The Ultimates Annual #1 (SPOILERS)
- Thread starter DIrishB
- Start date
Ice
Teh Sexy Monkey Queen
As long as we all know.marvelman said:
Your membership.marvelman said:
Kidding! Kidding!
moonmaster
Without him, all of you would be lost souls roamin
- Joined
- Feb 23, 2005
- Messages
- 13,670
I've said it over and over and over and over and over again. It ain't Cap because he's way too obvious! I don't think the traitor being Cap would shock anyone. I can't believe that people don't see that Hitllar screwing with us. The "country I used to know" speech. The "soldier" line. There trying to make us think its Cap. THEY'RE TRICKING YOOOOUUUUUUU!!!!!!!!!!!!!
:arrgh: :crazy: :dead:
:arrgh: :crazy: :dead:
DIrishB
The Timeline Guy
moonmaster said:
Totally agree, it isn't Cap. I really have no clue who it is. Speaking of which, where's Bass info based off the Annual as to the traitor's ID? I told you he was effing with us.
Guijllons
Well-Known Member
I have an idea what bass might be thinking.
And I thought it was a crap issue.
And I thought it was a crap issue.
DIrishB
The Timeline Guy
Guijllons said:
You wanna share with the rest of us? Man, whats with everyone being so secretive and mysterious? This isn't the American Government, its a comic message board for chrissakes!
Seldes Katne
Site mom
All right, let's see how much trouble I can get myself into this month....
I didn't have any expectations about this issue one way or the other. The impression I get about the annuals is that they're related stories that don't need to be read in order to understand what's happening in the regular issues. So in that respect, this one wasn't bad—it served as a "fill in the missing scenes" sort of story that sketches out events happening outside the regular Ultimates focus. The problem was that once this issue was over, none of the new characters really stood out in my mind as out of the ordinary or someone I wanted to see in the regular title. And a number of them seemed more focused on becoming rich and famous than anything else. Is that really the New Normal?
Mark Millar commented over at Millarworld that the HC for this annual would include all four of the annuals, instead of putting each one with other issues of its respective titles. I hope that's not true. It would make more sense to me for this to go in one of the Ultimates HCs somewhere, rather than expecting everyone to purchase an extra, separate HC that has four "detached" issues in it, three of which belong to other series. I recently bought the New X-Men HC vol. 1, which included a large section in the middle (that presumably was the annual) that explained a lot of the background of one story arc. This section wasn't in the trades, and I could still follow the story without knowing the information, but having this extra section in with the other issues greatly enhanced my understanding of the story arc that followed it in the regular issues.
(And Mr. Millar can gripe and moan all he wants about how much he hates trades because people miss all the speculation as the issues are being published. I don't understand that at all. Why should Ultimates 2 stop being a good read just because the mystery is solved? :? Personally, I love trades. I prefer trades. I buy trades, for both myself and my library. And if my money does indeed talk, I expect we will be getting trades for years to come.)
The Defenders.... Sorry, MWoF, but I can't bring myself to hate these guys. Nighthawk in particular seems to have his heart in the right place, even if he comes off as the biggest goof since Jar Jar Binks. And I have to admire them for never giving up, even though there doesn't seem to be a shred of talent among them, and they really don't have a prayer. (Or a clue.)
Son of Satan's name is Damien? :roll: Wow, there's a cliché with a long white beard! :lol:
I didn't have any expectations about this issue one way or the other. The impression I get about the annuals is that they're related stories that don't need to be read in order to understand what's happening in the regular issues. So in that respect, this one wasn't bad—it served as a "fill in the missing scenes" sort of story that sketches out events happening outside the regular Ultimates focus. The problem was that once this issue was over, none of the new characters really stood out in my mind as out of the ordinary or someone I wanted to see in the regular title. And a number of them seemed more focused on becoming rich and famous than anything else. Is that really the New Normal?
That theme jumped out at me, too. Suddenly we have super-people crawling out of the woodwork, and it kind of cheapens the whole thing. Most of these folks have no developed personalities and in fact seem kind of interchangeable — almost anyone could wear the suits and do the damage. And they all want to have bigger approval ratings than Janet Pym. :roll: The one bit of humor in the whole thing was Summer complaining about the suit, which I agreed with—not because it made him look effeminate, but because bright colors are like waving a huge, flashing neon sign that says, "Here I am! Someone nail me to the wall!" I was so grateful when superhero comics started getting away from the screaming loud spandex look, and now the suits have gone retro. :arrgh:UltimateE said:
Thank you. (Thank you, thank you, thank you!) I'm relieved to find out I'm not the only person who's tired of this plot point. The discussions here, at Millarworld, and at Ultimate-X have all focused on this for over two months, and at this point I think I've heard pretty much every theory under the sun. Some fellow on Millarworld actually tossed some conjecture out about where the plot would go from here, based on some symbolism from Norse mythology and a couple other ideas. I logged on for the first time in months to thank him for talking about something, anything besides "Who's the traitor?". At this point I don't care if Thor's been sneaking out of the Triskelion to mastermind this whole scheme, or if Hank Pym wakes up in bed and finds out Ultimates 2 was all a dream, or if the collective employees of S.H.I.E.L.D. are behind it to get even with Fury for dumping them in favor of super soldiers and with the rest of the Ultimates for being grandstanding egotists. I just want this over with. (Besides, Marvelman's already solved the mystery, right? :wink: )TheManWithoutFear said:
Mark Millar commented over at Millarworld that the HC for this annual would include all four of the annuals, instead of putting each one with other issues of its respective titles. I hope that's not true. It would make more sense to me for this to go in one of the Ultimates HCs somewhere, rather than expecting everyone to purchase an extra, separate HC that has four "detached" issues in it, three of which belong to other series. I recently bought the New X-Men HC vol. 1, which included a large section in the middle (that presumably was the annual) that explained a lot of the background of one story arc. This section wasn't in the trades, and I could still follow the story without knowing the information, but having this extra section in with the other issues greatly enhanced my understanding of the story arc that followed it in the regular issues.
(And Mr. Millar can gripe and moan all he wants about how much he hates trades because people miss all the speculation as the issues are being published. I don't understand that at all. Why should Ultimates 2 stop being a good read just because the mystery is solved? :? Personally, I love trades. I prefer trades. I buy trades, for both myself and my library. And if my money does indeed talk, I expect we will be getting trades for years to come.)
This scene really surprised me — it seemed like a step backwards in terms of believability. One of the best features of the Ultimate line is that genetic manipulation is at the heart of a lot of the super-powers people acquire, which to me makes a lot more sense than the "applied radiation" background to characters in the regular Marvel comics. Based on what my mother and a couple other cancer survivors I know went through with radiation treatments, radiation seems more likely to destroy cells and produce detrimental genetic defects than to create beings who can fly, mess with the weather, heal rapidly or turn to metal. (Okay, not that some of those powers sound plausible using any explanation, but still....) Humans have a lot of DNA we don't use, and the possibility of genetic therapy switching on some of those genes and producing unusual effects sounds more plausible in this day and age than zapping something with radiation.
This sounds like a Mark Millar editorial comment on US policy in general. It's a pretty obvious comparison to the arms race and nuclear weapons proliferation—the excuse being that we need to have bigger, more powerful weapons because "the other guys" will have them, and we need to protect ourselves. I'm a little surprised that Fury is being as public about the Super Soldier program as he is, unless it's a smoke screen for something else.
The Defenders.... Sorry, MWoF, but I can't bring myself to hate these guys. Nighthawk in particular seems to have his heart in the right place, even if he comes off as the biggest goof since Jar Jar Binks. And I have to admire them for never giving up, even though there doesn't seem to be a shred of talent among them, and they really don't have a prayer. (Or a clue.)
Son of Satan's name is Damien? :roll: Wow, there's a cliché with a long white beard! :lol:
This made me laugh, as I paid six grand more for a good used car five years ago, and still got a better deal than these guys. Maybe I should moonlight as a superhero in my spare time. (Oh, wait, I'm a librarian — you can't get much more super than that, right? :wink: )icemastertron said:
ProjectX2
Don't expect me to take you with me when I go to s
- Joined
- Sep 15, 2004
- Messages
- 25,007
I too am sick with the traitor talk. And I haven't even read the issues! :shock:
Damien Hellstrom is his full name I believe.
Damien Hellstrom is his full name I believe.
Ice
Teh Sexy Monkey Queen
Gotta remember though, it's STILL a comic book. So things like this will still happen, no matter what. And yes, I do get your point. Just saying.Seldes Katne said:
Seldes Katne said:
To the first part of the quoted: I quite agree with you. I just want to know for sure, and get the story going again, no delays, etc. I want a frickin story dammit!
and as for the second part: Yes, Yes I have. :wink:
DIrishB
The Timeline Guy
Seldes Katne said:
I wasn't really fond of this scene either, but to be fair I think it was just Millar having a little fun, sort of joking about how all the original 616 heroes and villains gained their power. He's crazy like that.
notTHATtodd
Well-Known Member
marvelman said:
Yes, but he was great in A Clockwork Orange
notTHATtodd
Well-Known Member
Dr.Strangefate said:
Actually this would be something that I could see Miller doing. Throughout the entire run of the Ultimates, both series, Miller has focus on how this super team thing is a very big, expensive, and powerful grey area. How the team got it's start fighting it's own member; that their first outside villian lead to what could be seen as genocide (perhaps justifible but still genocide); the hunting down of a member of the team who has a gripe, instead of working with the guy (not to mention locking him up is not the nicest thing to do to a guy who is "mentally unbalanced", thus showing an amazing lack of concern for the person who saved the planet from destruction the year before); and finally, be continuing attempts to recreate the super-soldier serum with (apparently) bothering to run tests on Rogers to find out why he didn't die from the formula. The entire series is a grey area, and having Captain America the traitor (and thus the bad guy in the eyes of the government) against Fury and SHIELD (and is thus the replacement to the very aliens that Cap had been fighting since WWII) makes perfect sense.
THat said, I'd find it a bit difficult that the guy would allow so much collatoral damage (i.e. Hawkeye's wife and kid), but it is possible. Especially taking into consideration that Hawkeye was really Fury's *****, while Rogers is more the ***** of the American flag.
TheManWithoutFear
#1 reason not to join UC
Seldes Katne said:All right, let's see how much trouble I can get myself into this month....
I didn't have any expectations about this issue one way or the other. The impression I get about the annuals is that they're related stories that don't need to be read in order to understand what's happening in the regular issues. So in that respect, this one wasn't bad—it served as a "fill in the missing scenes" sort of story that sketches out events happening outside the regular Ultimates focus. The problem was that once this issue was over, none of the new characters really stood out in my mind as out of the ordinary or someone I wanted to see in the regular title. And a number of them seemed more focused on becoming rich and famous than anything else. Is that really the New Normal?
That theme jumped out at me, too. Suddenly we have super-people crawling out of the woodwork, and it kind of cheapens the whole thing. Most of these folks have no developed personalities and in fact seem kind of interchangeable — almost anyone could wear the suits and do the damage. And they all want to have bigger approval ratings than Janet Pym. :roll: The one bit of humor in the whole thing was Summer complaining about the suit, which I agreed with—not because it made him look effeminate, but because bright colors are like waving a huge, flashing neon sign that says, "Here I am! Someone nail me to the wall!" I was so grateful when superhero comics started getting away from the screaming loud spandex look, and now the suits have gone retro. :arrgh:
Thank you. (Thank you, thank you, thank you!) I'm relieved to find out I'm not the only person who's tired of this plot point. The discussions here, at Millarworld, and at Ultimate-X have all focused on this for over two months, and at this point I think I've heard pretty much every theory under the sun. Some fellow on Millarworld actually tossed some conjecture out about where the plot would go from here, based on some symbolism from Norse mythology and a couple other ideas. I logged on for the first time in months to thank him for talking about something, anything besides "Who's the traitor?". At this point I don't care if Thor's been sneaking out of the Triskelion to mastermind this whole scheme, or if Hank Pym wakes up in bed and finds out Ultimates 2 was all a dream, or if the collective employees of S.H.I.E.L.D. are behind it to get even with Fury for dumping them in favor of super soldiers and with the rest of the Ultimates for being grandstanding egotists. I just want this over with. (Besides, Marvelman's already solved the mystery, right? :wink: )
Mark Millar commented over at Millarworld that the HC for this annual would include all four of the annuals, instead of putting each one with other issues of its respective titles. I hope that's not true. It would make more sense to me for this to go in one of the Ultimates HCs somewhere, rather than expecting everyone to purchase an extra, separate HC that has four "detached" issues in it, three of which belong to other series. I recently bought the New X-Men HC vol. 1, which included a large section in the middle (that presumably was the annual) that explained a lot of the background of one story arc. This section wasn't in the trades, and I could still follow the story without knowing the information, but having this extra section in with the other issues greatly enhanced my understanding of the story arc that followed it in the regular issues.
(And Mr. Millar can gripe and moan all he wants about how much he hates trades because people miss all the speculation as the issues are being published. I don't understand that at all. Why should Ultimates 2 stop being a good read just because the mystery is solved? :? Personally, I love trades. I prefer trades. I buy trades, for both myself and my library. And if my money does indeed talk, I expect we will be getting trades for years to come.)
This scene really surprised me — it seemed like a step backwards in terms of believability. One of the best features of the Ultimate line is that genetic manipulation is at the heart of a lot of the super-powers people acquire, which to me makes a lot more sense than the "applied radiation" background to characters in the regular Marvel comics. Based on what my mother and a couple other cancer survivors I know went through with radiation treatments, radiation seems more likely to destroy cells and produce detrimental genetic defects than to create beings who can fly, mess with the weather, heal rapidly or turn to metal. (Okay, not that some of those powers sound plausible using any explanation, but still....) Humans have a lot of DNA we don't use, and the possibility of genetic therapy switching on some of those genes and producing unusual effects sounds more plausible in this day and age than zapping something with radiation.
This sounds like a Mark Millar editorial comment on US policy in general. It's a pretty obvious comparison to the arms race and nuclear weapons proliferation—the excuse being that we need to have bigger, more powerful weapons because "the other guys" will have them, and we need to protect ourselves. I'm a little surprised that Fury is being as public about the Super Soldier program as he is, unless it's a smoke screen for something else.
The Defenders.... Sorry, MWoF, but I can't bring myself to hate these guys. Nighthawk in particular seems to have his heart in the right place, even if he comes off as the biggest goof since Jar Jar Binks. And I have to admire them for never giving up, even though there doesn't seem to be a shred of talent among them, and they really don't have a prayer. (Or a clue.)
Son of Satan's name is Damien? :roll: Wow, there's a cliché with a long white beard! :lol:
This made me laugh, as I paid six grand more for a good used car five years ago, and still got a better deal than these guys. Maybe I should moonlight as a superhero in my spare time. (Oh, wait, I'm a librarian — you can't get much more super than that, right? :wink: )
*Standing Ovation, MWoF walks out and hands Seldes a dozen roses and a kiss on the cheek, Seldes waves and blows a kiss to the crowd*
Another brilliant post by the site's leading lady. Agreed and enlightened by all of it with one exception. The Defenders. But that's a matter of a difference of opinion and like you said, some people like Jar-Jar Binks and some people don't.
Seldes Katne
Site mom
Yes, Ice, I know. I read a lot of science fiction and fantasy along with my comic books, so weird, unexplainable stuff is kind of par for the course. But I know what you mean.icemastertron said:Gotta remember though, it's STILL a comic book. So things like this will still happen, no matter what. And yes, I do get your point. Just saying.
Hellstrom? Boy, that joke just keeps getting better, doesn't it? :lol: Wasn't "Damien" the name of the kid in the Exorcist movie(s)? Didn't he end up being Satan's son and/or the Antichrist by the time the series was over? I never actually saw the movies, so I don't remember.ProjectX2 said:
Roses? Really?
I can't remember the last time anyone gave me roses.... I may cry. (Or at least offer to spring for lunch again.... :wink: ) I don't have the emotional attachment to the Defenders from 616 Marvel that you do, MWoF, so I can take these guys at face value here without resentment. But I can understand why you might not be happy with their portrayal.
And I just want to note for the record that I do like Jar Jar, although I will freely admit I wouldn't want him living in my house!
Nurhachi
Well-Known Member
Seldes Katne said:
Yup his name is Damien. The name Damien actually means "Son of the devil".
GMaster
Banned
Just read this. Again, I am naughty, I downloaded it, but I am paying for it, I just wont be getting it for like 2 months.
Was pretty good. Nice to see Dillon still pwnz0rz.
Was pretty good. Nice to see Dillon still pwnz0rz.
notTHATtodd
Well-Known Member
Seldes Katne said:And I just want to note for the record that I do like Jar Jar, although I will freely admit I wouldn't want him living in my house!
Wow. I've never known someone to freely admit they liked Jar Jar who wasn't a twelve year old boy who though fart jokes were the height of humor. I bow to your bravery in the face of all adversity.
