Fantastic Four Reboot

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DIrishB said:
Well, technically all movies are a cash grab.
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But you guys know what I mean. Yes, all movies are made with the intent of selling tickets, and making the studio money. But the difference with Marvel Studios and Warner Bros., I feel like they actually care about the people they're selling this movie to, and the product they're putting out. But the impression I'm getting from Fox with this movie, is that they didn't decide to greenlight this movie because it was the next best creative move on their part. It was because the rights are going to revert back soon so they have to make a movie quick so they don't miss out on all that Marvel cash. It just seems like they don't see the Fantastic Four's worth other than their connection with the Marvel brand, so they want to change everything to make it appear 'cooler'. With their wanting to make the cast younger, and casting the flavour-of-the-week, 'who's hot right now' actors. Even their wanting to connect this movie to their X-men movies to copy the now popular cinematic universe idea.

Now, we don't know a lot about this movie, and even all the casting to my knowledge hasn't been locked in and is still just rumor. I just feel that Fox is using this as a last-ditch effort to cash in on the Fantastic Four. And they don't care if it's good, they just want to make money off of the Marvel brand. 'Cause that's what's hot right now.

So that's what I meant by saying it was just a 'cash-grab' for them.
 
Spoon_Wielder said:
the difference with Marvel Studios and Warner Bros., I feel like they actually care about the people they're selling this movie to, and the product they're putting out. But the impression I'm getting from Fox with this movie, is that they didn't decide to greenlight this movie because it was the next best creative move on their part. It was because the rights are going to revert back soon so they have to make a movie quick so they don't miss out on all that Marvel cash.
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But how did they get the rights in the first place? Because Marvel wanted to make money by letting someone else make their movies. Anyone. And Sony, Fox, Paramount, etc bought the rights because "hey why not, these will probably make us some money." But NO ONE predicted back in the early 2000s that the super hero genre was going to last so long and make so much money. So they didn't really take the properties as seriously back then. And as a result, not a lot of the movies have been good. But it worked out well for Marvel, b/c they made money off the crappy (as well as decent/good) movies that got made and eventually started their own production company (and then sold to Disney for even more money).

I don't know man, I see what you're saying, but I don't think it's fair to accuse Fox of only caring about the money because they want to make movies based on the potentially lucrative franchises for which they paid to get the rights.

Would I like to see the rights revert back to Marvel? Sure. Do I think they would do a better job than Fox? Probably. But not because Marvel has more creative integrity than Fox does. They're all in it for the money. Marvel is just more focused. Superhero movies are their only gig.
 
Michael B. Jordan Addresses 'Fantastic Four' Rumors



"I can't even — you know how it is in the industry! I can't talk [about it] — it's still up in the air. I just can't. It's one of things where, certain people start talking too soon and then what if it doesn't happen for whatever reason? Then I'm the guy who was out there talking about something that coulda, shoulda, woulda, but didn't."
 
Captain Canuck said:
But how did they get the rights in the first place? Because Marvel wanted to make money by letting someone else make their movies. Anyone. And Sony, Fox, Paramount, etc bought the rights because "hey why not, these will probably make us some money." But NO ONE predicted back in the early 2000s that the super hero genre was going to last so long and make so much money. So they didn't really take the properties as seriously back then. And as a result, not a lot of the movies have been good. But it worked out well for Marvel, b/c they made money off the crappy (as well as decent/good) movies that got made and eventually started their own production company (and then sold to Disney for even more money).

I don't know man, I see what you're saying, but I don't think it's fair to accuse Fox of only caring about the money because they want to make movies based on the potentially lucrative franchises for which they paid to get the rights.

Would I like to see the rights revert back to Marvel? Sure. Do I think they would do a better job than Fox? Probably. But not because Marvel has more creative integrity than Fox does. They're all in it for the money. Marvel is just more focused. Superhero movies are their only gig.
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Good points. But I also want to add that superhero movies now are better because they have years of experience to build on. I don't think anyone in the early days of the superhero boom was trying to make a bad movie. It's just that it took experience to figure out what works and what doesn't. It's only because of the attempts by Sony and Fox to make movies with Marvel properties that Marvel Studios had the experience to draw on to make their pictures work.

Diverse and competitive markets spark creativity. I'm glad some of the properties are farmed out, and I'd rather the Fantastic Four not get folded into the MCU. I think they're unique in a way that would be marginalized by being in the same family as the Avengers and everything else.
 
Zombipanda said:
Good points. But I also want to add that superhero movies now are better because they have years of experience to build on. I don't think anyone in the early days of the superhero boom was trying to make a bad movie. It's just that it took experience to figure out what works and what doesn't. It's only because of the attempts by Sony and Fox to make movies with Marvel properties that Marvel Studios had the experience to draw on to make their pictures work.

Diverse and competitive markets spark creativity. I'm glad some of the properties are farmed out, and I'd rather the Fantastic Four not get folded into the MCU. I think they're unique in a way that would be marginalized by being in the same family as the Avengers and everything else.
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It's true, I don't think anyone was trying to make a bad movie, but I also don't think they tried as hard as they do now, because they didn't know just how lucrative the movies could be.

The exception is Chris Nolan, who took the genre to a whole new level of seriousness with Batman Begins. I'm not talking about darkness or grittiness, I'm talking about taking it seriously. I remember when it came out my sister, who doesn't really care a whole lot about super heroes, said that Batman Begins was her favourite super hero movie so far just because it was less silly. Admittedly, they had to take Batman more seriously after Batman and Robin.

So yeah, I definitely agree with you. The more recent movies stand on the foundation that was laid in the early years of this new wave of super hero movies. And they're better movies over all because the early movies taught them what to do and not do. That's true. But if you had told a movie producer back then that these movies would demolish box office records and create multi-billion dollar franchises, they probably wouldn't have believed you. So they made fun movies and some were pretty good and some weren't. But then they realized the potential and really stepped up the game - Marvel by taking a risk on the shared universe idea, and DC by making The Dark Knight. These movies have never been the same since.

Except for Ghost Rider 2. That was a regression.
 
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Zombipanda said:
Good points. But I also want to add that superhero movies now are better because they have years of experience to build on. I don't think anyone in the early days of the superhero boom was trying to make a bad movie. It's just that it took experience to figure out what works and what doesn't. It's only because of the attempts by Sony and Fox to make movies with Marvel properties that Marvel Studios had the experience to draw on to make their pictures work. Diverse and competitive markets spark creativity. I'm glad some of the properties are farmed out, and I'd rather the Fantastic Four not get folded into the MCU. I think they're unique in a way that would be marginalized by being in the same family as the Avengers and everything else.
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I disagree in that regard. Really one of the few factors they have in common is that they're a team franchise by the same company.

The Avengers have always had a large element of fallibility and relatability whereas the FF have a noticeably more "God-like" tone and familial tone, at least in regards to abilities. Reed's intelligence, Sue's abilities, Ben's Hulk-like strength (and while it's fair to compare him to Hulk, let's keep in mind Hulk is at the top end of the power scale in terms of the Avengers, least in regards to strength), and Johnny's super-nova scale fire abilities.

Granted, that's power versus story/theme, but I think the family dynamic and Justice League-like element of righteousness (the FF are pretty much undeniable Boy and Girl Scouts) noticeably and importantly differentiate the FF from the Avengers, let alone the higher-sci-fi/fantasy aspect FF has in comparison. Granted both fall into that category, but FF's subject matter more often treads into the realm of dimensional and time travel stories, or other such plot threads.

Like I said, I definitely feel Marvel Studios could and would make a better FF film, both in terms of critical and fan reception, and most important for the studio, a much higher box office draw for Marvel Studios than Fox, just due to Avengers-itis. Feige and company have shown they understand the fundamental aspects and dynamics of their characters, and just as importantly the ability to convincingly translate and portray those characters/concepts onscreen overall better than any other studio and their respective comic franchise, with the exception of Nolan's Batman trilogy. And as great as those three films were, I find the MCU films to be far more re-watchable and better paced (my two biggest complaints about TDK and TDKR is they were each about 20-30 minutes too long and Nolan, for all his brilliance, still seems to struggle with interesting and dynamic fight choreography/shot staging).

But yeah, I do think Fox can, and likely will, make a decent FF movie. There's no doubt they'll have learned from the previous twos' mistakes, and use that to craft a superior product this time around. I just think MS as has a superior understanding of those characters and their interactions, both with their world and each other (which is arguably one of--if not the--most important aspect of the franchise) from the get go, and has a much better chance and talent pool. Marvel Studios' habit of insanely genius casting decisions alone is by itself enough reason for me to prefer MS over Fox (though I will admit I'm intrigued by Michael B. Jordan's supposed casting as Torch, and Teller as Reed seems like a good choice).

Also, Thing's casting is essential. He's in large part the heart of the team, and need's to be able to balance toughness, vulnerability, humor, and a Frankenstein's monster aspect of tragedy. I have no doubt they'll CGI/motion capture the actor who plays him, which will allow for better and more expressive emotional portrayal and overall a better and more realistic look versus the physical suit seen in the previous two (and lets not forget Corman's classicly bad early 90's "we're doing this merely to hold onto the rights a bit longer" version... which inherently isn't too different from what they're doing now, just with undeniably better results, I'm sure).

And any actress would be a huge improvement over the wooden, uninteresting, and one-dimensional Jessica Alba as Sue. Seriously, anyone. A drugged out Lindsay Lohan would probably be an improvement (acting wise, anyway).

Also, if they're going to turn it into a series of movies (and really, what superhero franchise isn't intended to be a series nowadays?), I'd love to see the first film set up the team and their world (though an origin story encompassing the entire film is unnecessary). I'd love to see Franklin and Valeria introduced in a sequel as children (which will be a challenge, granted).
 
DIrishB said:
That's what I'm thinking. Would be cool if Sue is the adopted kid and Johnny is protective of her, kind of acting as the protective older sibling, even against Reed (at first).
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This.

Though I would have preferred an all-black Storm family, particularly if they veer towards the Ultimate origin, where the Storms are responsible for founding the Baxter Building.
 
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Zombipanda said:
This.

Though I would have preferred an all-black Storm family, particularly if they veer towards the Ultimate origin, where the Storms are responsible for founding the Baxter Building.
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Oh, so only black people can found buildings? You are a racist.
 
This is excellent news! :D They only have until October to start filming or they say goodbye to the rights!
 
That can't possibly be true. They get a director, screenplay, cast and then decide to start again? With only six months to do it all again? Why?
 
DIrishB said:
Seriously? What makes you think FOX is preferable to Marvel Studios in regards to doing a FF film?



Yep.
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The fact that Marvel has so many properties and can only put out so many movies in a given year. And a different company who's characters aren't tethered to the MCU increases the odds that they'll do something exciting and fresh with the team.
 
wyokid said:
Going from horrendous to awful isn't much of an improvement.
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That's true, but that isn't what the X-Men movies have done. The horrendous/awful bad X-Men movie so far was Wolverine:Origins. X-Men United was bad, and maybe 1&2 don't hold up as good movies any more, but they are still decent and they were good superhero movies when they were made. The genre has matured since then though, for sure. The Wolverine was really good until the last act, and I thought First Class was the best one they've made.
 
Zombipanda said:
Rumor has been roundly debunked.
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Not really. Bleeding Cool is insisting that while it is true that at this moment in time they are not looking to scrap everything, Fox definitely approached an unknown number of directors recently and BC has spoken with 2 of them to confirm the story.
 
E said:
Not really. Bleeding Cool is insisting that while it is true that at this moment in time they are not looking to scrap everything, Fox definitely approached an unknown number of directors recently and BC has spoken with 2 of them to confirm the story.
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So Rich is saying "They totally were planning on scrapping everything but now they aren't and we know because we talked to two people who said that was the case but we can't tell you who they are!"

Call me skeptical. BC does get some good scoops, but we're talking about the rumor site that posted sourced solicitations from a random redditer.
 
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Zombipanda said:
So Rich is saying "They totally were planning on scrapping everything but now they aren't and we know because we talked to two people who said that was the case but we can't tell you who they are!"

Call me skeptical. BC does get some good scoops, but we're talking about the rumor site that posted sourced solicitations from a random redditer.
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Yeah, but I think it's a little bit different if they say they are getting the report (and corroboration) from people who were actually approached by Fox. It's not like it's second hand news.
 

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