Ultimatum series discussion [spoilers]

[thee great one]

Re: Ultimatum discussion (Spoilers & Stuff)

I read it, it wasn't full of plot holes like Ultimates 3.


Except for the ones already there from the series, no new ones.


It was crap. I miss the Ultimate Universe.

 

[Bass]

Re: Ultimatum discussion (Spoilers & Stuff)

I really miss Ultimate Thor, most of all.

 

[Dr.Strangefate]

Re: Ultimatum discussion (Spoilers & Stuff)

The real Ultimate Thor needs to be the first thing Millar fixes when he comes back to the Ultimate Universe.

 

[Ice]

Re: Ultimatum discussion (Spoilers & Stuff)

The real Ultimate Thor needs to be the first thing Millar fixes when he comes back to the Ultimate Universe.

I disagree.

He needs to fix your double-posting first so I won't. Tee hee.

 

[Dr.Strangefate]

Re: Ultimatum discussion (Spoilers & Stuff)

What do you mean, double-posting?

EDIT: I tried to do it on purpose, but it didn't work :-(

 

[Goodwill]

Re: Ultimatum discussion (Spoilers & Stuff)

Guys, it's been one issue and you're saying it's just as bad as five issues of Ultimates 3?

 

[DIrishB]

Re: Ultimatum discussion (Spoilers & Stuff)

Fury being a super soldier doesn't contradict anything either. He's said in UO that he doesn't want to be known as a super soldier, that he wants to be left alone. So, anything that Fury said to Peter about not knowing his father or his schooling in India is all a lie. He's lied before, it's not like Fury lying is out of character.

Are you ****ing kidding me? Fury being a super-soldier created the biggest ****ing plot-hole in existance. Remember during Ultimate Origins and all of Ultimates 1 when Fury is trying to replicate the super-soldier serum? All he had to do was give them some of his blood! And if he didn't want anyone to know it was his, he could've come up with a bull**** excuse for acquiring it. THE WHOLE REASON FOR THE EXISTANCE OF SUPER-HEROES IN THE ULTIMATE UNIVERSE IS TIED TO THE SUPER SOLDIER SERUM, AND FURY HAD IT PUMPING THROUGH HIS VEINS ALL THAT TIME.

Does that really make sense to you? In any conceivable way?

Its quite obvious Bendis pulled that out of his *** at the last minute and didn't bother to go back and see how it'd work with the previously established continuity, despite the fact he wrote a large portion of that established continuity. Its ****ing stupid...there's no other term for it.

And now, Loeb is taking that stupid-*** ball and running with it.

*sigh*

Guys, it's been one issue and you're saying it's just as bad as five issues of Ultimates 3?

Whats the number of issues have to do with anything? Its all terrible...its a simple comparison really. And no, I don't think its premature to say the entirety of Ultimatum will suck...it was a safe bet when only the first issue of Ultimates 3 was out.

 

[Dr.Strangefate]

Re: Ultimatum discussion (Spoilers & Stuff)

Are you ****ing kidding me? Fury being a super-soldier created the biggest ****ing plot-hole in existance. Remember during Ultimate Origins and all of Ultimates 1 when Fury is trying to replicate the super-soldier serum? All he had to do was give them some of his blood! And if he didn't want anyone to know it was his, he could've come up with a bull**** excuse for acquiring it. THE WHOLE REASON FOR THE EXISTANCE OF SUPER-HEROES IN THE ULTIMATE UNIVERSE IS TIED TO THE SUPER SOLDIER SERUM, AND FURY HAD IT PUMPING THROUGH HIS VEINS ALL THAT TIME.

Does that really make sense to you? In any conceivable way?

Its quite obvious Bendis pulled that out of his *** at the last minute and didn't bother to go back and see how it'd work with the previously established continuity, despite the fact he wrote a large portion of that established continuity. Its ****ing stupid...there's no other term for it.

Bingo.

 

[E]

Re: Ultimatum discussion (Spoilers & Stuff)

Are you ****ing kidding me? Fury being a super-soldier created the biggest ****ing plot-hole in existance. Remember during Ultimate Origins and all of Ultimates 1 when Fury is trying to replicate the super-soldier serum? All he had to do was give them some of his blood! And if he didn't want anyone to know it was his, he could've come up with a bull**** excuse for acquiring it. THE WHOLE REASON FOR THE EXISTANCE OF SUPER-HEROES IN THE ULTIMATE UNIVERSE IS TIED TO THE SUPER SOLDIER SERUM, AND FURY HAD IT PUMPING THROUGH HIS VEINS ALL THAT TIME.

Does that really make sense to you? In any conceivable way?

Its quite obvious Bendis pulled that out of his *** at the last minute and didn't bother to go back and see how it'd work with the previously established continuity, despite the fact he wrote a large portion of that established continuity. Its ****ing stupid...there's no other term for it.

*applause*

 

[Void.M]

Re: Ultimatum discussion (Spoilers & Stuff)

What i don't get is why they want to kill half of the Ultimate characters off. Why do they think it's a good idea?

 

[Sacred&Profane]

Re: Ultimatum discussion (Spoilers & Stuff)

Why do they think it's a good idea?

We've asked that question so many times that it has lost all meaning.

 

[thee great one]

Re: Ultimatum discussion (Spoilers & Stuff)

Because it needs to add that end of the world drama.

 

[Gemini]

Re: Ultimatum discussion (Spoilers & Stuff)

What i don't get is why they want to kill half of the Ultimate characters off. Why do they think it's a good idea?

You see it will cause a craptacular cascade of **** energy and cause the Ultimate Universe to collapse into a quantum singularity of such unimaginable horror, that it will have to be hidden in the only place noone would ever think to look.

In a grave underneath the rotting corpse of Bendis's writing talent.

They would have hidden it under Loeb's rotting writing talent, but alas he never had any to begin with.

 

[PureMitch]

Re: Ultimatum discussion (Spoilers & Stuff)

Are you ****ing kidding me? Fury being a super-soldier created the biggest ****ing plot-hole in existance. Remember during Ultimate Origins and all of Ultimates 1 when Fury is trying to replicate the super-soldier serum? All he had to do was give them some of his blood! And if he didn't want anyone to know it was his, he could've come up with a bull**** excuse for acquiring it. THE WHOLE REASON FOR THE EXISTANCE OF SUPER-HEROES IN THE ULTIMATE UNIVERSE IS TIED TO THE SUPER SOLDIER SERUM, AND FURY HAD IT PUMPING THROUGH HIS VEINS ALL THAT TIME.

Does that really make sense to you? In any conceivable way?

Okay...but even without him being a super soldier...why couldn't he have replicated the super soldier serum from Steve Rogers' blood after he thawed him out?

 

[Dr.Strangefate]

Re: Ultimatum discussion (Spoilers & Stuff)

That's why it was so important that they found Steve Rogers... They thought he would solve all the problems. They would have known that was not the case if Fury was around.

 

[Mattimeo84]

Re: Ultimatum discussion (Spoilers & Stuff)

could it be that like rodgers, fury's blood didn't help at all, hence why finding cap was so important.

 

[vmenge]

Re: Ultimatum discussion (Spoilers & Stuff)

Are you ****ing kidding me? Fury being a super-soldier created the biggest ****ing plot-hole in existance. Remember during Ultimate Origins and all of Ultimates 1 when Fury is trying to replicate the super-soldier serum? All he had to do was give them some of his blood! And if he didn't want anyone to know it was his, he could've come up with a bull**** excuse for acquiring it. THE WHOLE REASON FOR THE EXISTANCE OF SUPER-HEROES IN THE ULTIMATE UNIVERSE IS TIED TO THE SUPER SOLDIER SERUM, AND FURY HAD IT PUMPING THROUGH HIS VEINS ALL THAT TIME.

Does that really make sense to you? In any conceivable way?

Its quite obvious Bendis pulled that out of his *** at the last minute and didn't bother to go back and see how it'd work with the previously established continuity, despite the fact he wrote a large portion of that established continuity. Its ****ing stupid...there's no other term for it.

And now, Loeb is taking that stupid-*** ball and running with it.

I kinda disagree. I don't think Bendis thought of how it would work with the previously established continuity, but it doesn't really screw it up. I'm sure they could come up with a plausible explanation for that (or not)

 

[mike3717]

Re: Ultimatum discussion (Spoilers & Stuff)

That's why it was so important that they found Steve Rogers... They thought he would solve all the problems. They would have known that was not the case if Fury was around.

At least Fury would have known that wasn't the case. But apparently in Ultimates 1 Fury forgot he was a super soldier also. :roll:

 

[Goodwill]

Re: Ultimatum discussion (Spoilers & Stuff)

How is Loeb doing anything to Fury yet?

 

[Captain Canuck]

Re: Ultimatum discussion (Spoilers & Stuff)

Are you ****ing kidding me? Fury being a super-soldier created the biggest ****ing plot-hole in existance. Remember during Ultimate Origins and all of Ultimates 1 when Fury is trying to replicate the super-soldier serum? All he had to do was give them some of his blood! And if he didn't want anyone to know it was his, he could've come up with a bull**** excuse for acquiring it. THE WHOLE REASON FOR THE EXISTANCE OF SUPER-HEROES IN THE ULTIMATE UNIVERSE IS TIED TO THE SUPER SOLDIER SERUM, AND FURY HAD IT PUMPING THROUGH HIS VEINS ALL THAT TIME.

well, i gree that it was a dumb idea, but in Ultimate Origins, Fury does give Banner, Parker, Pym, and Storm a sample of his blood so i don't really think it creates a plot hole, just unnecessary shaky continuity due to a retcon.
The biggest problems it creates is why didn't his eye grow back? and is that how his arm grew back after Ultimates 2? and if so why did no one notice?

I think that if they develop the idea of the mutant gene being a contagious virus and tie it in with the legacy virus plot thread left dangling by Kirkman

and if Bendis writes an awesome story about what really happened to Peter's parents that ends in a show down between Spidey and Fury

then Ultimate Origins won't have been a complete loss (the only problems left - i think - will be the timeline stuff with Charles and Erik meeting and going to the savage land)

but i know those are two big ifs
...
all of a sudden i just realized that my expectations have been lowered so much that I'm satisfied if I can think of ways to explain the plot holes and continuity errors. That's sad. Forget it, Everything except Ultimate Spider-Man has absolutely sucked for a long time.
(Ultimate Human was good too)

 

[Eightball]

Re: Ultimatum discussion (Spoilers & Stuff)

well, i gree that it was a dumb idea, but in Ultimate Origins, Fury does give Banner, Parker, Pym, and Storm a sample of his blood so i don't really think it creates a plot hole, just unnecessary shaky continuity due to a retcon.
The biggest problems it creates is why didn't his eye grow back? and is that how his arm grew back after Ultimates 2? and if so why did no one notice?

I think that if they develop the idea of the mutant gene being a contagious virus and tie it in with the legacy virus plot thread left dangling by Kirkman

and if Bendis writes an awesome story about what really happened to Peter's parents that ends in a show down between Spidey and Fury

then Ultimate Origins won't have been a complete loss (the only problems left - i think - will be the timeline stuff with Charles and Erik meeting and going to the savage land)

but i know those are two big ifs
...
all of a sudden i just realized that my expectations have been lowered so much that I'm satisfied if I can think of ways to explain the plot holes and continuity errors. That's sad. Forget it, Everything except Ultimate Spider-Man has absolutely sucked for a long time.
(Ultimate Human was good too)

we also got to remember that in the Ultimates annual, the Serum that they reverse engineered from Cap failed as well. Fury and Cap have been and still ar ethe only succesfull recipients of the Serum, the code still has not been cracked even with Cap being around again.

what we get is a cool origin for the Hulk, and a massive gaping plot hole on Pete's parents

 

[DIrishB]

Re: Ultimatum discussion (Spoilers & Stuff)

What i don't get is why they want to kill half of the Ultimate characters off. Why do they think it's a good idea?

Shock value.

Okay...but even without him being a super soldier...why couldn't he have replicated the super soldier serum from Steve Rogers' blood after he thawed him out?

could it be that like rodgers, fury's blood didn't help at all, hence why finding cap was so important.

It'd just be nice for them to explain that in the comics, instead of ignoring it and leaving the fans to fill in the copious blanks.

I kinda disagree. I don't think Bendis thought of how it would work with the previously established continuity, but it doesn't really screw it up. I'm sure they could come up with a plausible explanation for that (or not)

Um...did you not read my post? It basically negates Fury's motivation for finding Cap in the first place during Ultimates. See below:

At least Fury would have known that wasn't the case. But apparently in Ultimates 1 Fury forgot he was a super soldier also.

See?

How is Loeb doing anything to Fury yet?

He isn't. Bendis is. Thats what we're talking about.

well, i gree that it was a dumb idea, but in Ultimate Origins, Fury does give Banner, Parker, Pym, and Storm a sample of his blood so i don't really think it creates a plot hole, just unnecessary shaky continuity due to a retcon.
The biggest problems it creates is why didn't his eye grow back? and is that how his arm grew back after Ultimates 2? and if so why did no one notice?

However, Bendis completely dropped the ball in terms of explaining him giving them that blood sample, and NOTHING happening with it other than the Hulk. He didn't explain (or attempt to) WHY they couldn't replicate it, and again, it negates Fury's motivations for finding Cap in Ultimates 1.

I think that if they develop the idea of the mutant gene being a contagious virus and tie it in with the legacy virus plot thread left dangling by Kirkman

and if Bendis writes an awesome story about what really happened to Peter's parents that ends in a show down between Spidey and Fury

then Ultimate Origins won't have been a complete loss (the only problems left - i think - will be the timeline stuff with Charles and Erik meeting and going to the savage land)

but i know those are two big ifs
...
all of a sudden i just realized that my expectations have been lowered so much that I'm satisfied if I can think of ways to explain the plot holes and continuity errors. That's sad. Forget it, Everything except Ultimate Spider-Man has absolutely sucked for a long time.
(Ultimate Human was good too)

It'll get better. Millar's coming back. It'll be like a second Golden Age of the Ultimate comics...Look to the light...Look to the light!!

we also got to remember that in the Ultimates annual, the Serum that they reverse engineered from Cap failed as well. Fury and Cap have been and still ar ethe only succesfull recipients of the Serum, the code still has not been cracked even with Cap being around again.

Ah, that was it. Thanks for pointing that out.

what we get is a cool origin for the Hulk, and a massive gaping plot hole on Pete's parents

Yep.

 

[E]

Ugh. This was awful.

I can't stand that constant use of people's names by the person speaking. It's idiotic and so unnatural.

"They will pay the Ultimate Price" - it's lost it's luster, Marvel. Time for a new slogan.

 

[Joe Kalicki]

I don't think anyone died yet.

 

[Dr.Strangefate]

Apparently like 5 X-Men did.

 

[Joe Kalicki]

Apparently like 5 X-Men did.

I'll believe it when they aren't back by the end of the series.

 

[Bass]

Amusingly, I told my friend today the Black Panther/Captain America thing.

He got out of the car when I mentioned Fury isn't even in the same universe anymore.

I laughed so hard.

 

[Random]

Amusingly, I told my friend today the Black Panther/Captain America thing.

He got out of the car when I mentioned Fury isn't even in the same universe anymore.

I laughed so hard.

It'd be funny if it weren't true

 

[Drunken Pickle]

So... Anyone been reading 4th letter's version of Ultimatum?

"GOD DAMN YOU, HANCOCK!" :-D

 

[Random]

So... Anyone been reading 4th letter's version of Ultimatum?

"GOD DAMN YOU, HANCOCK!" :-D

":It's a Splash page!"

"My god the House of Ribs... GONE!"