Miracleman series discussion (spoilers)
- Thread starter Bass
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Bass
Nexus of the World
*slaps head* Duh! Why is it I never really noticed the similarities? They are very similar. I don't know why I didn't consciously tie the two together.
Miracleman is similar, but it goes a lot, lot further than Sentry. Miracleman is just a lot better, and the origin is far more insightful. Sentry is kind of like a mini-Miracleman. In size, scope, and insight. Still good though, but it's not Miracleman.
Miracleman is similar, but it goes a lot, lot further than Sentry. Miracleman is just a lot better, and the origin is far more insightful. Sentry is kind of like a mini-Miracleman. In size, scope, and insight. Still good though, but it's not Miracleman.
Bass said:
Right, exactly - that's exactly how I saw it. I don't know if the memory loss is an ongoing theme in Miracleman, but I kind of get the idea it isn't, whereas Sentry focuses heavily on it.
There are also some shared themes with Watchmen from what I understand, but I'm nowhere near that far yet.
I hope to get a couple more issues in tonight.
lease:
Bass
Nexus of the World
Last two on their way. And then, that's it. :cry:
If I ever get round to reading the Gaiman issues, I'll offer 'em for e-mailing too.
If I ever get round to reading the Gaiman issues, I'll offer 'em for e-mailing too.
Pandrio
Well-Known Member
I just lost an eBay auction for issues 1-11 and 23-24 in the final seconds. My maximum bid was $30 and the person who won got them for $30.06. :evil:
:cry::cry:
:cry::cry:
Of course the chances are slim to none, but Wikipeidia talks about the possibility of Marvel reprinting it all after the whole McFarlane and Gaiman thing ends. They say it better than I can:Bass said:
Wikipedia said:
That's one of the great things about Joe Q. He is great at making concessions and working with artists. Marvel's benefit notwithstanding, why wouldn't they want to be on the good side of these bigger talents like Neil Gaiman? He's good at that, and it only helps Marvel. That's one thing I hope he never gets away from.
ProjectX2
Don't expect me to take you with me when I go to s
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I've finally got time to read this whole series. I'm up to #9.
It's great. The first two issues are the best. I probably could have done without the graphic childbirth later on, though.
And that quote at the start... is incredible.
It's great. The first two issues are the best. I probably could have done without the graphic childbirth later on, though.
And that quote at the start... is incredible.
Bass said:
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David Blue
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I read the whole Miracleman series as it came out. Yes, it is very outstanding. I lost all the comics in a move - I have found that only trades have a fighting chance to survive repeated house-moving - but I remember them well.
"Johnny?"
"Afterwards you can give her to the men."
"Steppenwolf."
"You can go now."
"I'm sorry. They'd say I was going soft, wouldn't they?"
"You can't talk your way out of everything."
"We were impressed."
Winter's opinion of the blueness of the sky.
Abrupt prayers.
"Johnny?"
"Afterwards you can give her to the men."
"Steppenwolf."
"You can go now."
"I'm sorry. They'd say I was going soft, wouldn't they?"
"You can't talk your way out of everything."
"We were impressed."
Winter's opinion of the blueness of the sky.
Abrupt prayers.
ProjectX2
Don't expect me to take you with me when I go to s
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I still think the first 2 issues are probably some of the best comic book issues ever written.
I agree.
Kid Miracle Man is one of the best villains in comics history.
Thanks for bumping this. I need to finish this series.
Same here. They are bad. I'm talking 12 or 13 through 15...16 turned out OK.
It took me forever but I finally finished this last night and like I was telling Ice, it blew my mind. The carnage scenes in #15 were horrible. The utopia set up in #16 was at the same time beautiul, awe-inspiring...and terrifying.
This was one of the best things I've ever read. Better than Watchmen.
I'll get to the Gaiman issues soon.
moonmaster
Without him, all of you would be lost souls roamin
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Ya know, my opinion on Miracleman has changed quite a bit.
It's still incredibly well-written, but like so much other Moore stuff, I think there's just a ... coldness to it. It's beautifully written, but I think it's very hard to connect to. And you don't even realize it until long after you've read it because you're so dazzled by Moore's mastery of comic book writing that you don't even notice.
Miracleman is obviously a realization of Nietzche's "Thus Spoke Zarathustra". It is quoted in the beginning. Miracleman is the story of man's ascension to overman. The physical, intellectual, and emotional transformation of Man into God.
But the book follows this idea to a T, meaning the emotional part is definitely included. Miracleman forgets about what is human, about the emotions that we feel and the things that we do. A god does not lower himself to such activities. This is why he must leave his wife, take over the world. Miracleman become the epitomy of the rational, flawless, and all-powerful being. This is why I felt an unbearable twinge of sadness when Mike Moran "committs suicide".
He suddenly becomes a completely unrelateable and uninteresting character.
As pretty as Alan Moore's words make Miracleman and his new world look, there's something awful about the idea that humanity will one day reach perfection. Our mistakes, our flaws, our tiny imperfections. These are the things that make us beautiful. Perfection is ugly and apathetic.
This is one of the things that I loved about Promethea. Look at the ending of it. It's like the reverse of Miracleman.
For Sophie at least, that's what eternal pefection is.
And for me, it's a much more satisfying end.
It's still incredibly well-written, but like so much other Moore stuff, I think there's just a ... coldness to it. It's beautifully written, but I think it's very hard to connect to. And you don't even realize it until long after you've read it because you're so dazzled by Moore's mastery of comic book writing that you don't even notice.
Miracleman is obviously a realization of Nietzche's "Thus Spoke Zarathustra". It is quoted in the beginning. Miracleman is the story of man's ascension to overman. The physical, intellectual, and emotional transformation of Man into God.
But the book follows this idea to a T, meaning the emotional part is definitely included. Miracleman forgets about what is human, about the emotions that we feel and the things that we do. A god does not lower himself to such activities. This is why he must leave his wife, take over the world. Miracleman become the epitomy of the rational, flawless, and all-powerful being. This is why I felt an unbearable twinge of sadness when Mike Moran "committs suicide".
He suddenly becomes a completely unrelateable and uninteresting character.
As pretty as Alan Moore's words make Miracleman and his new world look, there's something awful about the idea that humanity will one day reach perfection. Our mistakes, our flaws, our tiny imperfections. These are the things that make us beautiful. Perfection is ugly and apathetic.
This is one of the things that I loved about Promethea. Look at the ending of it. It's like the reverse of Miracleman.
I felt that same twinge of sadness that I felt for Mike Moran when Promethea goes to see Sophie's boyfriend to "say goodbye". It felt like Promethea would go the same way as Miracleman. But of course, it didn't. Instead of solemnly surrendering her life to Promethea, Sophie just mutually divorces herself from this higher force. And she's happy about it. She's happy to be a human being. She loves to be able to experience life with all it's pains and all it's joys, she's happy with herself. And the second-to-last issue ends with Sophie and her boyfriend in each others arms, and I'm finally satisfied.
And for me, it's a much more satisfying end.
Hmm. I completely agree with the unrelatable bit, but uninteresting? Him becoming unrelatable like that only heightened the tragedy that became of...everything. It was the exact opposite that the reader should feel when reading that outcome. Liz's leaving Mike almost made MM into a villain. Especially considering how the series began, I thought it was fascinating.
Dr.Strangefate
He Sees You When You're Sleeping. He Knows When Yo
I agree to a degree, and I think that's why from the end of Moore's run, Gaiman focused on other characters... It brought the humanity back into the comic... Even the Silver Age, where Miracleman starts playing a major part again, He's not the main character, but rather subsidiary to Young Miracleman.
Bass
Nexus of the World
I just think it's incredible that the current trend of mainstream superhero comics are essentially, poorer versions of this title and Watchmen, which are now almost 25 years old...
Yes.
And that's the good stuff.
Sentry was one of my favorite characters until I read Miracleman and realized it's a MM ripoff.
Random
Didn't **** any of those *****es
I thought Sentry was already a Superman rip off
ProjectX2
Don't expect me to take you with me when I go to s
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Essentially most characters are rip offs, until the proper writer comes along and adds depth to the character. Marvelman was just a Captain Marvel rip off, until Alan Moore came along and added depth to the character, and made it a very good piece of comic book literature.
