Marvel Cinematic Universe - Timeline (Part 2)

[Pro Bot]

Or, more simply put, it's the same actor for fan-service but a completely new Charles...

I remember people saying the same thing about No Way Home. Truth is, we won't know, and I doubt they'll actually specify it in the film. Maybe Behind the Scenes we'll get something.

But, if we question one cameo as a potentially separate version, we'd have to literally question every single cameo.

"Is that Captain Carter from What If...?? No, that's a variant. What about Johnny Blaze? He's blue like the ending of Spirit of Vengeance, that's gotta be-nah, variant."

 

[Dallas Kinard]

I remember people saying the same thing about No Way Home. Truth is, we won't know, and I doubt they'll actually specify it in the film. Maybe Behind the Scenes we'll get something.

But, if we question one cameo as a potentially separate version, we'd have to literally question every single cameo.

"Is that Captain Carter from What If...?? No, that's a variant. What about Johnny Blaze? He's blue like the ending of Spirit of Vengeance, that's gotta be-nah, variant."

I think it's case by case. In this case, we have no evidence other than it being the same actor.

 

[Pro Bot]

I think it's case by case. In this case, we have no evidence other than it being the same actor.

So, we can question Captain Carter. Unless there's any link to the specific What If...? events, might as well be a variant.

I do get ya, though. It could be a variant of course, but I think Marvel has set a precedent that the same actor is the same version, in some way. That's just how I've interpreted it. The villains in No Way Home should logically be variants, but Marvel have insisted they're the same soul from their universes in a cloned body.

 

[Dallas Kinard]

So, we can question Captain Carter. Unless there's any link to the specific What If...? events, might as well be a variant.

I do get ya, though. It could be a variant of course, but I think Marvel has set a precedent that the same actor is the same version, in some way. That's just how I've interpreted it.

The difference here is that Cap Carter was already established as an MCU proper character. Charles was not.

 

[Pro Bot]

The difference here is that Cap Carter was already established as an MCU proper character. Charles was not.

See, but Deadpool 3 is MCU. So, while the X-Men films aren't part of the MCU franchise, they will be linked in some way, so an Xavier that looks identical probably has some distant connection at the very least.

So, I feel that in some form, Xavier should be related. An X-Men What If or one of the many X-Men Movie timelines, it should be related. If not Earth-17315, Earth-18315 or Earth-41633, then be related in the way What If...?'s universes are to Earth-199999.

 

[Dallas Kinard]

See, but Deadpool 3 is MCU. So, while the X-Men films aren't part of the MCU franchise, they will be linked in some way.

So, I feel that in some form, Xavier should be related. An X-Men What If or one of the many X-Men Movie timelines, it should be related. If not Earth-17315, Earth-18315 or Earth-41633, then be related in the way What If...?'s universes are to Earth-199999.

And I'll concede if it's made very clear, like Tobey and Andrew were. If he ends up being a Charles we are already familiar with, then I'd recommend folks start their MCU marathon with the Fox X-Men universe in it's entirety before jumping into the MCU proper. It did come first after all.

 

[fuzzyfoot]

So, we can question Captain Carter. Unless there's any link to the specific What If...? events, might as well be a variant.

I do get ya, though. It could be a variant of course, but I think Marvel has set a precedent that the same actor is the same version, in some way. That's just how I've interpreted it. The villains in No Way Home should logically be variants, but Marvel have insisted they're the same soul from their universes in a cloned body.

They've also set a precedent that the same actor plays a different character under a magic spell to appear as a variant character from a different universe in the sacred universe to trick the audience I guess...NWH makes that decision even more ridiculous in hindsight because of how much care they put into making the Peter's carry on their film's characters...

 

[Pro Bot]

They've also set a precedent that the same actor plays a different character under a magic spell to appear as a variant character from a different universe in the sacred universe to trick the audience I guess...NWH makes that decision even more ridiculous in hindsight because of how much care they put into making the Peter's carry on their film's characters...

The villains in NWH are the same exact versions, no matter how ridiculous it is.

To quote my friend:
"According to everybody working on No Way Home, the multiverse logic used is actually a bit different than what you would think watching the film.

The villains are the exact same versions of the characters from those films, but they are taken from an "essence", if you will, of their past.

They basically get reverse timed like what happens when you use the Time Stone and then they get plopped into the MCU. The film doesn't indicate this at all but this is apparently what the logic was."

 

[fuzzyfoot]

The villains in NWH are the same exact versions, no matter how ridiculous it is.

To quote my friend:
"According to everybody working on No Way Home, the multiverse logic used is actually a bit different than what you would think watching the film.

The villains are the exact same versions of the characters from those films, but they are taken from an "essence", if you will, of their past.

They basically get reverse timed like what happens when you use the Time Stone and then they get plopped into the MCU. The film doesn't indicate this at all but this is apparently what the logic was."

Oh I was referring to Ralph Bohner...

 

[Rman]

They've also set a precedent that the same actor plays a different character under a magic spell to appear as a variant character from a different universe in the sacred universe to trick the audience I guess...NWH makes that decision even more ridiculous in hindsight because of how much care they put into making the Peter's carry on their film's characters...

At the time, I felt like there had to be more to Bohner and the WandaVision reveal was a fakeout. I just couldn't see them wasting that opportunity for an awful payoff. Especially knowing WandaVision was going to be a part of "the multiverse saga". As more and more time passes though, it seems like it is what it is.

 

[fuzzyfoot]

At the time, I felt like there had to be more to Bohner and the WandaVision reveal was a fakeout. I just couldn't see them wasting that opportunity for an awful payoff. Especially knowing WandaVision was going to be a part of "the

I was fooled, as I felt the reveal would be legit, but pulling the rug out completely ruined that first moment for me forever.

 

[Rman]

It's so frustrating trying to convince people Eternals is set in 2023. Nate Moore's exact words were "right around the same time as Spider-Man: Far From Home, with the world recovering from the attack of Thanos and the return of half the world' population". Eternals could be November 2023 and this still works the same way they said Far From Home was shortly after Endgame and the actual movie was 8 months after.

And of course, the Disney + timeline placement gets brought up like it's 100% concrete and accurate.

 

[fuzzyfoot]

And of course, the Disney + timeline placement gets brought up like it's 100% concrete and accurate.

The same timeline that has altered the position of Black Widow on there...twice...

 

[Pro Bot]

If that is too confusing, I made a graph visualizing how the branches work; based on the earliest points of divergence (i.e. the birth of Apocalypse 5000 years ago)

Earth-10005 and its branches; ignore the rest.

You could relate Earth-760207 (Spider-Man: The New Animated Series) as a branch of the Raimiverse that also shares elements with the Daredevil Duology, since they share the same Wilson Fisk.

Further, the video game tie-in for The Punisher has it's own Earth number (Earth-50116), so you could consider that a slightly alternate universe.

Even more, Spider-Man: Friend or Foe is set in a universe resembling the Raimiverse where all of the villains survived known as Earth-71002.

I've seen you've made note of The Amazing Spider-Man video games as a divergent timeline to the Webbverse, or at least I think you've done that.

 

[Starvel]

So I know I'm a little late to this discussion but I figured I'd throw in how I'm doing my Marvel Cinematic Multiverse viewing order. I've put it into 3 different parts: Part One is The Infinity Saga, everything Chronologically set in the MCU before Endgame. Part Two is films set outside of the MCU that connect to it in Chronological Order. For Example

X-Men Universes
01. First Class
02. X-Men Origins
03. X-Men
04. X2
05. The Last Stand
06. The Wolverine
07. Days of Future Past.
08 Apocalypse
09. Dark Phoenix
10. Deadpool
11. Deadpool 2
12. The New Mutants
13. Logan

Spider-Verse Films
01. Spider-Man
02. Spider-Man 2
03. Spider-Man 3
04. The Amazing Spider-Man
05. The Amazing Spider-Man 2
06. Venom
07. Let There Be Carnage
08. Morbius
09. Into the Spider-Verse

Then Part Three is everything in the MCU set Chronologically after Endgame starting with Loki and going forward. I like this order as the focus is initially on the MCU and then it switches to the main connective material that's set in the Multiverse before returning to the MCU where the multiverse is introduced and original actors start returning as their characters

On the Professor X thing I believe a reliable leaker, either MTTSH or ViewerAnon if I remember correctly, said that the Xavier in Multiverse of Madness wasn't specifically from an X-Men film we've seen. However my personal headcanon is that Dark Phoenix leads to its own branch and that's the Xavier we have. I donthis because the renaming of the Xavier Institute to the Jean Grey Institute doesn't line up with future movies where is shown/mentioned as the Xavier Institute still as well as Xavier stepping down from the role of leader and headmaster of the X-Men doesn't line up with future films and scenes. So the way I've explained it is there's the Original Timeline from First Class to the Future parts of Days of Future Past, the Wolverine travels to the Past and changes it to restore the future. Then the Deadpools, New Mutants and Logan films take place in this restored future where as Apocalypse and Dark Phoenix continue in a branch from Days of Future Past where Xavier has stepped down from his role in the X-Men and begins looking into the dangers of branching timelines and the multiverse leading to him creating the Illuminati. I know there's holes in this but I prefer this to "he's a different version".

 

[Pro Bot]

So I know I'm a little late to this discussion but I figured I'd throw in how I'm doing my Marvel Cinematic Multiverse viewing order. I've put it into 3 different parts: Part One is The Infinity Saga, everything Chronologically set in the MCU before Endgame. Part Two is films set outside of the MCU that connect to it in Chronological Order. For Example

X-Men Universes
01. First Class
02. X-Men Origins
03. X-Men
04. X2
05. The Last Stand
06. The Wolverine
07. Days of Future Past.
08 Apocalypse
09. Dark Phoenix
10. Deadpool
11. Deadpool 2
12. The New Mutants
13. Logan

Spider-Verse Films
01. Spider-Man
02. Spider-Man 2
03. Spider-Man 3
04. The Amazing Spider-Man
05. The Amazing Spider-Man 2
06. Venom
07. Let There Be Carnage
08. Morbius
09. Into the Spider-Verse

Then Part Three is everything in the MCU set Chronologically after Endgame starting with Loki and going forward. I like this order as the focus is initially on the MCU and then it switches to the main connective material that's set in the Multiverse before returning to the MCU where the multiverse is introduced and original actors start returning as their characters

On the Professor X thing I believe a reliable leaker, either MTTSH or ViewerAnon if I remember correctly, said that the Xavier in Multiverse of Madness wasn't specifically from an X-Men film we've seen. However my personal headcanon is that Dark Phoenix leads to its own branch and that's the Xavier we have. I donthis because the renaming of the Xavier Institute to the Jean Grey Institute doesn't line up with future movies where is shown/mentioned as the Xavier Institute still as well as Xavier stepping down from the role of leader and headmaster of the X-Men doesn't line up with future films and scenes. So the way I've explained it is there's the Original Timeline from First Class to the Future parts of Days of Future Past, the Wolverine travels to the Past and changes it to restore the future. Then the Deadpools, New Mutants and Logan films take place in this restored future where as Apocalypse and Dark Phoenix continue in a branch from Days of Future Past where Xavier has stepped down from his role in the X-Men and begins looking into the dangers of branching timelines and the multiverse leading to him creating the Illuminati. I know there's holes in this but I prefer this to "he's a different version".

Spoiler

MTTSH said he's a variant, but I think that's due to his fate. I believe he definitely could be, but the film probably won't specify. I also remember leakers saying the villains in No Way Home were variants.

Plus, variant could just simply mean it's not the main timeline version (Earth-17315).

About that, I'm sure Xavier was going to return to bring the headmaster in future films. There isn't really any continuity error, they just renamed it to Xavier's School, probably when Jean returned to Earth.

 

[Starvel]

Spoiler

MTTSH said he's a variant, but I think that's due to his fate. I believe he definitely could be, but the film probably won't specify. I also remember leakers saying the villains in No Way Home were variants.

Plus, variant could just simply mean it's not the main timeline version (Earth-17315).

About that, I'm sure Xavier was going to return to bring the headmaster in future films. There isn't really any continuity error, they just renamed it to Xavier's School, probably when Jean returned to Earth.

Oh there's definitely no doubt in my mind to me that's he's meant to be the Xavier from the X-Men films tho I'm sure the film won't specify. And sure that could've always been he's plan but since nothing on the films ever cover it and it goes from being the Jean Grey Institute back to the Xavier Institute immediately in the next film chronologically with Deadpool and they mention bringing him to the Professor I think my theory works well enough to A. Explain where this Professor X came from and B. Remove Dark Phoenix from the main timeline cause I really dislike that film. They are totally reasons just for my headcanon and I definitely don't consider it legit but I figured I'd share my reasoning going into this film.

 

[Pro Bot]

Oh there's definitely no doubt in my mind to me that's he's meant to be the Xavier from the X-Men films tho I'm sure the film won't specify. And sure that could've always been he's plan but since nothing on the films ever cover it and it goes from being the Jean Grey Institute back to the Xavier Institute immediately in the next film chronologically with Deadpool and they mention bringing him to the Professor I think my theory works well enough to A. Explain where this Professor X came from and B. Remove Dark Phoenix from the main timeline cause I really dislike that film. They are totally reasons just for my headcanon and I definitely don't consider it legit but I figured I'd share my reasoning going into this film.

Apocalypse is connected to Logan and The New Mutants, so don't feel great about disconnecting the revised X-Men from the modern Revised films. It's your head-canon, though, you can play around with it all you want.

Spoiler

If you wanna have this as an alternate Xavier to the revised X-Men films, why not Earth-41633 (Deadpool 2 Earth number)? It'd basically be the revised Xavier but without the DoFP epilogue and Logan events. I mean, it can still be Earth-17315 Xavier even if he dies here, because of the previously mentioned twin brother, but that's confusing to explain for sure.

I mean, it's all just theories and head-canons until the film comes out anyway.

 

[Starvel]

Apocalypse is connected to Logan and The New Mutants, so don't feel great about disconnecting the revised X-Men from the modern Revised films. It's your head-canon, though, you can play around with it all you want.

Spoiler

If you wanna have this as an alternate Xavier to the revised X-Men films, why not Earth-41633 (Deadpool 2 Earth number)? It'd basically be the revised Xavier but without the DoFP epilogue and Logan events. I mean, it can still be Earth-17315 Xavier even if he dies here, because of the previously mentioned twin brother, but that's confusing to explain for sure.

I mean, it's all just theories and head-canons until the film comes out anyway.

I'm not too confident that the film will clear anything up for us. I'm pretty sure after this film it'll still all be theories and headcanons about where this Xavier came from. But yeah I'm cool with Apocalypse being part of the Revised timeline and just separating Dark Phoenix as the point of the branch it's really cause I just don't like the film and it lets me pop it out of the universe for my own personal pleasure while also making the film not feel totally annoying by at least having that Xavier form the Illuminati while the main Xavier can continue off to die in Logan

 

[Rman]

I'm in the middle of rewatching the movies and got to Thor: The Dark World and noticed the November 14th date used when Eric is getting released, actually is the offense date rather than the day he is being released. Meaning his incident in Stonehenge is what falls on the 14th. To fix this, I would just move the current dates for the movie 2 days ahead. With the movie now beginning on the 13th and ending on the 19th. This would also mean the AoS tie-in would need to be adjusted accordingly.

A couple of suggestions for AoS. I would place The Well on November 18th-19th with the team in Greenwich being the day after the battle. Also, the episode covers two days while the timeline currently shows one. And the next episode, "Repairs" seems to pick up right after The Well with the team in the same hotel they were in the prior episode, hinting it's the next day. There's also a Wednesday newspaper at the beginning which would fit with the episode beginning on November 20th.