Ultimate Fantastic Four #32 (Discussion/Spoilers)

[Hibiki]

Wow, I didn't think my thread would get such a response!
I love the way Land draws! It's so real!
However, the point is taken that maybe powerfull doen not equate strength, but instead is composed of several elements.
Doom does make mistakes, he even admitted it! HE is the one that caused the accident!
Another question I have is how did Doom (Reed's mind) get to the Baxter building so fast! The team was using the fantasticar, but I remember that Doom shot it down way back, so he may have repaired it.
I know we will see the Zombie U again in the future...the fans love it!
The goat legs did suck! I hope the Doom face Land drew becomes the norm, it is amazing!

Yeah the first face look too much like ultron. And it wasn't creepy or spine tickeling when you saw his face.

 

[TheManWithoutFear]

However, the point is taken that maybe powerfull doen not equate strength, but instead is composed of several elements.

That is the point. Doom is not only powerful because of strength but because of everything else. His intelligence, his willingness to use his powers so that he can get what he wants, his mix of magic and technology, and the physical transformation that took place during the accident.

Another question I have is how did Doom (Reed's mind) get to the Baxter building so fast! The team was using the fantasticar, but I remember that Doom shot it down way back, so he may have repaired it.

Are you referring to when Doom shot down the car in the 2nd arc? The 2nd arc!? Now Doom owns one of the technologically advanced and economically powerful countries in the world. You don't think he has anything to transport him? Read between the lines.

 

[Hellsbuttmonkey]

That was an awesome issue. The whole Doom 'sacrificing' himself to save the world is exactly how Doom would act, in that he could never let Reed get one better than him. Doom taking out the Frightful Four was wicked as well.

 

[vintsukka]

Doom does make mistakes, he even admitted it! HE is the one that caused the accident!

When did he admit that?

 

[searzy]

In issue 32, when the alien didn't go back into the N-zone.

 

[Mr_Thing30]

Where to start.... It was a "ok" book.. but like most everyone here it was a tad forced. Zombie ideas usually never work out well, but gave it a try to like it. Then the squid thing, It just kept getting over done, how many old F4 ideas can you shove into a story? I would of been alot more happier if for once they could of focused on Doom or Namor for more then one book. Really get into what makes these guys tick & why the F4 stand opposed to them. Lately it seems as though its a matter of who they can toss on the cover.

My Posts tend to ramble forgive me.

 

[vintsukka]

In issue 32, when the alien didn't go back into the N-zone.

Ok, by accident I thought you meant the original accident where they got their powers.

Sure, Doom says he made a mistake but it could be that he's just playing his part and that's what he planned all along.

 

[Sacred&Profane]

Where to start.... It was a "ok" book.. but like most everyone here it was a tad forced.

I haven't heard many people say forced, but I have heard many say rushed. There is a difference between the two.

Zombie ideas usually never work out well, but gave it a try to like it. Then the squid thing, It just kept getting over done, how many old F4 ideas can you shove into a story? I would of been alot more happier if for once they could of focused on Doom or Namor for more then one book. Really get into what makes these guys tick & why the F4 stand opposed to them.

Er..uh...
Namor had a 3-book long arc that showed what made him tick, and gave a good reason for the F4 to hate him.
Doom has has already had an entire arc early on in the series, as well as an appearence in the first. As well 3-issue long arc that featured him and fleshed him out a little better.

Lately it seems as though its a matter of who they can toss on the cover.

I think you may have Millar confused with Bendis. Millar seems to be putting effort into the Ultimizations he makes, setting up future stories while telling his own. Over the past 12, we've had 4 connected-yet-self contained stories that made up one large arc, each with its own villian.
I don't see how that is a matter of who they can toss on the cover.

 

[Ultimate Quicksilver]

And Millar ultimizations are actually cool and the characters are different from the 616 universe
Bendis is like "Ok, lets make him younger and put a leather jacket."

 

[Thor]

And Millar ultimizations are actually cool and the characters are different from the 616 universe
Bendis is like "Ok, lets make him younger and put a leather jacket."

I assume you are talking about Wolverine. If that is the case than I have to ask, why do you want him changed? I am sure they could have changed somethings but would you really want him to lose his old awesomeness?

I like many of Bendis' Ultimizations including Green Goblin, The Rhino, Venom, and so on. The one I don't like so far is Scorpion because it seems that he will only be used in this arc. But I guess I will have to see after the Clone Saga is over....

 

[Sacred&Profane]

I assume you are talking about Wolverine. If that is the case than I have to ask, why do you want him changed? I am sure they could have changed somethings but would you really want him to lose his old awesomeness?

I like many of Bendis' Ultimizations including Green Goblin, The Rhino, Venom, and so on. The one I don't like so far is Scorpion because it seems that he will only be used in this arc. But I guess I will have to see after the Clone Saga is over....

Um. Millar was the one who Ultimized Wolverine first, in UXM. And Wolverine is an example of a good Ultimization- he's still Wolverine, with slight differences that make more interesting to the target audience. Other than physical (his height and hair), Ultimate Wolverine is more sadistic, with a much less contrieved history. He's more on an anti-hero than 616 Wolverine nowadays.

Most of Bendis' earlier Ultimizations weren't that bad. Unfourtunatly, he does seem to be Ultimizing for the sake of Ultimizing. Ultimate Deadpool, Scorpion, and Vulture are examples of wasted Ultimizations.

Then again...
This is about UFF#32, and I think I've said all I can about how much I like it. We probably shouldn't discuss Bendis' form of Ultimization here.

 

[DIrishB]

Firts of all, when did Victor become so knowledgable in the Mystic arts?

Probalby in the year and a half to two years since we last saw him (in Ultimate time), he's had not much else to do besides build up Latveria into a world power and study Magic.

Second, there is no way Doom is the most powerfull character in the Ultimate Universe?

Is that a question or a statement? And why can't he be? 616 Doom was the most powerful being in the universe for a short time during the Secret Wars. I see no reason Ultimate Doom shouldn't play the patriarchal bad guy, more powerful than any others.

Since Reed has a ever growing mind, did he manage to read all the books Doom had?

That hasn't been said.

Victor spent his whole childhood being versed in the legacy of Dracula. I wouldn't be surprised at all if he achieved significant mystical acumen by the time he hit puberty. Just because he didn't display his mystical prowess when he was in a scientific think tank doesn't mean he didn't possess it.

Exactly.

Also, he's since acquired all the libraries and other resources of Latveria. Just because the country's financially down on its luck doesn't mean it's lacking for esoteric artifacts and libraries.

Exactly x2.

What defines a powerful character? I'd say humanity's most powerful assets are our will to power and our thirst for discovery. Doom has both in spades. While Thor may have the power of the gods, Doom has the tenacity to achieve what he desires, no matter the consequences. Personally, I love the idea that this disgustingly powerful, alien entity sees Doom as its greatest vessel, becausehe has the resolve to do whatever it takes. In some twisted way, he represents the pinnacle of humanity.

Exactly for 3!

Also, if Millar didn't want to lose the goat legs, he should have reminded Breitweiser (the guy who drew pages 2-3). The 'flashback' scene with their swapping bodies shows Reed-possessed Doom in a kneeling position and obviously having normal legs.

Not true. Just remember that his goat legs have two seperate joints...therefore there's one capable of bending in the way required to kneel...besides, haven't you ever seen a goat lay down? They bend their knees in exactly the same way to do so.

You guys don't appreciate the character that Doom actually is. You don't think he's a strong man on a level of power and intelligence? You don't think the transformation uped that level? You think he's just another weak archrival that poses no threat? Maybe Millar didn't do such a great job portraying him then.

I think Millar did a great job at portraying him, as I got a true sense of just how larger than life Doom really is courtesy of this arc.

The goat legs did suck!

Dude, the goat legs rule. Get with it. Psssshhhhh!

 

[Zombipanda]

Dude, the goat legs rule. Get with it. Psssshhhhh!

He's right, you know.

Besides just looking wicked awesome, the goat legs are an indication that the N-Zone accident may not be as random as we might want to believe. Instead of just a freak mutation, there may be a purpose to it happening.

And that's sick-nasty, as the kids say.

 

[Hibiki]

Goat Legs are odd and different but so is Doom. So I think this goes with his personality. Screw Quesada if he doesn't like them. If you write a good story, don't fix what ain't broke.

 

[Ultimate MJ]

Um. Millar was the one who Ultimized Wolverine first, in UXM.

Maybe Im wrong on this, but I think it was actually Bendis that ultimized Wolvie first, in Ult Team Up.

 

[MaxwellSmart]

Goat Legs are odd and different but so is Doom. So I think this goes with his personality. Screw Quesada if he doesn't like them. If you write a good story, don't fix what ain't broke.

You know I find it interesting that one guy was created with goat legs has shaped his character so much. I don't think it's terribly important whether or not he does. So far they haven't been shown to serve any purpose. Everyone seems to fixating on it because it's one of the biggest changes from their 616 counterpart, which is kind of sad.

 

[Sacred&Profane]

Maybe Im wrong on this, but I think it was actually Bendis that ultimized Wolvie first, in Ult Team Up.

Ultimate X-men came in February 2001, the first issue of team-up came in April 2001.

 

[Thor]

Hmm....I have a question for both Ultimate Quicksilver and Sacred & Profane:

Quicksilver: You said something about how Bendis only Ultimized a character by giving him a leather jacket. Who were you talking about?

Sacred: Whats wrong with Ultimate Vulture? I am sure he will come back and he looked so darn cool.

That is all man.

And the goat legs were cool.

 

[Sacred&Profane]

Hmm....I have 2 questions for you Sacred & Profane:

1) You said something about how Bendis only Ultimized a character by giving him a leather jacket. Who were you talking about?

2) Whats wrong with Ultimate Vulture? I am sure he will come back and he looked so darn cool.

That is all man.

And the goat legs were cool.

1) That was Ultimate Quicksilver, not me.
2) He was a throwaway Ultimization who probably won't appear again. He was just a hired hand inside of a suit, no real thought put into it. Bendis could have used a D-lister and have gotten the same effect, just without the moment of 'OH COOL ITS ULTIMATE VULTURE!!"

Yes, yes they were.

 

[Thor]

Crap, I redirect that question to Ultimate Quicksilver. Sorry I am really tired today...I can't think correctly.

And Bendis has to use Vulture again....why wouldn't he?