Captain America Returns with Alex Ross.

I'm not kidding or trying to be funny when I say it looks like a condom ad. I mean Jesus Christ, he looks like he's ribbed for pleasure:

1582new_storyimage2051045_full.jpg


Like DSF said, it's not shiny that's bothersome. What bothers me is the ribbed-ness of it all.

SSJmole said:
your turned on by it aren't you.


It's ok we all are. I'm having dream sex with the shiny captain america as we speak , It feels so good. Even better than my dream sex with you.
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Pervert.

Random said:
Well this is stupid. I hate the design it looks nothing like Cap should, it seems like Alex Ross just combined Cap's costume with his concept of Spider-man's movie costume, than oiled it up.
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The large amounts of industrial grade shampoo and conditioner needed to maintain Alex Ross' hair has been proven to cause brain damage.

Random said:
I hope they come up with an interesting origin that has nothing to do with Tony Stark, rather take the soldier from The Chosen and through twists of fate become Captain America.

But I'm pretty against a new Cap altogether, though I like the character in The Chosen and would not be that pissed if it was him. But yeah, I hate the costume
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You mean Captain America is the son of Satan, who was anally raped by his father and then became President?

Bass said:
I totally agree. I don't see the big fuss about the gun and knife. Sure, Cap doesn't need them to kick your ***, but they seem practical. Plus, a gun and knife might lend to more swashbuckling which could be cool.
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I think what he needs is a whip. And a fedora.

Bass said:
Violent? No.

Emotional? Yes. Otherwise, what's the point? The death can be small, subtle, and somewhat mundane, but it must be emotionally powerful - it's a story. If there's no emotional power to it - then there's no ****ing point.
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Exactly.

Aunt May or Harry Osborn could have died extremely violently at the hands of a supervillains, but they didn't. Which is why their deaths actually meant something.

Then they took it back by making Aunt May a clone.

Bass said:
If the meaning was intended to be that it was an unexpected death and we're supposed to feel blindsided by it, then fine, but that's not really a meaning worth giving. And I don't think that is what we're supposed to feel. I think that's what's been said as a defence against the criticism. I think, we were supposed to feel sadness for Cap, for the Marvel Universe - we're supposed to grieve. That's the powerful emotion. And it strikes me they went more a shock/intellectual death rather than an emotional one. Most likely with the best of intentions.

Personally, it seems to me more people are just pissed off that they didn't feel anything. It's just like THE SOPRANOS finale. An intellectual pay-off is never as powerful as an emotional one.
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I agree.

If you have to RATIONALIZE out a reaction to the storytelling, then it just isn't the same. You're not emotionally moved, you're just trying to cognitively create a meaning.
 
thee great one said:
I thought it was well done.


It should that the villains are not always the fools they are portrayed. Cap turned himself in and they took advantage of the situation.

I thought it was a great way to go with him dying undignified in chains, instead of the Hero dying to save someone or everthing. Not every hero dies like a hero. And it worked better because it was THE hero.

I don't know if I'm explaining this right.
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I liked it because Red Skull won utterly. Cap's a criminal, in chains, America has confusing feelings about him...and Sharon Carter, of all people, shoots him dead.

Red Skull wins!

That's rare in mainstream comics....or comics at all. A villain utterly destroyed a hero.
 
Foolsfolly said:
I liked it because Red Skull won utterly. Cap's a criminal, in chains, America has confusing feelings about him...and Sharon Carter, of all people, shoots him dead.

Red Skull wins!

That's rare in mainstream comics....or comics at all. A villain utterly destroyed a hero.
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That's not true. Villains win just as often as heroes.

The people who always lose out are the girlfriends.

07-hvv.jpg
 
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Joe Kalicki said:
No, he means Oswald.

Sharon Carter is Ruby.

What kind of American are you?
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Obviously, he's a bad one.

Pinko scum.

Skrull.

Random said:
:sure: You mean John F Kennedy?
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That might've worked. An assassin's bullet while being celebrated and the series progresses into a huge conspiracy about who killed him and why. Red Skull? The US Government? Tony Stark? Whodunnit?!?!?!

Or, he could be shot by his brainwashed friend on steps while he's been arrested for competing in a top trumps tournament.

Okay, that was harsh. To balance it out, I shall insult the JFK idea:

CAPTAIN AMERICA #25
The Death of Captain America: Part 2
With Captain America shot by an unknown assassin, Bucky has to solve the murder mystery! This special anniversary issue comes with a copy of Oliver Stone's JFK. There are three differences between this story line and JFK! Can you spot them? It'll be hard! Clue: Some names change.
Written by Bass "Oliver Stone Can't Sue Me" Wakil

E said:
Stop trying to ruin my site.
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Please. Marvel did that three years ago.

SSJmole said:
I'm sorry , It wont happen again

Venom rules!!!!
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SSJmole said:
ohhhhh kinky :twisted:
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:lol: :lol: Mole, you've had me in stitches this whole thread. :D

E said:
I'm surprised no one has said how much this reeks of 90s Marvel, because it totally does.
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How so?

Foolsfolly said:
I liked it because Red Skull won utterly. Cap's a criminal, in chains, America has confusing feelings about him...and Sharon Carter, of all people, shoots him dead.

Red Skull wins!

That's rare in mainstream comics....or comics at all. A villain utterly destroyed a hero.
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But... how? Red Skull didn't orchestrate Civil War; Speedball (the nefarious toad that he is) did. It seems to me Red Skull hung around the goal, waited for a rebound, then screamed victory and ran away. :?
 
Bass said:
But... how? Red Skull didn't orchestrate Civil War; Speedball (the nefarious toad that he is) did. It seems to me Red Skull hung around the goal, waited for a rebound, then screamed victory and ran away. :?
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Dude, he orchestrated the whole thing in the pages of Captain America. Recruiting the Sniper, brainwashing Carter, all that jazz. He then seizes an opportunity.

This is not the thread for this discussion.

And we get it now, you don't like the costume.
 
Huh? I don't really care about the costume one way or the other. When did I say otherwise? :?

Also - am I not right in thinking Red Skull had no part to play in Civil War? :?
 
He was not in Civil War, he was, for 24 issues within Captain America, planning America's demise.

And guess where Cap died, IN THE ISSUES OF CAPTAIN AMERICA!

How do you not see that?
 
ourchair said:
You mean Captain America is the son of Satan, who was anally raped by his father and then became President?
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Hmm, I'm talking about Captain America: The Chosen, not sure where you're getting all that :?

Ultimate Houde said:
He was not in Civil War, he was, for 24 issues within Captain America, planning America's demise.

And guess where Cap died, IN THE ISSUES OF CAPTAIN AMERICA!

How do you not see that?
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Yep, Red Skull just took advantage after the Civil War.
 
The art is nice. I was hoping that if and when they brought back Captain America, they would use a version of the costume closer to Ultimate Cap. Oh well, it looks good when Alex Ross paints it.

I'll hold my judgment until I read some issues with the new Cap. I'm sure Brubaker will make it good.
 
Ultimate Houde said:
He was not in Civil War, he was, for 24 issues within Captain America, planning America's demise.

And guess where Cap died, IN THE ISSUES OF CAPTAIN AMERICA!

How do you not see that?
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But... let me get this straight. For 24 issues, Red skull works on a scheme to destroy Captain America for ever. Two years of comics, and he plans and plans and plans.

Then, from nowhere, superheroes beat the piss out of each other and congress passes a bill and Cap rebels against SHIELD and fights Iron Man, then turns himself in to be arrested.

And then Red Skull has him shot.

Does... does that not seem anticlimactic to you?

As far as I can tell, the whole situation where Cap is vulnerable enough to be killed arises out of CIVIL WAR - and Red Skull had no part in that. So I fail to see how Red Skull orchestrated his demise. Sure, he took advantage of the situation, but he didn't create the situation. Am I right or wrong? (Note that if I'm 'right' I'm right in that I have the context of events correctly, it doesn't mean that you agree with me that the death wasn't particularly good.)

E said:
You're right - he would need a mohawk and a bazooka.
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Ah, a Liefeldplasty.
 
Bass said:
But... let me get this straight. For 24 issues, Red skull works on a scheme to destroy Captain America for ever. Two years of comics, and he plans and plans and plans.

Then, from nowhere, superheroes beat the piss out of each other and congress passes a bill and Cap rebels against SHIELD and fights Iron Man, then turns himself in to be arrested.

And then Red Skull has him shot.

Does... does that not seem anticlimactic to you?

As far as I can tell, the whole situation where Cap is vulnerable enough to be killed arises out of CIVIL WAR - and Red Skull had no part in that. So I fail to see how Red Skull orchestrated his demise. Sure, he took advantage of the situation, but he didn't create the situation. Am I right or wrong? (Note that if I'm 'right' I'm right in that I have the context of events correctly, it doesn't mean that you agree with me that the death wasn't particularly good.)



Ah, a Liefeldplasty.
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Don't over-analyze things and you might see the answer.
 
Red Skull had already infiltrated SHIELD and brainwashed Carter, so it was only a matter of time before his plan came into action. Civil War happened, Captain America got captured, so he struck then. It was going to happen sooner or later, it's just Marvel decided to cash in the Civil War publicity.
 
ProjectX2 said:
Red Skull had already infiltrated SHIELD and brainwashed Carter, so it was only a matter of time before his plan came into action. Civil War happened, Captain America got captured, so he struck then. It was going to happen sooner or later, it's just Marvel decided to cash in the Civil War publicity.
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Plus logically with what happened in Civil war we knew some bad guy was going to take advantage of it , they had to.
 
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