IDW's Transformers Discussion (SPOILERS)

[wyokid]

I know Chris Metzen's work quite well as I'm a huge StarCraft fan since back in the day, and have read most of the spin off novels and comics. So the fact he's co-writing it is interesting.

He co-wrote the first two books as well.

 

[DIrishB]

He co-wrote the first two books as well.

Did he? Must not have been paying attention to the credits pages. His StarCraft work is much better than those were.

 

[wyokid]

Did he? Must not have been paying attention to the credits pages. His StarCraft work is much better than those were.

I'm definitely going to be re-reading them once the third one is done. I'm sure they'll collect them all in a nice hardcover to go next to my IDW Collections. I bet we'll be getting Punishment in print after that or Drift: Empire of Stone. They seem to like having two on-goings and a miniseries.

 

[wyokid]

Loved Primacy #1. The tension between Hot Rod and Grimlock was great, the coming menace of Trypticon is terrifying (good thing the Autobots have Omega Supreme), and yet another appearance of the Quintessons (cannot wait for that story to be told). The war drums are banging loud.

I'd like to bring attention to an awesome miniseries called Transformers: Evolutions - Hearts of Steel.

Originally Evolutions was to be a "What If...?" or Elseworlds anthology made up of miniseries for Transformers. Unfortunately due to Michael Bay's Transformers being released Hasbro didn't want too many alternate universes so the line was scrapped after Hearts of Steel. Hears of Steel was four issues and was basically "what if the Transformers woke up on Earth during the 19th century?". The run into John Henry and Mark Twain. The series was later revisited by the same creative team during the Infestation 2 event (Cthulu and the Elder Gods invaded different dimensions) and later in The X-Files crossover Conspiracy (which I haven't read yet due to me wanting to read after I finally watch X-Files (never seen a single episode) as not to spoil the show) by a different team. The miniseries and the Infestation 2 crossover are both incredibly solid and really cool. I highly recommend them.

 

[wyokid]

In a recent interview (MAJOR spoilers) it was revealed that Combiner Wars would take place in Transformers (RID apparently dropping it's subtitle) and a new Windblade ongoing (which originally was a miniseries). The book has been described as a Cold War arms race with different factions racing to build up as many combiners (like Devastator or Superion) as they can. I'm really worried about what happened to More Than Meets the Eye. On one hand I'm not sure if IDW is confident enough in the line to support three on-goings but I also can't imagine that they'd cancel the fan favorite book. Windblade getting an on-going is great news but if it's at the cost of losing More Than Meets the Eye it's SO not worth it. What's more likely (and what I'm hoping) is that Hasbro or IDW demanded that it be renamed due to the upcoming Robots in Disguise cartoon which takes place in the Aligned continuity and they want to either be able to release comic tie-ins to that show (Prime got three series during it's three season run) or not to confuse people into thinking it's a tie-in. We'll see when things are announced/solicited.

 

[DIrishB]

It's probably, as you said, just to prevent brand confusion. I could see the Transformers ongoing combining the storylines of RiD and MtMtE, though I wonder at a single character getting an ongoing. Seems like overkill. Apparently Windblade is IDW's Wolverine.

 

[wyokid]

It's probably, as you said, just to prevent brand confusion. I could see the Transformers ongoing combining the storylines of RiD and MtMtE, though I wonder at a single character getting an ongoing. Seems like overkill. Apparently Windblade is IDW's Wolverine.

Once you get to RID and MTMTE you'll see why combining them would be near impossible. They're telling to completely different stories with two completely different casts. Tone is different as well. Windblade was a character created by fans (Hasbro had this thing called "Fan-Built Bot" with polls to decide her traits, faction, etc. The Japanese stuff was not part of that however) so I can see why she is getting her own series.

 

[wyokid]

Replying here due to my large reply having nothing to do with Valiant.

I'm holding my end up. I've taken a temporary break from TF but I'll get back into it in the next week or so, now that I've gotten to Lvl 30 in SW-TOR. I'll be playing less often so I can stretch it out before finishing the game's main story.

Plus with Primacy now coming out I want to read that and finish up the remaining TF issues to get to the current stuff. I'm not backing out, I'm determined and insanely stubborn. I'll get caught up this week. Or at least knock out a good 50 or so issues in the next couple weeks. That should put me well into the MtMtE and RiD runs.

I was just giving you a hard time You keep saying you're going to play less but your level keeps jumping up

The more I think about it the more I think you'll like RID more than MTMTE. RID is darker and political (not REAL politics mind you but Cybertronian politics which is basically democracy (freedom is the right of all sentient beings after all)) and is a slow burn. MTMTE is incredibly humorous/meta/fourth-wall-breaking/lighthearted. They're both character driven though so they're both unlike anything before it. Everyone is incredibly fleshed out and feel like humans. I know I've said most of that before. Which brings me to my next thing: Mike Costa. Costa wrote the first on-going and the first twelve issues or so he had trouble writing it because he didn't get it.

They don't have all of the basic things that humans have that motivate them and give them motivation for drama for a story. They don't really get hungry, they don't get tired, they don't have women or relationships like that [which] they value because they don't have females that they can love; maybe brotherly love, but how — they don't have parents? They don't have religion or spirituality... you have to manufacture [these things] and that makes it very incoherent.

Then during Chaos (the final arc) when he was co-writing with James Roberts he finally understood it all. Oddly enough Roberts and Barber would then take most of the stuff Costa said they don't have and write about it. RID and MTMTE are just like all the best Transformers stories (they feel like humans but the stories wouldnt work if they weren't giant transforming robots). Costa's stuff is alright though and he takes the characters to some pretty cool places. His big space opera story is, in fact, titled "Space Opera". The really cool part about MTMTE and RID is up until Dark Cybertron Optimus and Megatron are off the table. They went about three years without Optimus being a major player. I DEFINITELY want your thoughts on the current stuff so be sure to post please

Also as motivation I'm not responding to your political PMs until you're caught up.

 

[DIrishB]

Replying here due to my large reply having nothing to do with Valiant. I was just giving you a hard time You keep saying you're going to play less but your level keeps jumping up

That's because it's awesome.

The more I think about it the more I think you'll like RID more than MTMTE. RID is darker and political (not REAL politics mind you but Cybertronian politics which is basically democracy (freedom is the right of all sentient beings after all)) and is a slow burn. MTMTE is incredibly humorous/meta/fourth-wall-breaking/lighthearted. They're both character driven though so they're both unlike anything before it. Everyone is incredibly fleshed out and feel like humans. I know I've said most of that before. Which brings me to my next thing: Mike Costa. Costa wrote the first on-going and the first twelve issues or so he had trouble writing it because he didn't get it. Then during Chaos (the final arc) when he was co-writing with James Roberts he finally understood it all. Oddly enough Roberts and Barber would then take most of the stuff Costa said they don't have and write about it. RID and MTMTE are just like all the best Transformers stories (they feel like humans but the stories wouldnt work if they weren't giant transforming robots). Costa's stuff is alright though and he takes the characters to some pretty cool places. His big space opera story is, in fact, titled "Space Opera". The really cool part about MTMTE and RID is up until Dark Cybertron Optimus and Megatron are off the table. They went about three years without Optimus being a major player. I DEFINITELY want your thoughts on the current stuff so be sure to post please Also as motivation I'm not responding to your political PMs until you're caught up.

There was some decent stuff in Escalation. I liked Megatron's plans to destabilize the world, that was pretty cool, but then he just kind of was like "screw it" and had Sixshot go after the Autobots in Devastation. I liked the Optimus Prime Spotlight, but none of the others have really stood out. Maximum Dinobots, Last Stand of the Wreckers, and All Hail Megatron were all pretty good. The rest has been pretty "meh". I'm starting the Drift mini this week and will try to knock out another 40-50 issues over the week, which should get me close to halfway done with the MtMtE and RiD ongoings. I'll post my thoughts on those once I get through them.

I will still be playing SW-TOR intermittently while reading those issues, probably will alternate nights, so may take a little longer than I'm estimating. We'll see.

But I will get caught up. I'm also timelining it. Once I'm done with the IDW timeline (or at least up to the current issues, it won't be done until they stop publishing them, obviously), I may try to tackle the horrible TF movie verse timeline with the films, comics, and novels set in that continuity. It's weird, my timelining makes no distinctions when it comes to quality.

Then maybe I'll get back to finishing the DC Animated universe timeline.

That will keep me occupied for the next 4-6 months at least, doing all those. Once I'm done with them I'll get them posted on TheTimelineSite.com and you can check them out.

I'll also be updating all the other various timelines I do in the meantime as new stuff is released (Ultimate, MCU, Star Wars, etc).

 

[wyokid]

There was some decent stuff in Escalation. I liked Megatron's plans to destabilize the world, that was pretty cool, but then he just kind of was like "screw it" and had Sixshot go after the Autobots in Devastation. I liked the Optimus Prime Spotlight, but none of the others have really stood out. Maximum Dinobots, Last Stand of the Wreckers, and All Hail Megatron were all pretty good. The rest has been pretty "meh". I'm starting the Drift mini this week and will try to knock out another 40-50 issues over the week, which should get me close to halfway done with the MtMtE and RiD ongoings. I'll post my thoughts on those once I get through them.

All that Dark Universe stuff will go some place eventually. Roberts and Barber have done a really great job of tying continuity together while still moving forward. All the characters (especially Megatron) get a TON of development (especially Megatron). Have I mentioned Megatron?

But I will get caught up. I'm also timelining it. Once I'm done with the IDW timeline (or at least up to the current issues, it won't be done until they stop publishing them, obviously), I may try to tackle the horrible TF movie verse timeline with the films, comics, and novels set in that continuity. It's weird, my timelining makes no distinctions when it comes to quality.

Then maybe I'll get back to finishing the DC Animated universe timeline.

That will keep me occupied for the next 4-6 months at least, doing all those. Once I'm done with them I'll get them posted on TheTimelineSite.com and you can check them out.

I'll also be updating all the other various timelines I do in the meantime as new stuff is released (Ultimate, MCU, Star Wars, etc).

If I can make the suggestion again, **** Bayformers, do Aligned Continuity. It's better, it's cooler, it takes influences from everything, and you actually care about not just the Transformers but the human characters as well. I'm going through it myself right now (hence the thread that I'm ever so lonely in). I've reviewed the first book (Exodus). Seeing that come to life in the War For Cybertron game is really cool. The Transformers: Prime cartoon even won multiple Daytime Emmys and features the voice talent of Josh Keaton, Steve Blum, Peter Cullen, Frank Welker, Nolan North, Ernie Hudson (I have a humorous story about meeting him I should tell one day), Clancy Brown, George Takei, John DiMaggio, and Dwayne Johnson (as Cliffjumper no less!). You'd be really missing out on a lot of great stories while you suffer through a lot of bull**** crappy Michael Bay stuff.

 

[DIrishB]

All that Dark Universe stuff will go some place eventually. Roberts and Barber have done a really great job of tying continuity together while still moving forward. All the characters (especially Megatron) get a TON of development (especially Megatron). Have I mentioned Megatron?

Does any of that apply to the Dark Cybertron crossover in MtMtE and RiD? Just wondering.

If I can make the suggestion again, **** Bayformers, do Aligned Continuity. It's better, it's cooler, it takes influences from everything, and you actually care about not just the Transformers but the human characters as well. I'm going through it myself right now (hence the thread that I'm ever so lonely in). I've reviewed the first book (Exodus). Seeing that come to life in the War For Cybertron game is really cool. The Transformers: Prime cartoon even won multiple Daytime Emmys and features the voice talent of Josh Keaton, Steve Blum, Peter Cullen, Frank Welker, Nolan North, Ernie Hudson (I have a humorous story about meeting him I should tell one day), Clancy Brown, George Takei, John DiMaggio, and Dwayne Johnson (as Cliffjumper no less!). You'd be really missing out on a lot of great stories while you suffer through a lot of bull**** crappy Michael Bay stuff.

Eh, the only reason I want to do the Bayformers timeline is because it's a relatively small universe. The Aligned Continuity is pretty sure, I'm huge. Plus, while I have little interest in the Bayformers stuff and know the films (and likely the spin off stuff) all suck, I'm just not interested in the other TF stuff. The IDW series is as close to the TF as I need to get.

 

[wyokid]

Does any of that apply to the Dark Cybertron crossover in MtMtE and RiD? Just wondering.

Yes it does.

Eh, the only reason I want to do the Bayformers timeline is because it's a relatively small universe. The Aligned Continuity is pretty sure, I'm huge. Plus, while I have little interest in the Bayformers stuff and know the films (and likely the spin off stuff) all suck, I'm just not interested in the other TF stuff. The IDW series is as close to the TF as I need to get.

Assuming you aren't doing any of the online/mobile games or the junior novels for Bayformers

Bayformers:
5 books
62 comics (assuming you aren't read in the Titan Magazine comics otherwise that's significantly higher)
3 games (assuming you're only doing one version for each movie)
4 films
13 episode webseries

Aligned:
4 video games
1 film (finale of Transformers Prime)
4 novels (one is the Covenant of Primus which is basically the Transformers bible)
117 episodes (65 of Prime and 52 of Rescue Bots)
18 comics

My problem is that you aren't getting to the really great Transformers stuff. I'm imaging at this point you think the franchise is pretty mediocre. I implore you to check out the best universe Transformers has ever had instead of the worst. You should at least just try the first five episodes of Prime (it's a story arc) after you're caught up on IDW. It's just a damn good show in general.

 

[DIrishB]

Does any of that apply to the Dark Cybertron crossover in MtMtE and RiD? Just wondering. Eh, the only reason I want to do the Bayformers timeline is because it's a relatively small universe. The Aligned Continuity is pretty sure, I'm huge. Plus, while I have little interest in the Bayformers stuff and know the films (and likely the spin off stuff) all suck, I'm just not interested in the other TF stuff. The IDW series is as close to the TF as I need to get.

That's should've read "the Aligned Continuity is pretty huge, I'm sure". Awkward.

Stupid autocorrect.

Yes it does. Assuming you aren't doing any of the online/mobile games or the junior novels for Bayformers Bayformers: 5 books 62 comics 3 games (assuming you're only doing one version for each movie) 4 films 13 episode webseries Aligned: 4 video games 1 film (finale of Transformers Prime) 4 novels (one is the Covenant of Primus which is basically the Transformers bible) 117 episodes (65 of Prime and 52 of Rescue Bots) 18 comics My problem is that you aren't getting to the really great Transformers stuff. I'm imaging at this point you think the franchise is pretty mediocre. I implore you to check out the best universe Transformers has ever had instead of the worst. You should at least just try the first five episodes of Prime (it's a story arc) after you're caught up on IDW.

Yeah, maybe. We'll see.


Also, as I said I'm timelining the IDW TF series. I've noticed a few mistakes with the chronological order posted on Wikipedia. For instance, they have the Blaster and Arcee spotlights occurring between Devastation #4 and #5... but there's no sense or reason to place them as such. First of all, the Arcee story occurs like 6 million years ago according to the TF wiki, not in the modern era most of the TF comics occur in. And the Blaster Spotlight has no reason to occur between Devastation #4 and #5 either. There are no indicators (crossover elements or references to events in other stories either in dialogue or art) that show it should occur there. Also considering Devastation #5 occurs immediately after #4, there's no reasonable span of time between the issues to place those Spotlights there either.

Meant to mention that awhile ago, but forgot, only remembered last night when I started working on the timeline again.

 

[DIrishB]

In fact the Blaster Spotlight seems to occur soon after the Stormbringer miniseries, at least the flashback portions, due to the mentions of the damage to Cybertron as a result of that arc's events.

 

[wyokid]

That's should've read "the Aligned Continuity is pretty huge, I'm sure". Awkward.

Stupid autocorrect.

Yeah, I decided not to make a sex joke out of that

Yeah, maybe. We'll see.


Also, as I said I'm timelining the IDW TF series. I've noticed a few mistakes with the chronological order posted on Wikipedia. For instance, they have the Blaster and Arcee spotlights occurring between Devastation #4 and #5... but there's no sense or reason to place them as such. First of all, the Arcee story occurs like 6 million years ago according to the TF wiki, not in the modern era most of the TF comics occur in. And the Blaster Spotlight has no reason to occur between Devastation #4 and #5 either. There are no indicators (crossover elements or references to events in other stories either in dialogue or art) that show it should occur there. Also considering Devastation #5 occurs immediately after #4, there's no reasonable span of time between the issues to place those Spotlights there either.

Meant to mention that awhile ago, but forgot, only remembered last night when I started working on the timeline again.

I think they're placed there to give background on the characters before they show up in the main story. I could be wrong though. They may have also been published in that order. I'm not really sure how they made that order. The IDW Collections have a similar, but different order too.

 

[DIrishB]

Yeah, I decided not to make a sex joke out of that I think they're placed there to give background on the characters before they show up in the main story. I could be wrong though. They may have also been published in that order. I'm not really sure how they made that order. The IDW Collections have a similar, but different order too.

On further research, I think the reference to Thunderwing's destruction of Cybertron was a reference to his first attack, way back when. And Arcee was only created six million years ago, the story actually does occur in the present day setting. However, it still makes absolutely no sense to place them between Devastation #4 and #5. I've placed them just after the Optimus Prime Spotlight, and before Devastation on my timeline. Of course with the ending of the Ramjet Spotlight, and all of the Galvatron, Optimus Prime, Blaster, and Arcee Spotlights occurring between Escalation and Devastation, that's a lot to fit in inside the 3 week span between those two minis. But it's doable.

 

[DIrishB]

Just re-read the Arcee Spotlight to be sure. There's a time jump. The first few pages feature a fight between her and Ultra Magnus, with UM apprehending her and taking her to the prison. Then the time jump occurs ("much later", nothing specific). UM is seen at the prison, as are the Robots that make up Monstructor, which places the rest of the Arcee Spotlight not long after the events of the Optimus Prime Spotlight (since OP defeated Monstructor in that issue), since the Autobots are still trying to figure out the technology that fuses the robots to create Monstructor.

EDIT: Nevermind. I also scanned through the Devastation issues, and #5 does reference the attack that occurred on the prison facility in the Arcee Spotlight as having just happened, so I'm going back and re-reading those to overlap them for the timeline. Still placing the Arcee Spotlight immediately before Devastation, as the events in Devastation occur over a few hours, a day at most.

Still have no clue why the Blaster Spotlight was placed between Devastation #4 and #5.

 

[wyokid]

Ah. See, this is why I'm about to re-read everything before Combiner Wars.

 

[DIrishB]

Ah. See, this is why I'm about to re-read everything before Combiner Wars.

When you do, pay extra attention when you read the Blaster Spotlight. I've read it twice, and scanned through it several more times, and I can't notice any reasons or markers as to why it's placed between Devastation #4 and #5.

The Arcee one makes sense now that I noticed the mention in Devastation #5, but the Blaster placement makes no sense. Even if it was due to them appearing soon in later issues, in regards to Blaster I can't figure out why his Spotlight wasn't placed either before or after the Devastation mini.

 

[wyokid]

When you do, pay extra attention when you read the Blaster Spotlight. I've read it twice, and scanned through it several more times, and I can't notice any reasons or markers as to why it's placed between Devastation #4 and #5.

The Arcee one makes sense now that I noticed the mention in Devastation #5, but the Blaster placement makes no sense. Even if it was due to them appearing soon in later issues, in regards to Blaster I can't figure out why his Spotlight wasn't placed either before or after the Devastation mini.

Will do. I am a reading it publication order this time though so it's already going to be pretty confusing chronologically.