-hitters was pretty plausible and usually ended with the Joker being caught and punished.

Now if you don't get that I'm sorry can't explain better than that.

Thanks for one of the most amusing and hilarious Batman-related discussions I've ever had in my life.

 

[Dr.Strangefate]

Re: New Batman Animated Series to Air on Cartoon Network

I don't think Mole has ever read a Batman comic. That is the general impression i am getting from this thread.

 

[SSJmole]

Re: New Batman Animated Series to Air on Cartoon Network

I don't think Mole has ever read a Batman comic. That is the general impression i am getting from this thread.

I've read lots of batman comics.

 

[Jaggyd]

Re: New Batman Animated Series to Air on Cartoon Network

I've read lots of batman comics.

Were they done by Dick Sprang?

 

[The Overlord]

Re: New Batman Animated Series to Air on Cartoon Network

Were they done by Dick Sprang?

Actually here is what a Silver age Batman toon would look like (in Sprang style):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X6SM7KXKulQ

 

[Jaggyd]

Re: New Batman Animated Series to Air on Cartoon Network

Actually here is what a Silver age Batman toon would look like (in Sprang style):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X6SM7KXKulQ

I hate to admit, I loved that episode.

 

[bluebeast]

Re: New Batman Animated Series to Air on Cartoon Network

I find this amusing as Batman Begins and The Dark Knight are based upon the earliest of Batman stories. I mean The Dark Knight is based on Batman #1 and that's scarier than some of the **** they come up with nowadays.